Winter Golf - Handicap Qualifying Competitions - Change in Handicap Culture

[Chinny]

At the 3 golf clubs I've been a member of over the last 30 yrs each one has moved to Non-Qualifying comps at the end of the active season (Usually the end of October) and not allowed submission of supplementary scorecards.
With the upcoming change in the handicap culture ie WHS. I was wondering if golfers on the forum who play through the winter would support qualifying comps and submission of supplementary scores.
In the CONGU "GUIDANCE ON THE WHS RULES OF HANDICAPPING" it says "It is expected that all clubs will endeavour to encourage players to return acceptable scores throughout the year where possible”
The usual stumbling blocks are, preferred lies (especially in bunkers) playing fewer than 18 holes and playing a shorter course ie Winter Tees/Greens.
All of the above have now been individually addressed under the new World Handicap System so I personally don't see why we cant play play qualifying comps etc Thoughts Please...
WHS now covers playing less than 18 holes ie 14-18 holes played - Net pars for holes not played. Between 10-13 holes - Net bogey for first hole not played and net pars for the rest (think this is right)
WHS also allow qualifying comps on courses between 100-300yrds shorter than the certified measured course using the "England Golf Rules of Handicapping" Course/Slope Rating table to adjust the ratings to reflect the shorter course (The Handicap Committee must notify the Authorised Association and get their authority to play comps on a shorter course and adjust the Course/Slope ratings accordingly using the guidance table in Appendix G of the "England Golf Rules of Handicapping"
CONGU have published literature saying comps can be qualifying with preferred lies as per Model Local Rule E-3 ie Closely mown areas in the General Area, they have also published that during times of COVID (No rakes in bunkers) preferred lies are allowed in bunkers but player is NOT ALLOWED to smooth bunker before placing.
Sorry for going on a bit but its a shame each year we lose about 6 months of handicap qualifying comps, maybe with the new WHS coming in to play next week its a good time to change the usual policy of no qualifying comps in winter.

 

[Orikoru]

My club has never done 'non-qualifiers' in winter, comps just carry on as normal - they just make them Stableford instead of medal, since it's a bit fairer and easier if you blob a hole or two due to the conditions. But also there is no 'shorter course' as it's a public course, all the tees stay pretty much the same. So generally I don't get any cuts in winter at all, lucky if I make buffer.

 

[patricks148]

my home club, has nothing in winter, but the Kings and Nairn Dunbar both had winter league and non Qual comps every weekend in winter. with the new WHS, both have dec to make them Qual for this winter, Nairn dunbar i would still do as they play of the further forward tee's and as its links there is still some run on most of the fairways. The kings not a chance, greens all hollow tined and in a bit of a state and its 6600 of the medal tee's which they have still decided to use (no idea why as they have rated the other forward tee's) and has zero run its wet and it will just be a slog, not to forget you can miss a 6 inch put with all the holes on the greens

 

[Chinny]

my home club, has nothing in winter, but the Kings and Nairn Dunbar both had winter league and non Qual comps every weekend in winter. with the new WHS, both have dec to make them Qual for this winter, Nairn dunbar i would still do as they play of the further forward tee's and as its links there is still some run on most of the fairways. The kings not a chance, greens all hollow tined and in a bit of a state and its 6600 of the medal tee's which they have still decided to use (no idea why as they have rated the other forward tee's) and has zero run its wet and it will just be a slog, not to forget you can miss a 6 inch put with all the holes on the greens

We too have non qualifying comps over the winter, just a shame being on a dry links course with no temporary green we can't make the comps qualifying.......

 

[rulefan]

We are going to play our Winter Order of Merit as 'qualifiers' this winter and allow 'supplementaries'

 

[patricks148]

We too have non qualifying comps over the winter, just a shame being on a dry links course with no temporary green we can't make the comps qualifying.......

this hasn't stopped the kings making all the winter comps Qual, we have had the same in the bunkers in all out comps but still been Qual. if its a measured course that has the tee's rated you could just put in sup cards??

 

[Chinny]

We are going to play our Winter Order of Merit as 'qualifiers' this winter and allow 'supplementaries'

Great stuff.
Few of us going to be making enquiries with Handicap and Comps over next few days in attempt to move to qualifying comps and supplementary cards being the way forward especially under new WHS

 

[Grant85]

I've never played winter qualifying comps and personal view is it's not necessary and winter is for maintenance and to get out for a few holes when overhead and underfoot conditions allow. As well as have less traffic on the course in general when there is no growth.

Our inland courses in Glasgow, it would just not be possible or practical unless there was unseasonably dry conditions.

I feel winter golf is quite a bit different from normal season golf. Generally tees are moved forward (to protect teeing areas when there is no growth), greens are slower & softer, ball doesn't roll as much, rough doesn't grow etc.

If you were playing a course that was still layed out at it's full yardage in the winter, imo, you'd be damaging teeing areas with a LOT of wear and tear that would unlikely not recover in the spring without re-seeding / turfing and being roped off.

I've certainly seen some links courses that have fallen into this trap, laying out the full course for the winter and having horrendous bare patches permanently.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

Ours will be NQ until the clocks change again and I am not aware of that changing this year. I like it to be honest. Social golf with a few quid in prize money still if you play well. The course is already long, plays even longer in winter with no run, heavy atmosphere etc. It's nice to play competitive but no stress golf. Also gives a chance to experiment a bit.

 

[ger147]

I'm expecting no change at our place i.e. no qualifiers in Winter as the same issue under CONGU persists under the new WHS system i.e. the Winter tees are not a measured course so have no course or slope ratings under the new WHS system.

And as far as the membership is concerned, there is no demand for qualifiers in Winter as the course can get very wet/muddy in Winter here in west central Scotland and as there is little to no grass growth in Winter, the tees greens and fairways slowly deteriorate as Winter goes on.

 

[rulefan]

If course and prevailing weather conditions and course dimensions are satisfactory play 'qualifies/supplementaries'. If not, don't. The Rules only suggest you should, not that you must.

 

[Whereditgo]

We have always continued with qualifying comps throughout the year, the course was 'measured' off the winter tee's and greens - I'm not sure whether or not that would now require a seperate slope and course rating under WHS? and if so whether or not that has been done.

As with most clubs I imagine, the largest section of our membership is the seniors and the shorter course in winter is the only realistic opportunity for them to lower their handicaps and they won't even enter summer comps off the back tees.

 

[Billysboots]

We have always played qualifiers throughout the year anyway, although only stableford between November and March. The only time a comp is ever declared a non-qualifier is if the conditions are so poor as to render the golf a lottery. Invariably that means frozen greens.

 

[Chinny]

We have always continued with qualifying comps throughout the year, the course was 'measured' off the winter tee's and greens - I'm not sure whether or not that would now require a seperate slope and course rating under WHS? and if so whether or not that has been done.

As with most clubs I imagine, the largest section of our membership is the seniors and the shorter course in winter is the only realistic opportunity for them to lower their handicaps and they won't even enter summer comps off the back tees.

If course more than 100yrds shorter it needs a temporary course and slope rating so it can be done. (Course more than 300 yards shorter then will need a full re-assessment and new course rating which is unlikely to happen)

thanks for your post

 

[Lord Tyrion]

Apparently, clubs are not allowed to just make comps NQ over the winter now under WHS.

Hopefully post #11 is correct. If not then I will join you with the

 

[rulefan]

If course more than 100yrds shorter it needs a temporary course and slope rating so it can be done. (Course more than 300 yards shorter then will need a full re-assessment and new course rating which is unlikely to happen)

The WHS has a lot more flexibility in dealing with temporary length change (Appendix G). But it is not clear whether the club committee has the authority to make changes or whether they have to get clearance from the Authorized Association.

Edit: I have just found that the Authorized Association should make the decision. 2.1.3

 

[rulefan]

Agreed. It was causing our pro some consternation last time I was chatting with him about the club's winter plans so fingers crossed rulefan is correct.

I am trying to find the email I was sent

 

[ger147]

Agreed. It was causing our pro some consternation last time I was chatting with him about the club's winter plans so fingers crossed rulefan is correct.

For where I live and play golf, it's daft to insist on qualifiers thru Winter. In the depths of winter it's easy to lose a ball due to plugging and the greens can become a bit of a lottery to putt on during the worst of the weather and/or due to the winter course maintenance programme.

 

[Deleted member 1147]

We play team events all winter in our winter league; 4BBB, Am-Ams, scrambles etc. So no qualifiers at our place this winter.

 

[KenL]

We have a monthly medal every month plus a medal on NYD. As far as I know they will carry on.
Although, they have pushed the November medal to the middle of the month to allow the WHS to come on line.