Grenfell “Bonfire”

[IanM]

I wasnt an arguement, it was a statement about my lack of understanding the actual legal position.

But you summed it up in the last sentence.... trivialising the deaths of 74 people is beneath contempt. Why the blooming heck could anyone do that?

 

[Old Skier]

In your example historical context matters hugely given the fact that white supremacists perpetrated many lynchings of blacks - and with the KKK and such as Charlottesville showing that sense of superiority being still prevalent, I don't think the comparison is particularly valid.

So your saying that it's ok to burn poor old Trump but doing the same to an effigy of Obama is wrong. I see your still unable to achieve a balance view in your posts.

It's a valid point but you don't agree with it so it's not valid.

 

[Hobbit]

I wasnt an arguement, it was a statement about my lack of understanding the actual legal position.

But you summed it up in the last sentence.... trivialising the deaths of 74 people is beneath contempt. Why the blooming heck could anyone do that?

God knows why anyone would see humour in it. As much as I think there's a fair bit in the Public Order laws that are a bit out of step I am thankful for the moral compass it provides on occasions like this.

 

[Deleted member 18121]

But you summed it up in the last sentence.... trivialising the deaths of 74 people is beneath contempt. Why the blooming heck could anyone do that?

this is the part that I'm trying to get my head around for this matter - how long after 9/11 did it take for comedians to make jokes without recourse? 5-6-7 years? Was it even that long? People laughed, as is their right to do......no matter what I (or anyone feels about the subject matter),.

Is it simply a case of this event being too soon and too raw? Would there be the same outrage if this was 7 years time. would there be the same outrage if tower block was in the north of england and full of white residents.

One thing I'm waiting for in the next 2-3 days is news that these people have lost their jobs having been sacked.

 

[Jamesbrown]

I can understand people thinking it’s bad taste, bad morals. But why people get offended by it. I don’t know.
People will find it funny, some won’t. Move on.

 

[User 99]

One thing I'm waiting for in the next 2-3 days is news that these people have lost their jobs having been sacked.

If liverpoolphil had his way he'd have them stoned to death publicly

 

[Fade and Die]

Are people really trying to compare this to burning an effigy of a politician ?!

People died ffs - 74 people of various colour race and religion died through no fault of their own and now sick deranged scum are mocking that with both disgusting and racist behaviour - it’s a public order offence and I hope they all get what they deserve when the punishments are handed out to them.

Unless there's some racial aspect -- the victims being mainly ethnic minorities -- there's nothing illegal going on there, just horrifically poor taste.
If there's nothing overtly hateful the Police should not be involved.
If they actually get charged, it's worrying times we live in; The rule of law replaced by mob offence.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Unless there's some racial aspect -- the victims being mainly ethnic minorities -- there's nothing illegal going on there, just horrifically poor taste.
If there's nothing overtly hateful the Police should not be involved.
If they actually get charged, it's worrying times we live in; The rule of law replaced by mob offence.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-46112026

Doesn’t have to contain a racial aspect

It seems it’s all order section 5 of causing offence and distress so yep it’s a crime and yep it’s illegal hence why they have been arrested

 

[user2010]

It was a very sick joke, inspired, but very very sick.

 

[Fade and Die]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-46112026

Doesn’t have to contain a racial aspect

It seems it’s all order section 5 of causing offence and distress so yep it’s a crime and yep it’s illegal hence why they have been arrested

Interesting read, I think the important bit is the line about causing offence “with intent”
I think there is no chance of a successful prosecution, just the police have to be seen to act in light of the outcry.

 

[bluewolf]

I can understand people thinking it’s bad taste, bad morals. But why people get offended by it. I don’t know.
People will find it funny, some won’t. Move on.

Families, friends etc will be hugely offended I suspect. Then there are those who may be offended on their behalf. Then there are the majority who understand and empathise with those who are offended.

This is not simply a case of what is usually lazily referred to as "professional offence". Being offended and understanding why something is offensive are 2 different things.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

this is the part that I'm trying to get my head around for this matter - how long after 9/11 did it take for comedians to make jokes without recourse? 5-6-7 years? Was it even that long? People laughed, as is their right to do......no matter what I (or anyone feels about the subject matter),.

Is it simply a case of this event being too soon and too raw? Would there be the same outrage if this was 7 years time. would there be the same outrage if tower block was in the north of england and full of white residents.

One thing I'm waiting for in the next 2-3 days is news that these people have lost their jobs having been sacked.

I don't think I have ever heard a 9/11 joke. Not being puritanical, I really haven't. I like a bit of dark humour but I can't see that you can get anything funny out of that event or Grenfell, or pretty much any major tragedy.

 

[User 99]

Jesus Christ there are some seriously tight people on this forum, some of you really need to lighten up, must be a riot to play golf with

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

It is easy to be affected by Grenfell even if you have no linkage to it or any of the families involved.

My work is based in the BBC TV Centre up Wood Lane. In the early days following the fire - when the scaffolding and covering was not on - it was a horrible sight to behold as I walked from White City Underground. Even more so at night when all around it buildings were lit up - and there - dark, glowering and deathly black in their midst - you could see Grenfell Tower. The sight was genuinely upsetting.

And so to have a laugh about it is beyond the pale. But that is for these individuals and their consciences now that their behaviour and crassness has been exposed.

 

[bluewolf]

I don't think I have ever heard a 9/11 joke. Not being puritanical, I really haven't. I like a bit of dark humour but I can't see that you can get anything funny out of that event or Grenfell, or pretty much any major tragedy.

That's pretty much what I was thinking. I've not heard one and I definitely haven't told one. It's not something I've ever really considered. It'd be interesting to know which other tragedies people are happy to joke about.

 

[User 99]

. It'd be interesting to know which other tragedies people are happy to joke about.

Have you heard any Madaline McCann jokes ? If not, then you've probably been living under a stone since she went missing. What about Jimmy Saville, guess you've not heard any jokes about him either

 

[bluewolf]

Have you heard any Madaline McCann jokes ? If not, then you've probably been living under a stone since she went missing. What about Jimmy Saville, guess you've not heard any jokes about him either

A few I suppose. Maybe you're right and I'm wrong. I'll admit it if it's true.
How about the Ibrox disaster, or Bradford...... or Hillsborough. Are they ok?

 

[drdel]

If you have not experienced distastful jokes I guess you’ve never met teenagers, University students, rugby players, soldiers or medics. There's some pretty sick stuff but very funny stuff about.

 

[bluewolf]

If you have not experienced distastful jokes I guess you’ve never met teenagers, University students, rugby players, soldiers or medics. There's some pretty sick stuff but very funny stuff about.

That didn't answer my question.

And I'm an ex rugby playing, ex uni student. Maybe we just mix in different circles.

 

[User 99]

A few I suppose. Maybe you're right and I'm wrong. I'll admit it if it's true.
How about the Ibrox disaster, or Bradford...... or Hillsborough. Are they ok?

Football tragedies will always evoke certain emotions dependant on, I guess what team you support. I'd be fairly confident that Celtic fans have cracked many a joke about the Ibrox disaster, much like Man U fans have about Hillsborough and Liverpool fans about Munich, what's funny to some is crass and disgusting to others, is that a crime ?