LIV Golf

[Deleted member 21445]

[QUOTE="Liverpoolphil, post: 2538251, member: 15344"
It’s disappointing to see the PGAT react this way , they should have faith in their product , the majority of players know the tours are the way to the majors - market that not creating more money[/QUOTE]

Spot On, its the historic events that are the PGA Tours strength so don't neglect and weaken them.
Everyone can nitpick but essentially this plan creates a Liv Tour within the PGA Tour.

So they are proposing to create something they and all of their core supporters have criticised as not proper golf..

Yes stop being non profit, yes bring in the private equity investment,yes increase the purses but in the historic PGA Events and give missed cut players a pay day so they cover expenses and make a few quid.

 

[evemccc]

The YouTube interview of Shipnuck that somebody linked to a week or so ago, was a really good listen

It does sound like that LIV are planning to do some kind of IPL (cricket) thing with the franchises….whether it comes off or not is another thing entirely, but at least it makes more sense than the current LIV teams do

 

[Deleted member 15344]

How have they acted in defence of their own interests? - they've lost multiple big name players to another tour - and instead of attempting to keep them, they've shut the door on them - why did Monaghan never take up Normans offer to speak with them about working together? Why didn't he take the call and negotiate to release players possibly on a limited number of LIV events agreement - so they could still compete on the PGA Tour?

You do realise, that there was perhaps a solution which allowed all the players to get a chance of the LIV money, on a limited event basis, and still being part of the PGA or other tours?

Greg Norman may have a feud with the PGA, but seriously, most people are enjoying LIV for what it is - and won't even give a toss about Gregg Normans agenda, it may well be an issue for him, but personally, I couldn't care less, and I suspect there are plenty more like me.


Let's see just what transpires from that players meeting, but it's already looking like the PLAYERS are wanting changes made which align with what LIV are offering.


Whether people like it or not, the LIV series will be here to stay, and it's in everybodies interests to find a way for ALL the tours to benefit from the extra golf that will be on offer - if you can tell me how Monaghan and the PGAT expect to do that by simply closing their door - I'm all ears.....

It’s only in LIV interest for the tours to work together

All the other tours have worked together for decades until LIV came along

Do you really absolve any issues from LIV and put it all firmly on the shoulders of PGAT ?

Can you tell me what the issue with golf was this time last year and how many social media accounts were posting complaining about it all

 

[Mel Smooth]

It’s only in LIV interest for the tours to work together

All the other tours have worked together for decades until LIV came along

Do you really absolve any issues from LIV and put it all firmly on the shoulders of PGAT ?

Can you tell me what the issue with golf was this time last year and how many social media accounts were posting complaining about it all

No I don't resolve any issues from LIV, they have given something for the PGAT to think about, golf is changing it clearly needed to change, the PGAT is having to react to the demand for change caused by LIV. So what was the issue with golf this time last year - well that's pretty clear, it was dominated and monoplolised by pretty much one product, based predominantly in one country.

Let me tell you, I watched pretty much zero proffesional golf last year barring the odd highlights reel - since LIV came along, I've watched loads, even taking in more of the PGA tours and majors. So tell me, how is that bad for golf?

 

[Deleted member 21445]

The YouTube interview of Shipnuck that somebody linked to a week or so ago, was a really good listen

It does sound like that LIV are planning to do some kind of IPL (cricket) thing with the franchises….whether it comes off or not is another thing entirely, but at least it makes more sense than the current LIV teams do

That was me and yes everyone should listen to this to understand Livs big picture.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

No I don't resolve any issues from LIV, they have given something for the PGAT to think about, golf is changing it clearly needed to change, the PGAT is having to react to the demand for change caused by LIV. So what was the issue with golf this time last year - well that's pretty clear, it was dominated and monoplolised by pretty much one product, based predominantly in one country.

Let me tell you, I watched pretty much zero proffesional golf last year barring the odd highlights reel - since LIV came along, I've watched loads, even taking in more of the PGA tours and majors. So tell me, how is that bad for golf?

Is there a script that all the LIV bots etc are given ?

It’s just a replica of everything read on social media - monopoly ( yet it isn’t ) , dominated in one country ( liv events in the same country )
and then constantly critical of the PGAT - the same tour that has helped create the players that they are looking to poach

So you had zero interest in watching golf and now because of LIV you watch - what shout people that have switched off because of it ? The guys that are appalled by the funding - the amount and where it’s come from - that’s put people off the sport

Read your posts - there isn’t one critical post of LIV with everything being put onto the same PGAT that LIV players and fans wanted to leave ?‍

 

[Mel Smooth]

Is there a script that all the LIV bots etc are given ?

It’s just a replica of everything read on social media - monopoly ( yet it isn’t ) , dominated in one country ( liv events in the same country )
and then constantly critical of the PGAT - the same tour that has helped create the players that they are looking to poach

So you had zero interest in watching golf and now because of LIV you watch - what shout people that have switched off because of it ? The guys that are appalled by the funding - the amount and where it’s come from - that’s put people off the sport

Read your posts - there isn’t one critical post of LIV with everything being put onto the same PGAT that LIV players and fans wanted to leave ?‍

Lol, so I'm a LIV bot am I, and so by default, you accept you are a PGA bot then?

How much criticising of the PGA have I done, of their actual events? I've criticised their stance - that's it. I've made a pretty detailed explanation on this thread about the money and source of it on the LIV series. You accuse me of being one sided (which I am) without seeing the hypocrisy that you take the exact opposite stance as I do - it all forms part of the debate.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

The YouTube interview of Shipnuck that somebody linked to a week or so ago, was a really good listen

It does sound like that LIV are planning to do some kind of IPL (cricket) thing with the franchises….whether it comes off or not is another thing entirely, but at least it makes more sense than the current LIV teams do

The franchise is going to be a tough sell in an individual sport - they were talking £1bn to buy a team - it’s just not going to work imo

 

[Deleted member 21445]

No I don't resolve any issues from LIV, they have given something for the PGAT to think about, golf is changing it clearly needed to change, the PGAT is having to react to the demand for change caused by LIV. So what was the issue with golf this time last year - well that's pretty clear, it was dominated and monoplolised by pretty much one product, based predominantly in one country.

Let me tell you, I watched pretty much zero proffesional golf last year barring the odd highlights reel - since LIV came along, I've watched loads, even taking in more of the PGA tours and majors. So tell me, how is that bad for golf?

Mel you never acknowledge any plus points of the PGA Tour for the game of golf of which there are plenty.

Yes Liv is bringing something different to the table that some like and some don't like, I'm more in the like than dislike but the PGA Tour still has a lot of important plus points that need to be retained for the greater good of the game.

 

[Deleted member 21445]

The franchise is going to be a tough sell in an individual sport - they were talking £1bn to buy a team - it’s just not going to work imo

I heard more recently 50-100m per team and the teams are going to be more countries/continent based.

All makes more sense as Golfers in said countries who LIKE Liv will identify with their team..
So South African fans will get behind The Stingers.
South Americans will get behind Ortiz, Ancer, Nieman and Mito Pereira (both rumoured to be switching)
I think Majestics will swap out Stenson for Casey to have an all English Team
Etc etc

 

[fenwayrich]

No I don't resolve any issues from LIV, they have given something for the PGAT to think about, golf is changing it clearly needed to change, the PGAT is having to react to the demand for change caused by LIV. So what was the issue with golf this time last year - well that's pretty clear, it was dominated and monoplolised by pretty much one product, based predominantly in one country.

Let me tell you, I watched pretty much zero proffesional golf last year barring the odd highlights reel - since LIV came along, I've watched loads, even taking in more of the PGA tours and majors. So tell me, how is that bad for golf?

So you didn't previously have any interest in watching the likes of Collin Morikawa, John Rahm, Rory McIlroy and Justin Thomas, but inspired by a bunch of has beens and journeymen playing irrelevant exhibition events for bucket loads of dirty money, you are now an avid golf viewer? How strange.

I've been a golf fanatic since I first visited the Dunlop Masters at Ganton in 1975 (Bernard Gallacher won it!). I still look at it most Sunday evenings on Sky, and will continue to do so. The 54 tour is parody of our great game, so I'll give that a miss.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Lol, so I'm a LIV bot am I, and so by default, you accept you are a PGA bot then?

How much criticising of the PGA have I done, of their actual events? I've criticised their stance - that's it. I've made a pretty detailed explanation on this thread about the money and source of it on the LIV series. You accuse me of being one sided (which I am) without seeing the hypocrisy that you take the exact opposite stance as I do - it all forms part of the debate.

I’m not a massive fan of the PGAT and if you had been around before LIV was invented you would have seen many on here including me have been very critical of the PGAT

But you take the defence of LIV to the extreme - you can’t see any negative at all , the issues with GN , players suing tours and suing commentators and media channels - and can’t see all the good stuff the PGAT has done over decades for the sport

 

[Deleted member 1147]

Golf is a meritocracy, the best players move to the top tour.
They start on different, lower level, tours around the globe, and then promote to the top table if they are good enough.

LIV is the equivalent of medals for participation. They’ve been handing out starts and money to nobodies, who haven’t yet earned their stripes.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

I heard more recently 50-100m per team and the teams are going to be more countries/continent based.

All makes more sense as Golfers in said countries who LIKE Liv will identify with their team..
So South African fans will get behind The Stingers.
South Americans will get behind Ortiz, Ancer, Nieman and Mito Pereira (both rumoured to be switching)
I think Majestics will swap out Stenson for Casey to have an all English Team
Etc etc

It’s a tough sport to try and create team ethos and support - the likes of IPL etc just had to add the teams as the support was already there - it helps it’s all concentrated into one country and using cities

The hundred has had mixed reception with many cricket fans turning off

It works when it comes to the Ryder Cup as it’s historic and two big nations going at each other for one week every two years - even the Presidents Cup doesn’t really grab much interest and that can’t create the same rivalry as the RC

 

[Deleted member 21445]

It’s a tough sport to try and create team ethos and support - the likes of IPL etc just had to add the teams as the support was already there - it helps it’s all concentrated into one country and using cities

The hundred has had mixed reception with many cricket fans turning off

It works when it comes to the Ryder Cup as it’s historic and two big nations going at each other for one week every two years - even the Presidents Cup doesn’t really grab much interest and that can’t create the same rivalry as the RC

I honestly can in time (and it does need time) see it working and giving an extra dynamic to a golf event

 

[RRidges]

I honestly can in time (and it does need time) see it working and giving an extra dynamic to a golf event

I hope it doesn't!
It's currently, by a long distance, the worst part of the concept! I have expected some sort of enhancement to the concept, as a way of gaining legitimate/non-Saudi funding, for a while now. But, to me, it'll only mean that announcers mention team scores even more than they currently do - which I already detest!

 

[Deleted member 15344]

I honestly can in time (and it does need time) see it working and giving an extra dynamic to a golf event

In theory people support their country etc but these teams won’t be “country based” as such- there will be a team from Japan or Aus etc but how many Us players or English players etc - and then the names they have come up with , just horrific. Team sports have a lot of tribalism etc attached to it and people associate with local teams or support teams that family members etc - starting all that from scratch it’s a tough ask

 

[Backsticks]

The team schtick is the single worst idea Saudi Tour has had.

Golf isnt a team game ! Stop trying to make Teams happen LIV !

.......In a way I like that they have it though........its great for having a laugh at LIVs cluelessness......it is the indisputable indicator of how disconnected from golf they really are. Probably dreamt up by a sheik. The rubbish names are just a bonus. With all the money behind it, how could they come up with something that bad ?????

 

[RRidges]

The team schtick is the single worst idea Saudi Tour has had.

Golf isnt a team game ! Stop trying to make Teams happen LIV !

.......In a way I like that they have it though........its great for having a laugh at LIVs cluelessness......it is the indisputable indicator of how disconnected from golf they really are. Probably dreamt up by a sheik. The rubbish names are just a bonus. With all the money behind it, how could they come up with something that bad ?????

And the scoring format is rubbish too - only best 2 counting on days 1&2 and 1 getting a reprieve for not playing well on day 3!

 

[Backsticks]

And the scoring format is rubbish too - only best 2 counting on days 1&2 and 1 getting a reprieve for not playing well on day 3!

Thanks, I didnt even know the scoring, but that is woeful. The whole team thing must be a great embarrassment to all who have to push it, whether players, commentators, Greg. They know its farcical, but have to suspend belief to try to stick to the party line. The eye rolling in the commentary booth must be terrific.