Dress codes

[Swango1980]

You shouldn't have to call a club to ask "is this still the 1950s or do you treat women with respect "

As I said, you shouldn't.

But, the example I gave was at a golf club at the end of the 80's, start of the 90's. It was the only club I had any experience of, as I was a kid. And, if a woman turned up then and expected to go into the far bar, or play snooker, she wouldn't be allowed.

So, I was sort of trying to get an insight from others older than me, was this fairly common in the 80's, and what about even earlier decades?

Didn't Muirfield still ban membership to women up to 2017? Controversy basically forced their hand to change this in 2017. But, I wonder if there was much controversy with this policy back in 1990?

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

If some members of a club feel that the club dress code is outdated and out of step with current trends, or indeed if there has been feedback to thr club from visitors to that effect, then the members or the board can raise a motion to have it changed at the club AGM.

My club has very significantly relaxed its clubhouse dress code over the last few years, likewise our playing code is less proscriptive - though less relaxed than the clubhouse code.

 

[Slab]

If some members of a club feel that the club dress code is outdated and out of step with current trends, or indeed if there has been feedback to thr club from visitors to that effect, then the members or the board can raise a motion to have it changed at the club AGM.

My club has very significantly relaxed its clubhouse dress code over the last few years, likewise our playing code is less proscriptive - though less relaxed than the clubhouse code.

But that's not the only way change can happen. That's the way a club would prefer it happens but people in the UK have the right to peaceful dissention and/or non-compliance to act as a catalyst for change

 

[howbow88]

Did the society speak to the course before hand to ensure there would be no issues ?

One of the worst posts I've read on this website. Congratulations.

 

[D-S]

If some members of a club feel that the club dress code is outdated and out of step with current trends, or indeed if there has been feedback to thr club from visitors to that effect, then the members or the board can raise a motion to have it changed at the club AGM.

My club has very significantly relaxed its clubhouse dress code over the last few years, likewise our playing code is less proscriptive - though less relaxed than the clubhouse code.

Our dress code, as many others, has changed significantly over time. None of the changes were ever as a result of any motion at an AGM.

 

[Arthur Wedge]

One of the worst posts I've read on this website. Congratulations.

So you think back in 90’s etc that women were welcome at every single club in the country

 

[Arthur Wedge]

My impression is that the decade when it actually started to change was the 90's when in order to access funding available to sports clubs, clubs had to treat men and women on an equal basis.
Not all clubs immediately followed this route but many did and the social attitudes probably followed.

Unfortunately I think the point has been lost on a few who are unable to see the post was talking about decades gone by

 

[Deleted member 25575]

I don’t remember the exact year but it was either late 90’s or early 00’s.
But regardless of the year, it’s spectacularly missing the point. It’s not about if the society should or shouldn’t have rang up and confirmed if women were allowed to eat in the dining room; it’s about rules and just blindly abiding by them rather than challenging them or going against them.
Just because there is a rule doesn’t automatically mean we have to follow it, it doesn’t mean we can’t question it or push against it.
Just because sexism was rife back in the 90s in golf clubs doesn’t make it any the more acceptable than it should be today, the everyone else is doing it argument is pathetic and weak, much as the we’re just following the rules argument is a huge cop out.

 

[Arthur Wedge]

I don’t remember the exact year but it was either late 90’s or early 00’s.
But regardless of the year, it’s spectacularly missing the point. It’s not about if the society should or shouldn’t have rang up and confirmed if women were allowed to eat in the dining room; it’s about rules and just blindly abiding by them rather than challenging them or going against them.
Just because there is a rule doesn’t automatically mean we have to follow it, it doesn’t mean we can’t question it or push against it.
Just because sexism was rife back in the 90s in golf clubs doesn’t make it any the more acceptable than it should be today, the everyone else is doing it argument is pathetic and weak, much as the we’re just following the rules argument is a huge cop out.

Many have challenged the rules at clubs hence why they have changed , but ignoring the rules because someone doesn’t like them isn’t the right way.

All of you going to eat outside with her is a perfect example of challenging and may have made them sit up and think

And I’m pretty sure most clubs now treat women far better because people challenged the right way

 

[Arthur Wedge]

Our dress code, as many others, has changed significantly over time. None of the changes were ever as a result of any motion at an AGM.

Ours have changed through requests to the committee or the committee themselves felt a need for a change and we have had some through the AGM - jeans and trainers in clubhouses etc

 

[Swango1980]

I don’t remember the exact year but it was either late 90’s or early 00’s.
But regardless of the year, it’s spectacularly missing the point. It’s not about if the society should or shouldn’t have rang up and confirmed if women were allowed to eat in the dining room; it’s about rules and just blindly abiding by them rather than challenging them or going against them.
Just because there is a rule doesn’t automatically mean we have to follow it, it doesn’t mean we can’t question it or push against it.
Just because sexism was rife back in the 90s in golf clubs doesn’t make it any the more acceptable than it should be today, the everyone else is doing it argument is pathetic and weak, much as the we’re just following the rules argument is a huge cop out.

Absolutely nobody in here, I hope, thinks sexism is a good thing today, in the 1980's or the year 1180. That is not what has been said at all.

But, the simple fact is that is existed, and your experience is another good reminder of that. And, the reason it doesn't today is exactly because people fought against it over time. But, you go back a few decades ago, it was so normalised, that most people just got on with things and accepted it (I'm guessing there are things we will accept today that will be considered evil in 30/40 years time). And, because most people accepted it, then there will have genuinely been a time where many golfers would automatically assume there would be rules against women at the club. I'm guessing by the 90's / 00's, we were well on our journey to stopping that sexism, but that there would still be an expectation that some clubs were still behind the times. So, by then, I'd certainly like to think people didn't feel a need to ring ahead to the golf club to check first, but sadly some clubs still had those policies and caught people off guard.

Read up about Kathrine Switzer. In 1967 women were not allowed to run the Boston Marathon. She registered for the race, got a male runner to pick up her number, and went for the run. When it became obvious that a woman was running the race, the race co-director basically assaulted her as he tried to drag her out of the race, mid run (there are photos on Google).

That was before my time, but it is a real eye opener sometimes when you look back at what was considered acceptable not very long ago at all. Hopefully when people talk about the Good Old Days, they don't include things like this? Thankfully, I think all golf clubs have pretty much moved to seeing men and women as equals. meaning that, in today's society, our biggest concerns are whether there are rules about tucking in our shirt or whether our shirt must have a collar.

 

[Alan Clifford]

I will simply claim I identify as a woman, since they get a free pass it seems.

Not that simple. You'll need to put in 20 scores playing of the ladies' rated tees in order to have a ladies' handicap.

 

[Alan Clifford]

I'll have to be non-binary then. That'll stump them as non-binary didn't exist when dress codes were written.

That brings up an interesting and serious question. If you identify as non-binary whilst golf is gender binary, do the rules of golf and handicapping allow you to choose which set of ratings you use and choose whether to have a ladies' or gentlemen's handicap?

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Our dress code, as many others, has changed significantly over time. None of the changes were ever as a result of any motion at an AGM.

Clearly your club had been listening to members requests for change and had decided to implement changes - such things not requiring AGM approval.

…and if members had found the changes unacceptable there would have been a motion raised at an AGM to revert…

 

[Captainron]

Those of you who have cracked the nod for the double Hotchkin Woodhall weekend in June please take note….

Shirts tucked in at all times.
Black socks with shorts are banned!
Caps off in the clubhouse
Jacket and tie not required for any meals

Look forward to it

 

[Swango1980]

Those of you who have cracked the nod for the double Hotchkin Woodhall weekend in June please take note….

Shirts tucked in at all times.
Black socks with shorts are banned!
Caps off in the clubhouse
Jacket and tie not required for any meals

Look forward to it

To be fair, black socks with shorts is a disgrace

 

[KenL]

To be fair, black socks with shorts is a disgrace

Surely white socks with black shoes is a fashion no no?

 

[Singlefiguregokfer]

Surely white socks with black shoes is a fashion no no?

Beige shorts, long grey socks and black formal shoes

 

[Oddsocks]

Those of you who have cracked the nod for the double Hotchkin Woodhall weekend in June please take note….

Shirts tucked in at all times.
Black socks with shorts are banned!
Caps off in the clubhouse
Jacket and tie not required for any meals

Look forward to it

Didn’t realise there was a postal strike

 

[Swango1980]

Surely white socks with black shoes is a fashion no no?

Black shoes is unacceptable to be honest, but forgiven in the winter, when worn with waterproof trousers.

Other things that are simply unacceptable:

Black gloves

Having a golf towel permanently hanging off your belt