Card retention

[Banchory Buddha]

People are capable of fiddling with GPS devices on the course, often an app on their phone. But incapable of entering their score on an app. The slow moving progress of golf in the 21st century

The slow moving progress of tech take-up in the 21st century is the point you've missed. We are probably 20 years if not more away from everyone having a smart phone on them

 

[sjw]

We had digital verification, it was disastrous, folk just don't check. They do check a written card.

No one is saying that paper cards have to be removed entirely. The WHOLE THREAD (because you seem to have gone off track) is about the fact that for some perplexing reason, paper cards may still have to be retained.

I notice no comment on your claim that pocket computers are the norm?

The slow moving progress of tech take-up in the 21st century is the point you've missed. We are probably 20 years if not more away from everyone having a smart phone on them

We are probably less than 20 years from everyone too technophobe to use a mobile phone having given up the game.

How old are you, may I ask? Can you imagine anyone under 30 wanting to use a paper card over an app? Have you heard of anyone under the age of, let's say 50, concerned about taking a mobile phone out in "the elements", as someone (maybe you) postulated?

Technology is moving on, I'm afraid, and old solutions will be left in the past. Do you think office workers do their calculations on paper and then put them into a spreadsheet?

 

[jim8flog]

I know this thread has gone way off track.

I have a smart phone but I simply find pencil and card so much quicker. The game is slow enough these days without adding an extra minute or two at each hole.

 

[Banchory Buddha]

No one is saying that paper cards have to be removed entirely. The WHOLE THREAD (because you seem to have gone off track) is about the fact that for some perplexing reason, paper cards may still have to be retained.





We are probably less than 20 years from everyone too technophobe to use a mobile phone having given up the game.

How old are you, may I ask? Can you imagine anyone under 30 wanting to use a paper card over an app? Have you heard of anyone under the age of, let's say 50, concerned about taking a mobile phone out in "the elements", as someone (maybe you) postulated?

Technology is moving on, I'm afraid, and old solutions will be left in the past. Do you think office workers do their calculations on paper and then put them into a spreadsheet?

I'm 56, and as long ago as 2002 I was working for a tech company, so possibly wind yer neck in.

Two of our most troublesome members with the SG App (both old and new) have been under 25, so age isn't the issue here

I didn't mention weather at all, I mentioned that many don't have a SMARTphone (not a mobile phone), and anyone 60 now can easily still have 20+ years in them. It's also tbf, much clumsier than a paper scorecard, and slower, and a nightmare when signals drop. Sometimes progress isn't progress

 

[Banchory Buddha]

I know this thread has gone way off track.

I have a smart phone but I simply find pencil and card so much quicker. The game is slow enough these days without adding an extra minute or two at each hole.

Absolutely this

 

[sjw]

I'm 56, and as long ago as 2002 I was working for a tech company, so possibly wind yer neck in.

Two of our most troublesome members with the SG App (both old and new) have been under 25, so age isn't the issue here

I didn't mention weather at all, I mentioned that many don't have a SMARTphone (not a mobile phone), and anyone 60 now can easily still have 20+ years in them. It's also tbf, much clumsier than a paper scorecard, and slower, and a nightmare when signals drop. Sometimes progress isn't progress

I work with numerous people who are 56 or over, also for a tech company. Having seen them use and heard them talk about technology, I'm not sure you've got one over on me there as much as you think you might have done.

Likewise, I never said electronic scorecards should be the norm, or the be all and end all, or get rid of paper cards entirely. Simply that we shouldn't need to retain paper cards in 2023 (which is, again, what the original post was about). It's a nonsense.

 

[Imurg]

Soooo......hold onto cards for 12 months so they can be used during the Annual Review.....
OK...I'd love to see the face of the person who has to trawl through nigh on 20k scorecards to find those from someone who's been flagged up.....
Would be a picture....

 

[Banchory Buddha]

I work with numerous people who are 56 or over, also for a tech company. Having seen them use and heard them talk about technology, I'm not sure you've got one over on me there as much as you think you might have done.

Likewise, I never said electronic scorecards should be the norm, or the be all and end all, or get rid of paper cards entirely. Simply that we shouldn't need to retain paper cards in 2023 (which is, again, what the original post was about). It's a nonsense.

So not been involved in club administration then? I had friends tried to tell me (from a club that has done away with scorecards) how much better it is. I assured them that for checking it very much is not. Incidentally this same club introduced an admin fee for every medal last year, how strange when if what you say is correct then it'd be a doddle to administer eh?

 

[Golfnut1957]

Soooo......hold onto cards for 12 months so they can be used during the Annual Review.....
OK...I'd love to see the face of the person who has to trawl through nigh on 20k scorecards to find those from someone who's been flagged up.....
Would be a picture....

What about the bloke who thought he had won the monthly medal back in March only to find himself disqualified in December.

 

[sjw]

So not been involved in club administration then? I had friends tried to tell me (from a club that has done away with scorecards) how much better it is. I assured them that for checking it very much is not. Incidentally this same club introduced an admin fee for every medal last year, how strange when if what you say is correct then it'd be a doddle to administer eh?

Perhaps I'm not understanding what needs checking?

 

[Banchory Buddha]

Perhaps I'm not understanding what needs checking?

yup

But hey you've an office full of 50+ year olds who you patronise too, so why change here?

 

[AussieKB]

My collection of scorecards for courses that I have played will become priceless, I also use them to check on how the course has changed over time, length etc.

 

[nickjdavis]

Being really pedantic, how can you verify the marker’s identity unlesss you get all members to provide specimen signatures every year? Most of my mates have very strange squiggles

We actually ask our markers to print their names (as well as sign) for this very reason....utterly fed up with trying to decipher unintelligible scribbling that could say Mickey Mouse for all we know.

 

[Alan Clifford]

Soooo......hold onto cards for 12 months so they can be used during the Annual Review.....
OK...I'd love to see the face of the person who has to trawl through nigh on 20k scorecards to find those from someone who's been flagged up.....
Would be a picture....

Actually a picture would be good. Would taking a photo of each card count as retaining the cards? And with proper filenames or metatdata, searching electronically for specific cards would be easier.

 

[rulefan]

Actually a picture would be good. Would taking a photo of each card count as retaining the cards? And with proper filenames or metatdata, searching electronically for specific cards would be easier.

Better ask EG as they are the ones who made the ruling.

 

[IJames]

EG have ruled "Scorecards must be kept up until the following annual review before they are discarded".
Presumably they mean after the review has been completed

At least EG are 'moving with the times' somewhat, unlike a number of members on here!, though I believe clubs with PSI terminals shouldn't need to retain cards for long at all - not even until next AR! Systems associated with PSI have all the facilities to enable ARs to be performed without cards, imo. The only element possibly that might be missing is the confirmation of Marker's signature - which can be a rapid process performed shortly after the comp is closed and before it is finalised.

 

[Alan Clifford]

Better ask EG as they are the ones who made the ruling.

EG would reply with, "I am happy to answer the question but should should go through the proper channels. You should ask you club and , if they don't know, they should ask the country". So EG are not happy to help and don't. I have never had an answer via the proper channels either.

 

[rulefan]

EG would reply with, "I am happy to answer the question but should should go through the proper channels. You should ask you club and , if they don't know, they should ask the country". So EG are not happy to help and don't. I have never had an answer via the proper channels either.

I got the ruling by asking EG WHS support directly.

 

[LizAig]

Have they actually set up the facility yet. I heard a short while ago they were still thinking about it.

Yes - I think it was around September that clubs were told to turn the setting on via a pop up on the Club V1 admin website and then a reminder a couple of months later

 

[LizAig]

We use the Club V1 system. We name our marker prior to submitting the score, while the score will immediately appear on the competition leader board and on my EG account, it is not accepted for handicap purposes until it has been verified by the marker.

That’s my understanding of how it’s supposed to happen …..it’s just not happening that way at our club - Instead we have to use app/website and also submit a card.