WHS working well for me

[Biggleswade Blue]

So, you are happy adjusting handicaps based on the subjective opinion of others. Interesting. I'd be shocked if many markers even bother providing committee that additional information. I mean, it is not uncommon for a marker to remember one or 2 good shots and generalise the player by saying "they could have done much better, hit some good shots out there". Very rare they say "they were lucky, won't shoot a round that low for a long long time". So, if Committee were to take commentary from a marker, they'd probably dock every new member additional shots.

Our Committee do not have time contacting new members, and the people they know, to try and build up a story on what their golfing potential may be. They hand in 3 scores, they get a handicap. We spend enough time reviewing all the general scores that keep coming in from all members, chasing No Returned Cards, etc.

I am reluctant to make any adjustments to a players handicap, calculated by WHS, unless it appears a player is avoiding acceptable rounds, but doing very very well in competitions like match play. Furthermore, it does not matter if a player is young (potentially ageist) or having lessons, because they've ultimately handed in 3 likely recent cards (so they should take those lessons into account). Once they get a handicap, they may start having lessons. But, surely you do not expect the Committee to keep in regular contact with all members, especially new ones, just to find out they are having lessons, and if so maybe dock them a few more shots?

I seriously doubt many club committees do this. Instead, we largely rely on the WHS calculation. IF Committees do need to make further adjustments, then it essentially confirms what we have been discussing. That the WHS calculation itself is not fit for purpose for new golfers.

I wonder if England Golf will contact markers and asked for their opinions on the players ability and history when this nomad handicap scheme is in full swing?

As a new entrant in Club membership, every time I have played a round in competition, or as a general play round with established members, I have always had the comment "you are better than your handicap". However, I know have 8 rounds in,so two counting, and the counting rounds are round 2 and round 8, within 0.5 of a shot of each other. Subjective opinion isn't always reliable! I might get a silly low nett score today, but if I do, it'd be the best of my last 8 rounds.

The whole point of a handicap competition is whether you can play better than you ever have before so it is firstly a competition with yourself. The competition with others element is whether your better is better than someone else's better as defined by the handicap rules whatever they may be. And whatever they are is always prone to discussion and debate. The issue as I have seen is that so many have got used over many years to one handicap system, that they now compare the new handicap system to that. Whish isn't helpful as they are simply different.

 

[rulefan]

In my time on the handicap committee I have loads of people ask me to check such and such a players handicap based upon one good score. I have never decreased a player players handicap once.

Given that CONGU said not to, why would anyone?

 

[Depreston]

If you had a handicap index that is a single figure say 9.2
but you haven’t played a round without less than 10 shots

Would you categorise yourself as a single figure golfer

 

[sweaty sock]

Yep, handicap index is the measure. We've got guys at my club claiming HI9.9 is single figures!

 

[Orikoru]

Yep, handicap index is the measure. We've got guys at my club claiming HI9.9 is single figures!

Well they're wrong, because that makes 10 in my book? I would say you're single figure if 9.4 or lower index.

 

[jim8flog]

If you had a handicap index that is a single figure say 9.2
but you haven’t played a round without less than 10 shots

Would you categorise yourself as a single figure golfer

On any course where the slope rating is 113 a players H.I. = their CH, so 9.4 or better is single figure.


A player could be considered single figure on one course but not another course depending on the slope rating.

 

[sweaty sock]

After a pretty normal start to the season, the last few weeks our place is getting absolutely decimated. 40 points is lucky to get a top ten.... True, conditions have been good but I've never seen scores like this on such a regular basis.... hopefully it calms down soon because the volatility in handicaps is really making me lose interest in both my and others handicaps!

 

[jim8flog]

After a pretty normal start to the season, the last few weeks our place is getting absolutely decimated. 40 points is lucky to get a top ten.... True, conditions have been good but I've never seen scores like this on such a regular basis.... hopefully it calms down soon because the volatility in handicaps is really making me lose interest in both my and others handicaps!

I can remember a time on our course (when the handicap limit to play was 24) you had to score in the low net 60s to win in medals. We only had 2 comps a month in those days, one you played either Saturday or Sunday (same comp and you could only play one of the days) and one midweek. Supplementary Scores did not exist. Now we have plenty of opportunity to put in scores it is only the handicap protecting bandits that one has to worry about and with the WHS it is very hard to protect your handicap and win.

 

[Swango1980]

After a pretty normal start to the season, the last few weeks our place is getting absolutely decimated. 40 points is lucky to get a top ten.... True, conditions have been good but I've never seen scores like this on such a regular basis.... hopefully it calms down soon because the volatility in handicaps is really making me lose interest in both my and others handicaps!

Are these high scores generally people new to golf with high initial handicaps, or a mixed spread of new and experienced golfers with an extensive scoring history?

 

[JonnyGutteridge]

15 out of the top 20 in our Stableford at the weekend were <=10 handicap.
50% of the field had a handicap of <=10 (110 entrants)

11 out of the top 20 were <=5 handicap.
30 out of 110 entrants had <=5 handicap.

It seems low handicappers were ridiculously over represented at the top of the leaderboard. Slightly damp conditions, slower/softish greens, less roll on the fairways; plays into hands of the low guys?

Position / Pts / Handicap
1st 39 (4)
2nd 38 (0)
3rd 38 (4)
4th 37 (6)
5th 36 (2)
6th 35 (3)
7th 35 (25)
8th 35 (-1)
9th 35 (12)
10th 35 (13)
11th 34 (1)
12th 34 (7)
13th 34 (3)
14th 34 (8)
15th 34 (11)
16th 34 (10)
17th 34 (3)
18th 33 (4)
19th 33 (16)
20th 33 (2)

 

[BubbaP]

If you had a handicap index that is a single figure say 9.2
but you haven’t played a round without less than 10 shots

Would you categorise yourself as a single figure golfer

Possibly depends on the age/length of time in the game of the person. I'd go for when you receive 9 shots or fewer on the course. But in a short while I expect a HI of 9.4 or lower will be the bar.
It doesn't really matter in the grand scheme of things ?

 

[davidy233]

Everyone I've seen moan about WHS are the same people who would have moaned about giving full handicap in a match before it came in - invariably 4/5 to 9 handicappers who think they are good at golf (they aren't really - just better than hackers)- the good golfers at my place (scratch to plus figures) don't care because about your handicap because they know they can beat someone who will make mistakes

 

[Orikoru]

Saw this yesterday and had to laugh.



Course record and came 2nd.

 

[Swango1980]

After joining a new club last week, played 3 rounds and submitted scores for handicap. Pre registered on howdidido, entered score on howdidido and submitted physical signed cards in relevant box at club.

However, it seems that someone at club has picked up the physical cards and entered my scores again in the system, thus duplicating them. Furthermore, they have also entered every other players score onto the system (played in 3 balls each time, so the scores for the other 2 players), despite none of them pre registering or intending to submit score.

Seems it is going to take a while for the system to start working seamlessly, my new club is certainly one with a great reputation, one in which I've no doubt is run very well.

 

[Biggleswade Blue]

After joining a new club last week, played 3 rounds and submitted scores for handicap. Pre registered on howdidido, entered score on howdidido and submitted physical signed cards in relevant box at club.

However, it seems that someone at club has picked up the physical cards and entered my scores again in the system, thus duplicating them. Furthermore, they have also entered every other players score onto the system (played in 3 balls each time, so the scores for the other 2 players), despite none of them pre registering or intending to submit score.

Seems it is going to take a while for the system to start working seamlessly, my new club is certainly one with a great reputation, one in which I've no doubt is run very well.

At our club, I was not allowed to enter my own scores for my first three cards to handicap at the back end of last year. They had to be submitted as actual scorecards to the club to get me set up (we use IG) and my CDH number etc. Not even sure that a formal "pre registration" for these first three cards is needed, even though I did so.

 

[IanM]

Back to normal pre covid card marking yesterday.

I keyed my score into the terminal in the clubhouse, (Masterscoreboard) and it was on the Wales Golf portal immediately. BUT not on the Master Scoreboard mobile app ..seems odd!

However, handicap index is stable and logical provided you don't start trying to unravel the reasoning ?

 

[rosecott]

At our club, I was not allowed to enter my own scores for my first three cards to handicap at the back end of last year. They had to be submitted as actual scorecards to the club to get me set up (we use IG) and my CDH number etc. Not even sure that a formal "pre registration" for these first three cards is needed, even though I did so.

There is no requirement for players to pre-register prior to playing a round that is used to determine the Initial Handicap.

 

[rulefan]

At our club, I was not allowed to enter my own scores for my first three cards to handicap at the back end of last year. They had to be submitted as actual scorecards to the club to get me set up (we use IG) and my CDH number etc. Not even sure that a formal "pre registration" for these first three cards is needed, even though I did so.

Was this pre or post WHS transition?

 

[Biggleswade Blue]

Post WHS. I’ve never had a CONGU handicap. My three cards all went under WHS.

 

[IanM]

... first thing this morning I see my HI had dropped another 0.1 from the initial reduction after Saturday's comp. (PCC was 0) Any ideas?

The start sheet at Burnham for the Open on Wednesday already shows this lower HI too.... does it get a feed from IG?

My "8 from 20" are all within 3 shots of each other. That surprises, but encourages me!