rulefan
Tour Winner
It all boils down to the timing of the information given re EGs ruling at the time. It is now 50%.
Qualifying Comps - winter CONGU 4.1g
- Thread starter 3offTheTee
- Start date
Old Skier
Tour Winner
Perhaps if EG or the counties were more better at passing this kind of information to clubs the confusion might disappear. Perhaps they could even have it published on their web site as well. Individual phone calls and emails is apoor way to run an organisation.
So to clarify some earlier comments, you can have a qualifier with preferred lies (pick, clean & place) on closely mowed areas but not in the rough, how about pick, clean & drop in the rough?
Have you heard the expression "replace" used in the rules, more so again where the rough is concerned?
Have you heard the expression "replace" used in the rules, more so again where the rough is concerned?
D
Deleted member 15344
Guest
Can't have Qualifer if there is a local rule saying you can lift and clean in rough and either drop or place.
Any comp with those in force will be a non Qualifer and no HCs can change
Any comp with those in force will be a non Qualifer and no HCs can change
D
Deleted member 15344
Guest
From an e mail sent out by EGU
Bunkers marked as GUR.
This has caused some debate within CONGU as to the impact of Bunkers can have on a competition retaining it qualifying status.
CONGU state that when `some bunkers` are out of play due to maintenance, and are marked as GUR an qualifying competition can be played.
What counts as some?
CONGU have struggled to define this, so England Golf advise that if more than 50% of bunkers are out of play due to maintenance or weather conditions then the competition must be declared as a non-qualifier.
CONGU had previously suggested that all bunkers could be out of play but this is likely to have an effect on the SSS/CSS and this also goes against a ruling from the R&A re flooded bunkers ( See below)
Local Rule Providing Relief Without Penalty from Bunker Filled with Casual Water
Question:
May a Committee make a Local Rule allowing a player to drop out of any bunker filled with casual water, without penalty, contrary to Rule 25-1b(ii)?
Answer:
No. The Committee may not make a Local Rule providing generally that flooded bunkers are ground under repair through the green, as such a Local Rule waives a penalty imposed by the Rules of Golf, contrary to Rule 33-8b.
However, in exceptional circumstances, where certain specific bunkers are completely flooded and there is no reasonable likelihood of the bunkers drying up during the round, the Committee may introduce a Local Rule providing relief without penalty from specific bunkers. Prior to introducing such a Local Rule, the Committee must be convinced that such exceptional circumstances exist and that providing relief without penalty from specific bunkers is more appropriate than simply applying Rule 25-1b(ii). If the Committee elects to introduce a Local Rule, the following wording is suggested:
“The flooded bunker on [insert location of bunker; e.g. left of 5th green]is ground under repair. If a player’s ball lies in that bunker or if that bunker interferes with the player’s stance or the area of his intended swing and the player wishes to take relief, he must take relief outside the bunker, without penalty, in accordance with Rule 25-1b(i). All other bunkers on the course, regardless of whether they contain water, maintain their status as hazards and the Rules apply accordingly.â€
In a competition played over more than one round, such a Local Rule maybe introduced or rescinded between rounds.
Old Skier
Tour Winner
I thought if it was lift clean and drop in the rough it was ok if stated in the local rule - every day's a school day.
D
Deleted member 15344
Guest
Only for embedded ball I believe and this is the wording for the Preffered lie
The following local rule wording must be used:
’A ball lying on a closely mown area through the green may be lifted without penalty and cleaned. Before lifting the ball, the player must mark its position. Having lifted the
ball, he must place it on a spot within 6 inches [150mm] of and not nearer the hole than where it originally lay, that is not in a hazard and not on a putting green.
A player may place his ball only once, and it is in play when it has been placed (Rule 20-4). If the ball fails to come to rest on the spot on which it is placed, Rule 20-3d applies. If the ball when placed comes to rest on the spot on which it is placed and it subsequently moves, there is no penalty and the ball must be played as it lies, unless the provisions of any other Rule apply. If the player fails to mark the position of the ball before lifting it or moves the ball in any other manner, such as rolling it with a club, he incurs a penalty of one stroke.`
Note: ’Closely Mown Area†means any area of the course, including paths through the rough, cut to fairway height or less.
Penalty for breach of Local Rule: Match play – Loss of hole; Stroke play – Two strokes
If a player incurs the general penalty for a breach of this Local Rule, no additional penalty under the Local Rule is applied‘
Note: Competition Play Conditions will only apply when the specified area is within six inches (150 mm). See Clause 15.3
Old Skier
Tour Winner
Confusing, I'll raise you this:
Course
conditions, including mud and extreme wetness, may interfere with proper playing of the game and warrant relief for an embedded ball anywhere through the green
.Rule 25-2 provides relief, without penalty, for a ball embedded in its own pitch-mark in any closely-mown area through the green
. On the putting green
, a ball may be lifted and damage caused by the impact of a ball may be repaired (Rules 16-1b and c). When permission to take relief for an embedded ball anywhere through the green
would be warranted, the following Local Rule is recommended:“Through the green
, a ball that is embedded may be lifted, cleaned and dropped, without penalty, as near as possible to the spot where it lay but not nearer the hole
. The ball when dropped must first strike a part of the course
through the green
.Note: A ball is “embedded†when it is in its own pitch-mark and part of the ball is below the level of the ground. A ball does not necessarily have to touch the soil to be embedded (e.g. grass, loose impediments
and the like may intervene between the ball and the soil).
D
Deleted member 15344
Guest
Clubs bring in the embedded ball LR to alongside Preffered lies so you can lift clean and drop but only for embedded ball
So in a nut shell you can have a qualifier with preferred lies on closely mown areas and you can lift clean and drop from the rough only if the ball was embedded, otherwise in the rough it's as it lies.
Old Skier
Tour Winner
As I understand it.
D
Deleted member 15344
Guest
Yep ( my first post wasn't specfic enough :thup: )
rulefan
Tour Winner
However, if the following Local Rule is in force, qualifiers may be played.
[h=4]c. Cleaning Ball[/h]Conditions, such as extreme wetness causing significant amounts of mud to adhere to the ball, may be such that permission to lift, clean and replace the ball would be appropriate. In these circumstances, the following Local Rule is recommended:
"(Specify area, e.g., at the 6th hole, on a closely-mown area, anywhere through the green, etc.) a ball may be lifted and cleaned without penalty. The ball must be replaced.
Note: The position of the ball must be marked before it is lifted under this Local Rule - see Rule 20-1.
[h=4]c. Cleaning Ball[/h]Conditions, such as extreme wetness causing significant amounts of mud to adhere to the ball, may be such that permission to lift, clean and replace the ball would be appropriate. In these circumstances, the following Local Rule is recommended:
"(Specify area, e.g., at the 6th hole, on a closely-mown area, anywhere through the green, etc.) a ball may be lifted and cleaned without penalty. The ball must be replaced.
Note: The position of the ball must be marked before it is lifted under this Local Rule - see Rule 20-1.
This is what I was looking for, which is why I asked if anyone had heard the word "replaced" mentioned, I couldn't find it in the latest book or through the App, so thank you sir.
I just find the wording at times confusing, in that, you gave this example earlier;
“Through the green’’ is the whole area of the course except:
a. The teeing ground and putting green of the hole being played; and
b. All hazards on the course.
So just to confirm, the extreme weather option to be able to lift, clean & replace in the rough can be adopted under a local rule and qualifiers can be held using this rule alongside the usual (extended now) pick, clean & place on closely mown areas.
and was still incorrect!
D
Deleted member 15344
Guest
Only in specific areas - can't be the whole course
But its OK in the rough which is what I was specifically asking about and even made reference to the word "replace"!
rulefan
Tour Winner
Yes
Last edited:
Thank you, I'm glad you edited quickly, I was about to lose the will to live and be even more confused 😉
rulefan
Tour Winner
Similar threads
