Changes to WHS in April 2024

[wjemather]

Of course it's in use... but valid question about how they do the pre-play admin. I'm reporting what I see when I hand over my money....

I will ask...

Begs the question about the use of expensive perspex boards in the first place

The only requirement was displaying the CH chart. A simple A3 sheet of paper (laminated) would have sufficed.

Clubs should have factored in potential/inevitable changes making them redundant, e.g. re-rating. My club was due re-rating within 3 years but still chose to purchase a panel "because it looks better".

 

[wjemather]

This was exactly what happened in Scotland, nobody realised the implications and all the boards used rounded PH at every club. Then folks were totally confused when their PH was less when they entered their scores.

That only illustrates failed member/golfer education achieved by clubs in your area and/or Scottish Golf.

 

[D-S]

It still begs the question that if we have ‘embraced digital technology’ why have they changed 4BB matchplay and Foursomes matchplay to the old way of calculating and using rounded Course Handicaps. No rationale has been given for this move. The only logic I have heard (not from EG) is that players will be able to calculate it themselves from rounded boards, thereby maintaining and encouraging players to use boards and calculate playing handicaps from them.

Also if people are using % lookup tables (which a lot of clubs will have) and they are created from the portal - is this machine precision?

 

[Genu9]

Of course it's in use... but valid question about how they do the pre-play admin. I'm reporting what I see when I hand over my money....

I will ask...

Begs the question about the use of expensive perspex boards in the first place

James Luke, England Golf's Head of Handicapping advocates the scrapping of boards, so you're in good company.

“This is something I want to try and get out to golf clubs. We don’t need the boards anymore, essentially,” he said. “They aren’t a mandatory requirement for clubs to have.

“So, I want golf clubs to seriously have a think about whether or not they need their handicap boards. If they do, that’s absolutely fine. [unquote]

 

[Plus4]

Intelligent Golf (App and Web) conveniently displays CH AND 95% PH for all tees at your club, presumably this will remain the case from 1st April? The numbers will change but the information will still give players what they need. I also assume other ISVs provide something similar. I did suggest to my club that they could do away with the boards but it has fallen on deaf ears
When playing an away course CH is often the only thing of interest unless you're in an organised comp and then, if it is being organised properly, you will be told your PH.

 

[wjemather]

It still begs the question that if we have ‘embraced digital technology’ why have they changed 4BB matchplay and Foursomes matchplay to the old way of calculating and using rounded Course Handicaps. No rationale has been given for this move. The only logic I have heard (not from EG) is that players will be able to calculate it themselves from rounded boards, thereby maintaining and encouraging players to use boards and calculate playing handicaps from them.

Also if people are using % lookup tables (which a lot of clubs will have) and they are created from the portal - is this machine precision?

It's simply so that players can easily do the calculations on the tee for match play, as they have always done.

 

[D-S]

It's simply so that players can easily do the calculations on the tee for match play, as they have always done.

Using the boards on the tee (“as they have always done”) that EG don’t recommend clubs having?

 

[wjemather]

Using the boards on the tee (“as they have always done”) that EG don’t recommend clubs having?

Saying they are not required is not the same as recommending not having them.

EG (and James Luke in particular) are certainly pushing technology solutions - but few clubs are ready for that level of reliance on apps, QR codes, mobile devices, etc.

 

[Genu9]

I'm with James Luke on this one regarding moving away from physical Boards. Yes they look nice and serve a purpose to a degree, but they are not needed.

Back in January I posted an example of a Board Table that could be converted into a physical board if necessary. However it was designed specifically to be used on a fixed or moble device, with the option to print onto whatever size piece of paper suits.

It's gone through a few updates and enhancements since January. Importantly, all the handicaps are based on the 'unrounded' CH.
This is a screenshot of part of the tables.



If you want to see how these work on a portable device you can download the full file from this link.

Board Table Demo

These Tables have been added to the 'Backend' of my Handicap Lookup Spreadsheet as an enhancement so that members can choose how they want to establish their PH.

 

[wjemather]

A sure fire way of confusing people is to display a chart with 90% Playing Handicaps (calculated from unrounded Course Handicaps) that are only used for Par/Bogey formats that are (almost) never played.

 

[Genu9]

A sure fire way of confusing people is to display a chart with 90% Playing Handicaps (calculated from unrounded Course Handicaps) that are only used for Par/Bogey formats that are (almost) never played.

It's a table that is used by US for formats WE play where 90% is used. You are making the assumption that everyone is stupid and will look up the wrong column.

 

[wjemather]

It's a table that is used by US for formats WE play where 90% is used. You are making the assumption that everyone is stupid and will look up the wrong column.

It was only yesterday that your man Stan was scratching his head in confusion over a simple Course Handicap chart. You can't have it both ways.

I also don't believe that you play a glut of par/bogey comps.

 

[Alan Clifford]

In an ideal world you'd be given a card with all the gubbins printed on, like you get at my other club.

When a proshop opens a round for you here is South Africa, you get a slip with all the course handicaps for all the tees. If it's a competition at 85%, the playing handicap is on there too.

 

[rosecott]

It was only yesterday that your man Stan was scratching his head in confusion over a simple Course Handicap chart. You can't have it both ways.

I also don't believe that you play a glut of par/bogey comps.

Bit of a generalisation - we have around 20 Bogey competitions in a year.

 

[Genu9]

It was only yesterday that your man Stan was scratching his head in confusion over a simple Course Handicap chart. You can't have it both ways.

I also don't believe that you play a glut of par/bogey comps.

Post#382
Looking at what is being offered by online Sign Suppliers they seems to be 'rounded' CH, which is no use in calculating PH using 'unrounded' CH.

I'm not having it both ways.
That's the ones that are being touted for sale to Clubs that Stan was looking at.

 

[wjemather]

Bit of a generalisation - we have around 20 Bogey competitions in a year.

Of course, but the context here is the 90% allowance, which is only applicable to 4BBB and 3-from-4 Best-Ball par/bogey.
I'd be confident is saying you don't have many, if any, of those.

 

[Swango1980]

Of course, but the context here is the 90% allowance, which is only applicable to 4BBB and 3-from-4 Best-Ball par/bogey.
I'd be confident is saying you don't have many, if any, of those.

I'd say 4BBB matchplay is very popular. Even in social groups. If we have a 4-ball, we will always play 4BBB matchplay for a side bet. So, to be honest, the only % I ever need is the 90% (as we don't use 95% in our social stableford singles play anymore), although 90% is simple to do in your head anyway.

I'd have thought most of the other % are unnecessary for most, because if you are playing in a team competition, I suspect most people are given their PH these days. And if it is done on the ISV and scores submitted after, the PH is already there.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Of course, but the context here is the 90% allowance, which is only applicable to 4BBB and 3-from-4 Best-Ball par/bogey.
I'd be confident is saying you don't have many, if any, of those.

I’m sure that 4bbb is prob one of the most popular forms of golf when players play in a fourball

Also many team opens will be 3 from 4 best ball or 2 from 4

 

[wjemather]

I'd say 4BBB matchplay is very popular. Even in social groups. If we have a 4-ball, we will always play 4BBB matchplay for a side bet. So, to be honest, the only % I ever need is the 90% (as we don't use 95% in our social stableford singles play anymore), although 90% is simple to do in your head anyway.

I'd have thought most of the other % are unnecessary for most, because if you are playing in a team competition, I suspect most people are given their PH these days. And if it is done on the ISV and scores submitted after, the PH is already there.

Which precisely my point.

From April, strokes received in 4BBB match play are 90% of the difference between rounded Course Handicaps - no longer 90% Playing Handicaps and then full difference. Displaying 90% PH on a board will inevitably lead to confusion, especially while players get used to the new (old) methodology.

I’m sure that 4bbb is prob one of the most popular forms of golf when players play in a fourball

Also many team opens will be 3 from 4 best ball or 2 from 4

How many opens use par/bogey format (i.e. using the 90% Playing Handicap)? I'd guess close to zero.

 

[Swango1980]

Which precisely my point.

From April, strokes received in 4BBB match play are 90% of the difference between rounded Course Handicaps - no longer 90% Playing Handicaps and then full difference. Displaying 90% PH on a board will inevitably lead to confusion, especially while players get used to the new (old) methodology.


How many opens use par/bogey format (i.e. using the 90% Playing Handicap)? I'd guess close to zero.

O yeah, forgot they were changing that bit about again, just as we got used to the new way, now to become the old way