England v Pakistan

[Lord Tyrion]

I barely watched the cricket because of the golf. In my head it didn't really happen. Can we start at Old Trafford 0-0?

The best players of spin use their feet and get to the pitch. We seem mesmerised and the only option is the slog sweep. We need to use our feet and knock him off his line. Even if you are only pushing ones it upsets the length and rythym of the bowler.

 

[fundy]

Cook and Root proved why theyre Englands 2 best batters again today, Root has been superb, looked in good nick last test before throwing it away, seems determined to prove a point today!!! Gonna be hardwork for Pakistan from here

 

[patricks148]

Cook and Root proved why theyre Englands 2 best batters again today, Root has been superb, looked in good nick last test before throwing it away, seems determined to prove a point today!!! Gonna be hardwork for Pakistan from here

Yasir, got the bowling figures he should have had a lords.... today, none for loads

Root again today just showed he is in a different class to the rest

 

[HomerJSimpson]

Vince looks a tad light at this level and has been found out driving all the time. Good to see Root play with patience and nice knock from Cook. Hopefully we'll get shed loads tomorrow and the bowlers will then find a way to get them out twice

 

[Norrin Radd]

i would like to see england swap vince and balance for roy and butler, that would be some batting line up .
as for today ,cook and root were superb .

 

[fundy]

i would like to see england swap vince and balance for roy and butler, that would be some batting line up .
as for today ,cook and root were superb .

Buttler has a broken finger so not available and Roy barely averages 25 in county cricket with 2 50s in 13 innings, why on earth would you want him in a test side?

 

[Deleted member 18588]

Buttler has a broken finger so not available and Roy barely averages 25 in county cricket with 2 50s in 13 innings, why on earth would you want him in a test side?

And in his 15 Tests to date Buttler averages only 30.

He and Roy are certainties for T20 & ODI but neither look like they are suited to Test cricket.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

I don't see Roy being given a go anytime soon but reckon Buttler was close to a recall before the finger injury and expect to see him back in the squad sooner rather than later to move Bairstow as a specialist batsman. Buttler started his test career off in decent form but lost form and confidence during the Ashes - the break has done him wonders and he has regained a lot of confidence. If his finger has healed then could even see him back in for the next test instead of Vince with Buttler coming in at 6.

 

[Karl102]

Vince isn't convincing for me. I would give Scott Borthwick a go. Nearly 700 1st div runs already this year and if I am honest, from what I've seen there a a few middle order English batsman setting the world on fire ATM. Liam Livingstone at lancs is having a good season and is one to watch for the future.... He scored 300+ in a 45 over Cheshire cup game last year.....

 

[HomerJSimpson]

Borthwick has to be worth a look. Roy doesn't strike me as a test player. Still not wholly convinced with Hales at the top either though not convinced on who could replace him

 

[Deleted member 18588]

I don't see Roy being given a go anytime soon but reckon Buttler was close to a recall before the finger injury and expect to see him back in the squad sooner rather than later to move Bairstow as a specialist batsman. Buttler started his test career off in decent form but lost form and confidence during the Ashes - the break has done him wonders and he has regained a lot of confidence. If his finger has healed then could even see him back in for the next test instead of Vince with Buttler coming in at 6.

I remain "old fashioned", a wicket-keeper should be picked primarily for his keeping.

Whilst Buttler has improved he is still not exactly Test class as just a keeper.

Post Gilchrist every Test nation has been picking their keepers more for their batting, overlooking the fact that Adam Gilchrist was a one-off whose keeping alone made him worthy of a place.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

MM we haven't picked our best wicket keeper for over 20 years now. The selectors are obsessed with the wk scoring runs, no matter how many they cost through dropped catches and missed stumping. Foster and Read should have been fighting for England caps but they were sadly neglected. Barstow has irons hands, Butler much the same.

 

[Snelly]

Rooooooooot.

Top man. Fingers crossed he can kick on from here to 200.

 

[Deleted member 18588]

MM we haven't picked our best wicket keeper for over 20 years now. The selectors are obsessed with the wk scoring runs, no matter how many they cost through dropped catches and missed stumping. Foster and Read should have been fighting for England caps but they were sadly neglected. Barstow has irons hands, Butler much the same.

Yes it does pre-date Gilchrist. As well as Foster and Read there have been other glovemen who missed out, like Keith Piper and Bob Taylor was overlooked for a long time to accommodate Alan Knott's superior batting.

6-4-1 for me.

Best 6 batsmen, best 4 bowlers, best 1 as keeper. In that mix you will always find a batsman who can bowl and a bowler who will contribute useful runs.

Unfortunately back in the 90's my county (Warks) had terrific success with a lot of "bits & pieces" players and it seemed to set a pattern that many in the game followed to the detriment of many specialists.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

The Dermot Reeves era. Hugely successful as you say. I agree with your system, does that make us both old or just traditionalists? I think the latter and it still holds up to scrutiny.

 

[Deleted member 18588]

The Dermot Reeves era. Hugely successful as you say. I agree with your system, does that make us both old or just traditionalists? I think the latter and it still holds up to scrutiny.

Dear old Dermot! They were fun days but, as I said, in some ways they weren't beneficial for us or the game as a whole.

As for you and I, I prefer traditionalists but others might disagree (at least in my case!)

 

[Deleted member 15344]

It's certainly an issue where you can see both sides - how much extra does a specialist keeper give a team as opposed to an extra batsman ?

A lot of keepers now are concentrating more on their batting to make them more adaptable knowing teams would like that extra batsmen - Prior was the perfect example for England - batting depth is a big thing for teams now and it's been one of England's strengths over the last number of years

 

[Deleted member 18588]

It's certainly an issue where you can see both sides - how much extra does a specialist keeper give a team as opposed to an extra batsman ?

A lot of keepers now are concentrating more on their batting to make them more adaptable knowing teams would like that extra batsmen - Prior was the perfect example for England - batting depth is a big thing for teams now and it's been one of England's strengths over the last number of years

To me it is not a great thing to claim a depth in batting. Rather it is an indication of a lack of strength in the 6 specialists.

A quality keeper is essential, he is the focus for the fielding side and there is nothing more damaging to bowlers' morale than seeing catches dropped and (particularly in the cases of Bairstow and Buttler) stumping chances missed. That fall in morale quickly spreads throughout the team.

 

[Tongo]

Rooooooooot.

Top man. Fingers crossed he can kick on from here to 200.

Yes, i always feel that England players dont score as many daddy hundreds as they should so this is a great performance from JR.

Good support from Woakes as well who is showing what he can do with bat as well as ball.

 

[Tongo]

To me it is not a great thing to claim a depth in batting. Rather it is an indication of a lack of strength in the 6 specialists.

A quality keeper is essential, he is the focus for the fielding side and there is nothing more damaging to bowlers' morale than seeing catches dropped and (particularly in the cases of Bairstow and Buttler) stumping chances missed. That fall in morale quickly spreads throughout the team.

Australia of course only played with 4 bowlers with Gilchrist in the side. But they had everything in that team. England dont have enough in the top 6 to be confident enough to only play 4 bowlers with a specialist keeper. Or a good enough attack to go with just 4 bowlers.