fundy
Ryder Cup Winner
Michael Vaughan named in the report. Id love to say im shocked.......
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fundy
Ryder Cup Winner
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id love to be able to read it, stuck behind a paywall
The Azeem Rafiq-Yorkshire story has dominated the news and as a pundit I would normally comment on what has happened.
But it has been very difficult for me to speak about it and I want to explain why that has been the case.
From Azeem’s early days at Yorkshire, I was a massive fan of this young, dynamic player. He thought out of the box and that excited me. He got Yorkshire going. He was full of energy and buzz. I felt that he had something about him and I was vocal about the fact that I thought he potentially had a good career ahead of him.
As a lover of cricket and Yorkshire, and someone who has been a fan of Rafiq, it has been difficult to hear about the painful experiences he endured during his time at the club.
But as difficult as that process has been, I recognise that it is equally necessary. At an individual level, it is clear that Azeem has endured a lot. It is not only right but essential that his experiences and his perspective are heard. There are unquestionably lessons to be learned.
The statements made by Gary Ballance and others have laid bare awkward but necessary questions for cricket to answer regarding how dressing rooms, teams and individuals function in the modern era.
In December 2020 I was asked to speak to the independent panel formed by Yorkshire to investigate Rafiq’s claims. Other than having well-known and longstanding associations to the club I had no idea why they wanted to speak to me but I agreed to make myself available.
The night before I was due to give evidence, out of the blue, I was hit with the news that Rafiq was alleging that in 2009, when I was still a player and before a Yorkshire match against Nottinghamshire, I had said to Rafiq and two other Asian players as we walked onto the field together that there are “too many of you lot, we need to do something about it”.
This hit me very hard. It was like being struck over the head with a brick. I have been involved in cricket for 30 years and never once been accused of any remotely similar incident or disciplinary offence as a player or commentator. That the allegation came completely out of the blue and more than a decade after it was alleged to have happened made it all the more difficult to process.
I completely and categorically deny that I ever said those words. I responded to the panel by saying I was gobsmacked and that my professional legal advice was that I could not appear before a panel having had just a few hours’ notice of the such serious claims made against me.
It was 11 years after the alleged event. Nothing at all was raised or said at the time of the game in question. It was not mentioned at the time or at any stage over the next 11 years until the night before I was asked to speak to the inquiry.
Rafiq is pursuing an ongoing live compensation claim against Yorkshire. He announced that at the same time as I was asked to speak with the Yorkshire panel. My legal team sent a series of questions to the Yorkshire panel asking about guarantees of confidentiality, the terms of reference and which inquiry - the Yorkshire one or the employment tribunal - had precedence. It seemed remarkable to me and to my advisors that there were to be two parallel inquiries into substantially the same issues, with the potential for different findings on those same issues.
The answers we received from the panel were not satisfactory so I declined to appear before the Yorkshire hearing, pending clarification on the nature of any claims that would also be addressed in Rafiq’s compensation claim through the Employment Tribunal.
I have nothing to hide. The “you lot” comment never happened. Anyone trying to recollect words said 10 years ago will be fallible but I am adamant those words were not used. If Rafiq believes something was said at the time to upset him then that is what he believes. It is difficult to comment on that except to say it hurts me hugely to think I potentially affected someone. I take it as the most serious allegation ever put in front of me and I will fight to the end to prove I am not that person.
It was also alleged that later, when I was advising Yorkshire on playing matters, I said in front of Azeem that Yorkshire should sign Kane Williamson as a Twenty20 player because he bowls off-spin as well as bats. Azeem states in his evidence that bowling “off-spin” was said in his presence to make him feel inferior.
First of all I would never have said that in front of a group. My relationship with Yorkshire was to watch on match days and give a view on how they could improve. I saw the way Williamson played in Twenty20 cricket and recognised that we needed three-dimensional cricketers in our top four who could score runs, bowl overs and field well. Never have I discriminated against anyone or judged a player based on race.
All I ask and all I have ever asked is ‘how can we improve as a team?’ By suggesting Yorkshire sign Williamson I was attempting to improve the team and my cricket knowledge suggests that was the right call. Again, it hurts to be told that Rafiq believes that in recommending the signature of Williamson, I was attacking him and that I was doing so on grounds of race.
In time, I am more than happy to meet with Azeem. I would welcome it. I would like to sit with him, listen to what he went through and understand his perspective. It has been very hard for me to communicate with him directly for legal reasons but I hope we can now talk in person and understand each other’s point of view.
I absolutely deny that I ever said what he claims and that I recommended Kane Williamson for anything other than purely cricketing reasons. But having heard what has come out in the last few days, I can see how his perspective, and his experience was clearly very different to how I saw things at Yorkshire at that time.
I played professional cricket for 18 years between 1991 and 2009. All players in that period are now looking back on things that were said and admit they would not say them now. I never heard racist abuse but Yorkshire was a hard dressing room. As a second team player we had to knock on the dressing room door before entering. If you had a big nose, were bald or carried a bit of weight they would be commented on.
I was the first non-Yorkshire born player to play for the county and that was commented on a lot. I am not comparing those examples with racism but they are examples of previously commonplace behaviour which is unacceptable now. We cannot change what was said or happened in dressing rooms 10-15 years ago but we can learn from it.
During the summer, I told my colleagues at the BBC that these allegations had been made against me. I felt uncomfortable that it could emerge and they would be asked some awkward questions. Similarly, I am speaking now because it is right for people to hear my side and that I completely deny the allegations.
I accept Yorkshire have dealt with this terribly. They will be honest enough to admit that. It is a good cricket club and it is close to my heart. I hope I can be part of the movement to rebrand the club and people will eventually look back on this time and say it changed for the better.
The Yorkshire I love is a club that only wants to produce the best players and win games of cricket. Clearly there are issues in English cricket, spread wider than Yorkshire, about why so many young Asian players are not graduating through to the professional game.
A good number of the young cricketers I see and enjoy watching around the pathway programme are Asian and yet so few make it to first team county cricket. We have to improve the pathway to make sure their talent is nurtured and we need to listen to them and their families about why it is not happening.
We cannot use the old excuses that they do not like the culture of Saturday afternoon games or parents do not want their children to pursue cricket and to study instead. It is for the game to make it work for them to make the most of this huge talent pool.
Then they have the extract - something doesn’t feel right at moment , if Vaughan did say it then it wouldn’t take much to prove with the other lads there
fundy
Ryder Cup Winner
Wow, think I better not comment on that......
Grizzly
Well-known member
Considering we are coming at this from diametrically opposed positions, its almost odd that my reaction was the same. I wondered at first if this was the incident that Rana Naved referred to when Rafiq's allegations first came out, but no reference is made of that. The claims regarding Kane Williamson are just bizarre!
Overarching point is, just adds to the picture of a badly handled investigation.
The claims relating to Kane Williamson are more than bizarre, they are surely so ridiculous as to be potentially undermining of Rafiq’s more specific allegations.
Blue in Munich
Crocked Professional Yeti Impersonator
Relevant extracts from Yorkshire's report
I 'm no cricket expert so stand to be corrected but there certainly seem to be some statistics that back up Michael Vaughan's opinion on Kane Williamson's ability as a bowler. The claim about Vaughan saying it to make Rafiq feel inferior says more about Rafiq than Vaughan to me.
I [Azeem Rafiq] then made it to the professional set up of YCCC as staff, together with Adil Rashid, Ajmal Shazad and Rana Naveed.
In a game in 2009, Nottingham v Yorkshire, as we were all walking on the field, a senior player, Michael Vaughan, said: “Too many of you lot we need to do something about it”.
This comment was addressed to me, Adil Rashid, Ajmal Shazad and Rana Naveed. We all heard it...
These comments from Michael Vaughan “you lot” is how we would be addressed by him and others because of our race...
When Michael Vaughan retired, he took up the position as advisor and would often come to YCCC giving his opinion and captain- coach options which particularly were aimed at moving me out of the team.
One such recommendation was for Kane Williamson to be signed and he categorically said he bowls “off-spin” really well too.
This is ridiculous as Kane Williamson is a batsman only.
This comment about him bowling “off-spin” was simply made in my presence to make me feel inferior.
To Michael Vaughan, this was classified as banter. To me, it is racism. It is because of my race, colour, ethnic origin, that Michael Vaughan made the comments that he did.
In a game in 2009, Nottingham v Yorkshire, as we were all walking on the field, a senior player, Michael Vaughan, said: “Too many of you lot we need to do something about it”.
This comment was addressed to me, Adil Rashid, Ajmal Shazad and Rana Naveed. We all heard it...
These comments from Michael Vaughan “you lot” is how we would be addressed by him and others because of our race...
When Michael Vaughan retired, he took up the position as advisor and would often come to YCCC giving his opinion and captain- coach options which particularly were aimed at moving me out of the team.
One such recommendation was for Kane Williamson to be signed and he categorically said he bowls “off-spin” really well too.
This is ridiculous as Kane Williamson is a batsman only.
This comment about him bowling “off-spin” was simply made in my presence to make me feel inferior.
To Michael Vaughan, this was classified as banter. To me, it is racism. It is because of my race, colour, ethnic origin, that Michael Vaughan made the comments that he did.
I 'm no cricket expert so stand to be corrected but there certainly seem to be some statistics that back up Michael Vaughan's opinion on Kane Williamson's ability as a bowler. The claim about Vaughan saying it to make Rafiq feel inferior says more about Rafiq than Vaughan to me.
With a Commons Select Committee hearing already scheduled and an ECB inquiry announced why has Vaughan decided to speak out? He would have had every opportunity to speak in a formal setting that would give greater weight to what he has to say.
We’re getting into the realms of assumptions and guess work. But let’s not forget, Yorkshire CCC has already upheld some of the allegations. Having people jump the gun like Vaughan has is unhelpful.
We’re getting into the realms of assumptions and guess work. But let’s not forget, Yorkshire CCC has already upheld some of the allegations. Having people jump the gun like Vaughan has is unhelpful.
Blue in Munich
Crocked Professional Yeti Impersonator
Emergency board meeting at YCCC today…
Should be a short meeting. “Yes, we accept your resignation.”
Blue in Munich
Crocked Professional Yeti Impersonator
Roger Hutton has resigned according to the BBC.
Some odd things here. If Vaughan didn't say that phrase then you don't need a legal team to tell you not to appear. You attend the hearing, you advise that you did not say it. End of story. There were three other players present when it was apparently said, have we heard from them yet?
I suspect Vaughan wants to get ahead of the story rather than sitting at home stewing, waiting for it to break. You can't blame him for that.
The Williamson angle is bizarre and an advisor to Rafiq really should have told him to leave that out. Williamson would improve any team in the world, any advisor to a county team could point towards recruiting him. To link the suggestion to racism is flimsy at best. There is nothing in Vaughan's comments suggesting a racist motive there, it is purely sporting. Obviously we were not present to see any looks or tone but written down it suggests nothing.
This clearly has some distance to run and there are going to be a number of ex / current players and staff feeling very nervous right now.
The Williamson incident really does come across as desperation to me. It’s almost as though Rafiq is trying to bulk up his overall complaint because he realises it lacks substance. It’s really odd that it’s been included on the face of it, although we may not be considering the comments in their full context.
The daft thing is that people might start to focus on the weakness of that section and lose sight of other, legitimate complaints. It becomes a distraction and why it should not have been included, imo.
Exactly, which is why I previously referred to it as undermining. The other allegations may well be entirely legitimate. But, taken in isolation and in the context solely of what Vaughan is alleged to have said in relation to Williamson, it is a really weak suggestion.
Of course, to date and in relation to Vaughan we only have his very brief account. It may transpire that Rafiq’s allegations in which Vaughan is named turn out to be far more detailed and substantive than we have been led to believe, which will perhaps cast the Williamson conversation in an entirely different light.
The fact that Vaughan has opted to make a public pre-emptive strike could be viewed as him having a lot more to worry about than what has been included in his statement.
It’s a right mess, that’s for sure, and has become so because of the totally inept manner in which it has been handled from the outset.
funkycoldmedina
Newbie
The issues around players integrating from ethnic minorities is a valid discussion. When you consider the love of cricket in those communities and how many from that background play at a club like Yorkshire it's poor and does give credence to the institutionalised racism claim.
I worked at the training school of a test match ground for 3 years and saw the argument from both sides. The club did make efforts to integrate with those communities but it can be a ham fisted way. There is however a reluctance in the communities part to be involved. They only trust coaches from their communities and don't want to send them into county programmes.
There's a balance to be had and the counties need to do more and open their mind to other routes but the communities also need to be more receptive. Just because an ex pro was a good player doesn't make them a good coach, getting your badges does help.
As for Azeem Rafiq I'll keep my powder dry on that one, it will sound like sour grapes as a Yorkshire fan, because pre all this happening I'd heard stuff about him from people who'd played with and against him. Let's just say he has form.
I worked at the training school of a test match ground for 3 years and saw the argument from both sides. The club did make efforts to integrate with those communities but it can be a ham fisted way. There is however a reluctance in the communities part to be involved. They only trust coaches from their communities and don't want to send them into county programmes.
There's a balance to be had and the counties need to do more and open their mind to other routes but the communities also need to be more receptive. Just because an ex pro was a good player doesn't make them a good coach, getting your badges does help.
As for Azeem Rafiq I'll keep my powder dry on that one, it will sound like sour grapes as a Yorkshire fan, because pre all this happening I'd heard stuff about him from people who'd played with and against him. Let's just say he has form.
Sky Sports reporting that a further ex-Yorkshire player has come forward corroborating Rafiq’s allegations of racism relating to Michael Vaughan.
Beezerk
Money List Winner
Is that on the TV? Nothing about it on the website at the minute.
It was verbally reported on SSN about 9.15am.
