England v Pakistan

Tongo

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Well after the procession against Sri Lanka it looks like we have a proper test series for the second half of the summer!

Great stuff from Woakes with the ball but it looks like England are going to have their hands full with Yasir Shah this summer and the soft underbelly of their middle order looks likely to be regularly exposed.

I think it wont be long before Moeen's place in the side comes under serious scrutiny. Just what is he offering that Rashid doesnt?
 

fundy

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Woakes now above Finn for sure, be interesting if we pick Woakes and Stokes for 2nd test. The Ali situation is hard, doing a containing role as we dont have anyone better is the theory but like you think Rashid should get another go. Vince looks a liability currently, looked clueless v the spin and Ballance a strange choice against a predominantly left arm attack.

Batting is overly dependent on 2 or 3 and the bowling looks pretty one dimensional without Andersen albeit on your typical Lords deck which has been prepared to last for 10 days rather than produce a good cricket wicket (is it really that risky to have a track with a little pace and bounce)
 
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So what is everyone's feelings on Amir ?

Side with people like Bumble and Cork - banned for life ( Cork more leaning towards just banned from international cricket )

Or side with Key and Hussain - gets a second chance ?

I think it's a tough one but lean more towards the banning for life but just have this feeling that he deserves the second chance because he was so young and under the influence of senior players ?
 

Tongo

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So what is everyone's feelings on Amir ?

Side with people like Bumble and Cork - banned for life ( Cork more leaning towards just banned from international cricket )

Or side with Key and Hussain - gets a second chance ?

I think it's a tough one but lean more towards the banning for life but just have this feeling that he deserves the second chance because he was so young and under the influence of senior players ?

People will judge Amir from their own standing and their own pleasant, well off, comfortable lives here in England. I get the impression that life isnt as comfortable, rosy or as simple in Pakistan.
 

fundy

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So what is everyone's feelings on Amir ?

Side with people like Bumble and Cork - banned for life ( Cork more leaning towards just banned from international cricket )

Or side with Key and Hussain - gets a second chance ?

I think it's a tough one but lean more towards the banning for life but just have this feeling that he deserves the second chance because he was so young and under the influence of senior players ?

I think its a really hard one, im usually a big fan of lifetime bans for pretty much any form of cheating, especially match fixing in cricket as it invariably costs me a chunk of profits when it happens. In this situation though I can see the other side and why it has been a limited punishment and hes been allowed to return. For me time to move on, hes been allowed back and hopefully theres no controversy around him in the foreseeable future
 

Hobbit

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So what is everyone's feelings on Amir ?

Side with people like Bumble and Cork - banned for life ( Cork more leaning towards just banned from international cricket )

Or side with Key and Hussain - gets a second chance ?

I think it's a tough one but lean more towards the banning for life but just have this feeling that he deserves the second chance because he was so young and under the influence of senior players ?

Second chance for sure. Even good people make bad choices occasionally.
 

Tongo

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A cracking day in the test. Proper test match cricket. Its set up for a very intriguing finish.

Great stuff from Chris Woakes as well, 11 wickets in the match so far with another 2 potentially up for grabs!
 

fundy

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A cracking day in the test. Proper test match cricket. Its set up for a very intriguing finish.

Great stuff from Chris Woakes as well, 11 wickets in the match so far with another 2 potentially up for grabs!

Woakes has been different class, be great to have him and Andersen in the same team, felt a bit for Finn, chances going down off him when his place is under pressure. Bairstows keeping been shown up yet again, merits being in the side as a batter but they are going to seriously have to consider whether they pick a different keeper

As for tomorrow could be a classic albeit I think England are in for a very tough time, forecast is for early conditions to be overcast and the pitch getting more and more variable as the day wore on today, albeit the roller may improve it a bit early on. Wrist spinner gonna be in his element you'd think
 

fundy

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cracking test match but chasing 4th inns was always going to be difficult, especially after a few of the top order donated their wickets. Woakes gonna struggle to work out how he's on the losing side, been outstanding all test match, expect at least 2 changes for the next test
 

Tongo

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cracking test match but chasing 4th inns was always going to be difficult, especially after a few of the top order donated their wickets. Woakes gonna struggle to work out how he's on the losing side, been outstanding all test match, expect at least 2 changes for the next test

Yeah, this looks like it could be a great series. England's batting looks suspect if Cook and Root dont score runs.
 

HomerJSimpson

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cracking test match but chasing 4th inns was always going to be difficult, especially after a few of the top order donated their wickets. Woakes gonna struggle to work out how he's on the losing side, been outstanding all test match, expect at least 2 changes for the next test

As predicted England out for less than 220 and struggling against the Pakistani attack although to be fair some of the shots played were reckless at best. You can't factor in a rush of blood but I hope the batting line up in the next game is more robust
 

patricks148

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I'm still struggling to work out how Yasir got a shed load of wickets????

i watched most of his bowling and only saw one ball turn, looked like the England of old mesmerized by any subcontinental spinner.
 

fundy

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I'm still struggling to work out how Yasir got a shed load of wickets????

i watched most of his bowling and only saw one ball turn, looked like the England of old mesmerized by any subcontinental spinner.

He turned plenty yesterday, the ball he bowled Ballance with turned more than 2 foot (albeit Ballance made a horlicks of it)

Must be something about him, 86 wickets in 13 tests and already ranked number 1 in the world. I thought he bowled beautifully both innings, lots of variety in pace and flight as well as varying amounts of turn.

You're going to see a lot more of him over the summer thats for sure and every chance he really likes the wicket at Old Trafford next week!

Most of our guys rarely see a proper wrist spinner so no surprise they struggle against it really :( Only question now is how long does he last before he gets called for chucking (like every other wrist spinner for the last decade)
 

patricks148

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He turned plenty yesterday, the ball he bowled Ballance with turned more than 2 foot (albeit Ballance made a horlicks of it)

Must be something about him, 86 wickets in 13 tests and already ranked number 1 in the world. I thought he bowled beautifully both innings, lots of variety in pace and flight as well as varying amounts of turn.

You're going to see a lot more of him over the summer thats for sure and every chance he really likes the wicket at Old Trafford next week!

Most of our guys rarely see a proper wrist spinner so no surprise they struggle against it really :( Only question now is how long does he last before he gets called for chucking (like every other wrist spinner for the last decade)

Didn't see the Balance wicket, but most deliveries i did see we sort of fast top spinners or just straight balls. He didn't bowl many bad balls from what i saw and when he did the batsmen made a has of it and either got out or blocked it.

Id like to see him attacked more, the attitude Misbah takes, when a spinners comes on its time to score for him not block the * out of it.

They just let him bowl .

can't argue that the seamers bowled well they could have easily Skitteled us out the couple of spells i saw, that just kept finding the edge.
 

fundy

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Didn't see the Balance wicket, but most deliveries i did see we sort of fast top spinners or just straight balls. He didn't bowl many bad balls from what i saw and when he did the batsmen made a has of it and either got out or blocked it.

Id like to see him attacked more, the attitude Misbah takes, when a spinners comes on its time to score for him not block the * out of it.

They just let him bowl .

can't argue that the seamers bowled well they could have easily Skitteled us out the couple of spells i saw, that just kept finding the edge.

Ballance dismissal

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J8LuafqpJSE

The problem with attacking him was shown up badly by Moeen, declared in the press he was gonna attack him then got bowled trying to slog him out of the ground early on, horrid shot.

Very hard to attack someone when you dont know which way or if hes turning it, and pretty much none of the England batters looked like they were picking him at all
 

patricks148

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Ballance dismissal

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J8LuafqpJSE

The problem with attacking him was shown up badly by Moeen, declared in the press he was gonna attack him then got bowled trying to slog him out of the ground early on, horrid shot.

Very hard to attack someone when you dont know which way or if hes turning it, and pretty much none of the England batters looked like they were picking him at all

WOW, very Warne like, only balls i saw him bowl were gun barrel straight.

was it out the bowlers foot marks?

Maybe not having a slog or the big shot, didn't see much in the way of singles and rotation of the strike
 
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