WHS working well for me

[Imurg]

Makes sense to keep the most recent score as the counting one?

Could be.
That means that the new score may keep my index higher or lower than it should be..
If I'm putting in, say, a card a week then it'll take 5 months to drop off..if it was my best score but all the others are in the 14 or 15 range then I'd be a shot lower.

Oh well..if thats the way it is...

 

[Swango1980]

Could be.
That means that the new score may keep my index higher or lower than it should be..
If I'm putting in, say, a card a week then it'll take 5 months to drop off..if it was my best score but all the others are in the 14 or 15 range then I'd be a shot lower.

Oh well..if thats the way it is...

Why should it not work like that? Even if it kept your old 10.5 instead of your latest, as soon as that old 10.5 dropped out of your last 20, it would simply be replaced by your latest 10.5 (assuming you didn't have 8 scores that beat it anyway). So, why do you think it would come up with a different handicap index calculation?

 

[Mandofred]

In case you do not know how to work it out

Score Differential = (113 ÷Slope Rating) x (adjusted gross score –Course Rating – (0.5 x PCC adjustment))

Hence your score differential of 8.8

It is then simply a case of seeing if this differential has become one of your 8 knocking out a score which was higher in your previous 8. It does not have to be the the 21st.

I'll assume the computer know all, but.....

The score that got dropped was an 81, score diff 10.2, slope 135, hc at time was 7.3
The score that reduced my hc was an 82, score diff 8.8, slope 124, hc at was 7.2

So.... the score the got dropped was a better score on a harder course...... I guess I just can't be bothered to figure out why, although I would have thought a better score on a harder sloped course would have taken precedence over a worse score on an easier course.

 

[Swango1980]

I'll assume the computer know all, but.....

The score that got dropped was an 81, score diff 10.2, slope 135, hc at time was 7.3
The score that reduced my hc was an 82, score diff 8.8, slope 124, hc at was 7.2

So.... the score the got dropped was a better score on a harder course...... I guess I just can't be bothered to figure out why, although I would have thought a better score on a harder sloped course would have taken precedence over a worse score on an easier course.

No, the 81 you scored was on a much easier course (or the Par was lower at least), the Course Rating was 68.8. Whereas you score of 82 was shot on a course with a course rating of 72.3 (i.e. on a course that is 3.5 shots "harder" than the course you shot 81).

You are confusing Slope Rating as the absolute difficulty of the course (many do). It is not, slope rating is only related to the relative difficulty of a course between low and high handicappers. Course Rating represents the absolute difficulty of a course.

 

[Deleted member 3432]

The real challenge is to beat the Course Rating.

You can manipulate breaking par by finding an easy short course (i.e. one with a Course Rating that is many strokes under par, and maybe a sub-100 Slope Rating). There are a few courses local to me with a CR of more than 4 under par from some of the tees.

Or alternatively beat par on a big boys course where par is lower than course rating....

Anyway, well done Depreston ?

 

[Mandofred]

No, the 81 you scored was on a much easier course (or the Par was lower at least), the Course Rating was 68.8. Whereas you score of 82 was shot on a course with a course rating of 72.3 (i.e. on a course that is 3.5 shots "harder" than the course you shot 81).

You are confusing Slope Rating as the absolute difficulty of the course (many do). It is not, slope rating is only related to the relative difficulty of a course between low and high handicappers. Course Rating represents the absolute difficulty of a course.

 

[nickjdavis]

No more increases for me for another 9 rounds

After Sundays medal, all of my best 8 are within my last 11 rounds...still that gives me plenty of opportunity to drag my index down before we hit winter . Lowest I ever was under Congu was 6.2...so a playing handicap of 6.....need to drag the index down to 5.9 in order to match my playing handicap of 2009....there's a target to aim for over the remaining months ( 8 comps realistically available to me, 11 if I took a few days off work)!!!

 

[Barking_Mad]

It does, look at your handicap record, it will show any adjustments to your gross score for handicapping purposes.

Hmm I'm very confused, probably missing something very obvious...

Recent round, hole was a par 4. I took a 9 which is the score I recorded. I had 1 shot for handicap purposes. My scorecard shows a net 8. That doesn't seem correct?

 

[wjemather]

Hmm I'm very confused, probably missing something very obvious...

Recent round, hole was a par 4. I took a 9 which is the score I recorded. I had 1 shot for handicap purposes. My scorecard shows a net 8. That doesn't seem correct?

It was a nett 8.

It counts as a 7 for handicapping (adjusted to net double bogey), but it is still a nett 8.

 

[Mandofred]

No, the 81 you scored was on a much easier course (or the Par was lower at least), the Course Rating was 68.8. Whereas you score of 82 was shot on a course with a course rating of 72.3 (i.e. on a course that is 3.5 shots "harder" than the course you shot 81).

You are confusing Slope Rating as the absolute difficulty of the course (many do). It is not, slope rating is only related to the relative difficulty of a course between low and high handicappers. Course Rating represents the absolute difficulty of a course.

Have another question. Couple of brain errors on my part anyway...although I played well enough today that I'm likely to be dropped below 7 for tomorrow....yea!!

Before this week.....I was 7.2
Knaresborough is the harder course, but according to the hcp charts I had to play off 8.
Ripon is the easier course, but I got an extra shot with 9.

Is there a reason why I get more shots on the easier course?

 

[Deleted member 3432]

Have another question. Couple of brain errors on my part anyway...although I played well enough today that I'm likely to be dropped below 7 for tomorrow....yea!!

Before this week.....I was 7.2
Knaresborough is the harder course, but according to the hcp charts I had to play off 8.
Ripon is the easier course, but I got an extra shot with 9.

Is there a reason why I get more shots on the easier course?

Higher slope?

Maybe the course raters deem the slope to be Higher and therefore a harder course.....

 

[nickjdavis]

Is there a reason why I get more shots on the easier course?

Ripon Slope is 135, Knaresborough is 128

Course Rating for Ripon is 70.1 but bogey rating is 95.1....so 25 shots harder for a bogey golfer
Knaresborough CR is 73.3 but the bogey rating is 97....so 23.7 shots harder for the bogey golfer

So yes...Knaresborough is a "harder course" but Ripon is "relatively more hard for a bogey golfer compared to a scratch golfer"....hence the higher slope and you get more shots....this may be due to course topography, narrowness of fairways, difficult carries on Ripon for bogey golfers who may hit it less distance. What is relatively an easier course for you as a single digit golfer might not be an easier course for a 20 handicapper.

 

[wjemather]

Have another question. Couple of brain errors on my part anyway...although I played well enough today that I'm likely to be dropped below 7 for tomorrow....yea!!

Before this week.....I was 7.2
Knaresborough is the harder course, but according to the hcp charts I had to play off 8.
Ripon is the easier course, but I got an extra shot with 9.

Is there a reason why I get more shots on the easier course?

The Course Handicap calculation only accounts for the difference in relative difficultly (Slope), not the absolute difficulty (Course Rating).

Ripon has a much higher Slope Rating than Knaresborough, so players are likely to get more strokes when playing there.

The Course Rating is accounted for when calculating the Score Differentials, the best 8 of your most recent 20 of which are averaged to produce your Handicap Index.

 

[Mandofred]

Ripon Slope is 135, Knaresborough is 128

Course Rating for Ripon is 70.1 but bogey rating is 95.1....so 25 shots harder for a bogey golfer
Knaresborough CR is 73.3 but the bogey rating is 97....so 23.7 shots harder for the bogey golfer

So yes...Knaresborough is a "harder course" but Ripon is "relatively more hard for a bogey golfer compared to a scratch golfer"....hence the higher slope and you get more shots.

I guess it makes sense......but......I think it is turning me into a drooling Homer Simpson

 

[rulefan]

So yes...Knaresborough is a "harder course"

Just to make it absolutely clear, The Course Rating is calculated specifically for a Scratch Player.

A Bogey Rating is calculated for a 22ish cap player. The difference is 'in effect' the Slope. This tells you how much more (or possibly less) difficult the course is for players with different Handicap Indices.

 

[Rlburnside]

I’m starting to think the new system is worse for reflecting your current handicap.
Something I thought was one of the benefits of WHS

Seven out of eight of my last rounds would have resulted in .1 increases the other one I would have ‘ buffered yet under the new system my handicap has remained the same

Four of my scores that have dropped off we’re from last year which has impacted on the calculations for handicap.

If I stopped playing at the end of summer (as many players do) I would always have scores dropping off from the previous year.

Not so good if your a old duffer?

 

[nickjdavis]

Just to make it absolutely clear, The Course Rating is calculated specifically for a Scratch Player.

A Bogey Rating is calculated for a 22ish cap player. The difference is 'in effect' the Slope. This tells you how much more (or possibly less) difficult the course is for players with different Handicap Indices.

That's why I highlighted the bogey ratings for each course so that folks could see that Knaresborough was relatively less difficult for a bogey golfer than Ripon.

I think many folk get fixated about CR and Slope and forgets about Bogey Rating....thinking that slope is some how another measure of difficulty of a golf course, rather than actually something that has been calculated based on how a bogey golfer is expected to perform, relative to a scratch player. Most folks here are aware but I'd hazard that a huge majority of golfers know nothing about the Bogey Rating.....if they were more aware of BR then perhaps they might understand slope a little bit better and thus why it isn't a measure of difficulty of a golf course.

 

[jim8flog]

I’m starting to think the new system is worse for reflecting your current handicap.
Something I thought was one of the benefits of WHS

Seven out of eight of my last rounds would have resulted in .1 increases the other one I would have ‘ buffered yet under the new system my handicap has remained the same

Under the UHS so if you started off at x.5, x.6 or x.7 add 7 x 0.1 and your handicap would remain the same.

 

[Rlburnside]

Under the UHS so if you started off at x.5, x.6 or x.7 add 7 x 0.1 and your handicap would remain the same.

Not sure what UHS is but if it’s old system and you started off x.1-x.2-x.3-x.4 and x.8- x.9. and then added 7.1s this would alter your handicap would it not?

 

[Mandofred]

That's why I highlighted the bogey ratings for each course so that folks could see that Knaresborough was relatively less difficult for a bogey golfer than Ripon.

I think many folk get fixated about CR and Slope and forgets about Bogey Rating....thinking that slope is some how another measure of difficulty of a golf course, rather than actually something that has been calculated based on how a bogey golfer is expected to perform, relative to a scratch player. Most folks here are aware but I'd hazard that a huge majority of golfers know nothing about the Bogey Rating.....if they were more aware of BR then perhaps they might understand slope a little bit better and thus why it isn't a measure of difficulty of a golf course.

About the bogey players....probably correct. At Knaresborough there are no real dangers off the tee. If you hit a crap tee shot reasonably straight you are still alive. The front 9 at Ripon......a crap shot off the tee can lose a ball on 7 or 8 of them, with several easy chances to lose the ball on the back 9 as well. While Knaresborough is quite a bit longer, Ripon has more ball losing danger (on the front 9 mostly) and the greens in general are a LOT tougher than Knaresborough.

And I got dropped to 6.4 today.....made playing a fair bit more intimidating. Still managed 35 pts.....back 9 still a thorn in my side. I've decided to start submitting a LOT of my casual scores......makes the WHS handicap a lot more representative of current form. If you only put in comp scores......it takes quite a while to get 20 scores.