England v Pakistan

[ColchesterFC]

Pakistan batting well and showing up England's cowardly decision to bat first after winning the toss. Would love to know who else apart from Cook was involved in that decision. It was a perfect first day pitch for the England seam attack and we bottled it because we were scared of possibly facing a spinner batting on day 4 or 5.

 

[Tongo]

Pakistan batting well and showing up England's cowardly decision to bat first after winning the toss. Would love to know who else apart from Cook was involved in that decision. It was a perfect first day pitch for the England seam attack and we bottled it because we were scared of possibly facing a spinner batting on day 4 or 5.

Looking like it could be a match losing decision!

 

[Tongo]

Disappointing performance from England but a thoroughly enjoyable and entertaining series. Shame there isnt a 5th test as a decider.

 

[fundy]

Disappointing performance from England but a thoroughly enjoyable and entertaining series. Shame there isnt a 5th test as a decider.

Nope instead we get 5 pointless ODIS that no one cares about just to ensure the counties get their ticket sales. Series really needs a 5th test.

Test rankings now very very close at the top, makes for much more interest without their being a standout team thats for sure

 

[Tongo]

Nope instead we get 5 pointless ODIS that no one cares about just to ensure the counties get their ticket sales. Series really needs a 5th test.

Test rankings now very very close at the top, makes for much more interest without their being a standout team thats for sure

Or take one from the Sri Lanka series and make it a 2-5 split. Sri Lanka were always going to struggle in May and early June. Surely the ECB need to look at the quality of the opposition when they scheduling tours.

 

[fundy]

Or take one from the Sri Lanka series and make it a 2-5 split. Sri Lanka were always going to struggle in May and early June. Surely the ECB need to look at the quality of the opposition when they scheduling tours.

Sri Lanka currently stuffing the no 1 ranked side (yes i know in very very different conditions!)

Problem is number of tests allocated a few years in advance.

Genuinely think the sooner ODIs are done away with the better though, 5 test series then a 5 T20 series be spot on for me

 

[Deleted member 18588]

Sri Lanka currently stuffing the no 1 ranked side (yes i know in very very different conditions!)

Problem is number of tests allocated a few years in advance.

Genuinely think the sooner ODIs are done away with the better though, 5 test series then a 5 T20 series be spot on for me

All a question of taste.

For me the ODI's are of far more interest than the "chip shop" cricket that is T20.

I would like to see more 5 game Test series but the problem is in selling the tickets for anything other than the Ashes. Just ask Glamorgan, Durham & Hants; all of whom have lost money on hosting Tests against the so called "lesser lights".

 

[HomerJSimpson]

Pakistan batting well and showing up England's cowardly decision to bat first after winning the toss. Would love to know who else apart from Cook was involved in that decision. It was a perfect first day pitch for the England seam attack and we bottled it because we were scared of possibly facing a spinner batting on day 4 or 5.

It was a poor decision imo and shows an inherent fear of spin. Doesn't bode well for the winter tour

 

[Norrin Radd]

i couldnt believe Cook batted first, all the pundits were saying bowl and he says bat ,what happens ? we needed a spin bowler to score runs for us because the batsmen were skittled in the morning session .
lesson learned Alistair?

 

[DCB]

i couldnt believe Cook batted first, all the pundits were saying bowl and he says bat ,what happens ? we needed a spin bowler to score runs for us because the batsmen were skittled in the morning session .
lesson learned Alistair?

It's not a "spin bowler who can score runs" it's batsman who can play Test cricket and stay at the crease that are needed. The batsmen should be capable of playing or not playing the shots required. Far too many errors by the top order puts pressure on the middle and lower order guys.

Well done Pakistan though, they played well both in the field and when batting. Deserved win for them.

 

[Tongo]

i couldnt believe Cook batted first, all the pundits were saying bowl and he says bat ,what happens ? we needed a spin bowler to score runs for us because the batsmen were skittled in the morning session .
lesson learned Alistair?

It's not a "spin bowler who can score runs" it's batsman who can play Test cricket and stay at the crease that are needed. The batsmen should be capable of playing or not playing the shots required. Far too many errors by the top order puts pressure on the middle and lower order guys.

Well done Pakistan though, they played well both in the field and when batting. Deserved win for them.

Cook should have put faith in his batsmen and bowlers though. By attempting to avoid facing Yashir in the 4th innings he was hiding his batsmen. He also could have made a statement by putting Pakistan in by effectively saying that we have the attack to take advantage of the conditions and skittle them out. Particularly as the Pakistani batting line-up had been suspect for most of the series and England's bowlers had been fantastic.

It was a defensive decision and one that seriously backfired.

 

[fundy]

Be good to see Wood back for the ODIs and the winter series, bowled with some serious wheels at T20 finals day today, including completely embarassing Root earlier!

 

[Oohmeoldbacksknackered]

Cook should have put faith in his batsmen and bowlers though. By attempting to avoid facing Yashir in the 4th innings he was hiding his batsmen. He also could have made a statement by putting Pakistan in by effectively saying that we have the attack to take advantage of the conditions and skittle them out. Particularly as the Pakistani batting line-up had been suspect for most of the series and England's bowlers had been fantastic.

It was a defensive decision and one that seriously backfired.

Just heard something online where I think it was a ex-England captain suggests that the decision was made purely on stats IE on this ground x% of games are won by the team batting first.
The pitch and weather didn't even come into the equation.
Is that even possibly true?

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Be good to see Wood back for the ODIs and the winter series, bowled with some serious wheels at T20 finals day today, including completely embarassing Root earlier!

We were at T20 finals day and Woods' bowling was outstanding - you could clearly see how quick he was and Root just couldn't deal with it

It was a great day -some superb batting on display but some of the catching was out of this world

 

[fundy]

We were at T20 finals day and Woods' bowling was outstanding - you could clearly see how quick he was and Root just couldn't deal with it

It was a great day -some superb batting on display but some of the catching was out of this world

3 good games that all swung one way and then the other, the losing side were a decent favourite at some point in each game. 150-170 games on a pitch with a little in it and boundaries back by far the best T20 games for me, give me them over 200+ plays 190 on a road and short boundaries anyday

Duckett did his reputation no harm with his innings in the semi, we'll be seeing a lot more of him and thought Wakeley led Northants superbly and provided the calm head in both games when they they were in trouble

Fielding was a bit surreal at times, a few basic misfields and quite a few straightforward drops (and another Bairstow howler), combined with a string of stunning catches not to mention a stop by Stokes on the long off boundary that you couldnt see anyone else making!

And still they insist we need Franchises, cant say I agree when you see days like this, they just need to televise and market the earlier rounds better imo, must have been a cracking day to have been at (and almost always is)

 

[Lord Tyrion]

I heard Flintoff talking in the week and he was against franchises. The logic was quite simple, you care about your team, you don't care about someone else's. He watches Lancashire, he wouldn't watch Manchester. Would Surrey fans go to Lord's to watch London play? Maybe, maybe not. Personally I don't think your British fan is ready for franchises or wants them. Sort the calendar out, that is more key.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

3 good games that all swung one way and then the other, the losing side were a decent favourite at some point in each game. 150-170 games on a pitch with a little in it and boundaries back by far the best T20 games for me, give me them over 200+ plays 190 on a road and short boundaries anyday

Duckett did his reputation no harm with his innings in the semi, we'll be seeing a lot more of him and thought Wakeley led Northants superbly and provided the calm head in both games when they they were in trouble

Fielding was a bit surreal at times, a few basic misfields and quite a few straightforward drops (and another Bairstow howler), combined with a string of stunning catches not to mention a stop by Stokes on the long off boundary that you couldnt see anyone else making!

And still they insist we need Franchises, cant say I agree when you see days like this, they just need to televise and market the earlier rounds better imo, must have been a cracking day to have been at (and almost always is)

Finals day is prob the best day out compared to all the other t20 comps - it's a real atmosphere and with 3 games it makes it all worthwhile - I don't see how you could have that with franchises.

The games yesterday had it all - some terrific bowling , crisp clean striking , bit of fielding mix ups , the odd howler

Duckett was superb in the first game - the boy can hit a ball , was impressed with Jennings , he could be another to look out for soon

Apart Stokes and Wood all other "superstars" failed to deliver

It's a great day out and we will look to go again next year

 

[ColchesterFC]

I heard Flintoff talking in the week and he was against franchises. The logic was quite simple, you care about your team, you don't care about someone else's. He watches Lancashire, he wouldn't watch Manchester. Would Surrey fans go to Lord's to watch London play? Maybe, maybe not. Personally I don't think your British fan is ready for franchises or wants them. Sort the calendar out, that is more key.

Finals day is prob the best day out compared to all the other t20 comps - it's a real atmosphere and with 3 games it makes it all worthwhile - I don't see how you could have that with franchises.

If you set up franchises and attract the best players in the world to play in it then you will attract the fans. I'm sure a Birmingham franchise with a couple of top Indian players would attract in local Indian fans for example.

Couldn't they just keep finals day as it is even with franchises LP? 8 or 10 franchise teams with the top 4 qualifying for finals day. Did you go specifically because a particular team was there or just to watch exciting cricket? I suspect a lot of fans were neutrals having a day out and this would be enhanced if the top T20 players from around the world were involved.

 

[Tongo]

Just heard something online where I think it was a ex-England captain suggests that the decision was made purely on stats IE on this ground x% of games are won by the team batting first.
The pitch and weather didn't even come into the equation.
Is that even possibly true?

I hope not. That's the sort of tomfoolery that plagued the Moores era second time round. I thought England had got past what the laptop told them and had started using their brains again.

 

[Tongo]

If you set up franchises and attract the best players in the world to play in it then you will attract the fans. I'm sure a Birmingham franchise with a couple of top Indian players would attract in local Indian fans for example.

Couldn't they just keep finals day as it is even with franchises LP? 8 or 10 franchise teams with the top 4 qualifying for finals day. Did you go specifically because a particular team was there or just to watch exciting cricket? I suspect a lot of fans were neutrals having a day out and this would be enhanced if the top T20 players from around the world were involved.

The top Indian players are unlikely to come over as the BCCI want to try and keep the IPL as the number one T20 comp. Hence why none of them come over at the moment. English teams also have to compete with the Caribbean Premier League as well. At the moment it is a competition they are losing. so they can tempt players like Gayle and Sammy but not for the whole tournament. Until the ECB realise that they need to change the calendar this will only continue.

I also am not convinced with franchises. There arent enough big population basis where there are county cricket grounds. Plus counties have alienated many fans that dont live in the city where the county ground is based as they no longer take games elsewhere. Take Hampshire, who play every match at the Rose Bowl. How many fans hack it down from the north of the county to watch matches? Unlike Football there isnt the ethos of large numbers of supporters who travel. If they merged Hampshire with Sussex and Kent, for instance, i wouldnt be interested in going to Hove or Canterbury to watch games.