LIV Golf

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Maybe my lack of interest in LIV and, in truth, in professional golf as a whole - other than the majors…is down to the character of the modern golfer. Earlier today I stumbled across my copy of the March 1988 Golf Monthly (it’s one of only a couple I have). In it is listed the most recent Sony World Rankings. I look at the top of the list and yes of course it’s an age thing…but the top 10, with Faldo at 11…they were characters, individuals, in a way that - for me anyway - the modern top pro just isn’t (other interesting insights on the pro game of the time on the page also). Apologies for pic being a bit indistinct - I reduced the image size rather severely.

 

[Mel Smooth]

I think we all know it was 100% the reason

If LIV promised to match what he got on PGAT it would have been 100% no. If they offered him double what he earns on PGAT, it would have been 100% no.

But offer him 450 million, plus all winnings he is likely to earn, then they met his price. Presumably 300 or 400 million wasn't enough for him. From a business perspective he has to be given a pat on the back. From a golf perspective, cheerio Jon. Sad, but true

The PGAT was what it was because of the money - let's not pretend otherwise.

 

[Swango1980]

The PGAT was what it was because of the money - let's not pretend otherwise.

Never said it didn't. An earlier post, I did exactly that. Top people will always chase higher earnings in life.

Which is why LIV players and fans should deny the same.

If the DP World Tour was the most lucrative, the likes of McIlroy and Rahm would play full time there

 

[Mel Smooth]

Never said it didn't. An earlier post, I did exactly that. Top people will always chase higher earnings in life.

Which is why LIV players and fans should deny the same.

If the DP World Tour was the most lucrative, the likes of McIlroy and Rahm would play full time there

So what's your point. Rahm - just like lots of other players have admitted the money is a significant factor - it won't be 100% of the reason like you claim, but will play a massive part.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

@SwingsitlikeHogan are you trying to claim that Faldo was 'a great character' in his heyday ? He was a robotic, insular golfer, giving no sign of an character out on the course. Like Tiger, he went into his bubble, ignored everything and everyone around him.

Langer is in that list printed, hardly laugh a minute either.

Included in the current top 10, Mcilroy, Rahm, Hovland, Homa. Plenty of character and entertainment watching those guys.

There are always interesting golfers and dull golfers, throughout the eras. No era is more stand out than others on that front, unless only seen through the prism of fond memories.

 

[Mel Smooth]

Personally, I feel like there are loads of interesting golfers out there right now - it's that nature of any sport - to get to the top you have to be driven and that will often come across with different character traits.

Some are likable and some not so - depending on your own personal choice - it all adds a bit of juice to the sport.

 

[HeftyHacker]

I think for me I don't have any real issue with the sportswashing element, I don't really see it as Saudi Arabia looking to exert their influence and beliefs onto the rest of the world but rather see it as an opportunity to open their eyes to a more Liberal way of life elsewhere.

One thing worth noting is that over 60% of their population is under 30. That's a huge captive market who, from the dealings I've had with them through work, all have a keen interest in western culture and enjoy large aspects of it. From speaking to the many Saudi based expats I come into contact with - over the past 10 years or so the interest in the sporting events over there has skyrocketed amongst the locals, which is probably why they have decided that that is where they want to invest their money.

There are still many issues to overcome but, ultimately, whilst they have the oil they also hold all the cards so any attempts to sanction and castigate them is just going to have negative impacts on how they view the western world, when it feels as though the time has never been better to influence them whilst they are so receptive.

There is obviously a balance to be struck but I don't think a complete sanction and blockading them from the rest of the world is the answer. Especially when there are less scrupulous countries that would be more than willing to fill the void.

That's just my opinion and whilst I will readily confess I'm not the most informed person I do have some experience in dealing and working with young Saudis and see there is an appetite there to embrace positive change.

 

[PJ87]

I think for me I don't have any real issue with the sportswashing element, I don't really see it as Saudi Arabia looking to exert their influence and beliefs onto the rest of the world but rather see it as an opportunity to open their eyes to a more Liberal way of life elsewhere.

One thing worth noting is that over 60% of their population is under 30. That's a huge captive market who, from the dealings I've had with them through work, all have a keen interest in western culture and enjoy large aspects of it. From speaking to the many Saudi based expats I come into contact with - over the past 10 years or so the interest in the sporting events over there has skyrocketed amongst the locals, which is probably why they have decided that that is where they want to invest their money.

There are still many issues to overcome but, ultimately, whilst they have the oil they also hold all the cards so any attempts to sanction and castigate them is just going to have negative impacts on how they view the western world, when it feels as though the time has never been better to influence them whilst they are so receptive.

There is obviously a balance to be struck but I don't think a complete sanction and blockading them from the rest of the world is the answer. Especially when there are less scrupulous countries that would be more than willing to fill the void.

That's just my opinion and whilst I will readily confess I'm not the most informed person I do have some experience in dealing and working with young Saudis and see there is an appetite there to embrace positive change.

Heard an interview on five live last night with the Saudi sports minister

They want to one up Qatar by the sounds by doing the world cup without the human rights issued (let's see)

They have opened up the "kingdom" to the world and want people to visit

Can't say I ever want to go there but got the impression they want to appeal to others to get tourism rather than before shut up shop and hoard their billions.

 

[Mel Smooth]

Heard an interview on five live last night with the Saudi sports minister

They want to one up Qatar by the sounds by doing the world cup without the human rights issued (let's see)

They have opened up the "kingdom" to the world and want people to visit

Can't say I ever want to go there but got the impression they want to appeal to others to get tourism rather than before shut up shop and hoard their billions.

Saudi used to be reliant on tourism income before oil, and of course, it's every Muslims duty to visit Mecca (Hajj) at least once in their lifetime - 1.7 billion of them and rising.

Would I go - definitely, just out of intrigue more than anything else - I expect it's very different to the way we perceive in some aspects.

 

[D-S]

I went to Saudi many times in the 90s and early 2000s. It was a pretty soulless place then and would have to change quite a lot in many aspects to make me want to go back and I am sure in some ways it will have done.

I remember having to spell my name out phonetically once in a hotel and as there in a w in my surname used ‘whisky’, I was corrected as they use ’washington’ over there, which I thought was taking their exception to alcohol a bit far. Can you get a drink in hotels there now?

 

[Deleted member 21445]

A PGAT v LIV Ryder Cup Style Event would be really something.

Liv PGAT
Jon Rahm Scottie Scheffler
Brooks Koepka Rory Mcilroy
Cam Smith Victor Hovland
Bryson DeC Patrick Cantlay
Dustin Johnson Xander Schauffele
Talor Gooch Max Homa
Sergio Garcia Matt Fitzpatrick
Patrick Reed Brian Harmon
Joaquin Niemman Justin Thomas
Mito Pereira Wyndham Clark
Phil Mickleson Tiger Woods
Louis Oosthuizen Jordan Spieth

 

[HeftyHacker]

I went to Saudi many times in the 90s and early 2000s. It was a pretty soulless place then and would have to change quite a lot in many aspects to make me want to go back and I am sure in some ways it will have done.

I remember having to spell my name out phonetically once in a hotel and as there in a w in my surname used ‘whisky’, I was corrected as they use ’washington’ over there, which I thought was taking their exception to alcohol a bit far. Can you get a drink in hotels there now?

Yeah the guys I've spoken to said it's changed from all recognition in a very short period of time in the downtown Riyadh areas. It does look very modern - but that usually means soulless tbh.

You can't officially drink there yet but they're spending circa $3trillion essentially building a new city near Riyadh with an F1 track, 6 flags amusement park, golf courses, big hotels etc it's expected that the alcohol ban will be lifted as this development, and others around Jeddah and NEOM etc progress.

Amongst the Saudis themselves there's certainly a curiosity with alcohol, and apparently at the big boxing/music events people are allowed to take their own "water" in with them.

My mate tells a funny story of a young Saudi lad in Rockports (the early 2000's chav footwear of choice) demanding they open the bar on the plane as soon as they took off and wasn't best pleased when he was told they couldn't open it until they were out of Saudi airspace.

 

[D-S]

Yeah the guys I've spoken to said it's changed from all recognition in a very short period of time in the downtown Riyadh areas. It does look very modern - but that usually means soulless tbh.

You can't officially drink there yet but they're spending circa $3trillion essentially building a new city near Riyadh with an F1 track, 6 flags amusement park, golf courses, big hotels etc it's expected that the alcohol ban will be lifted as this development, and others around Jeddah and NEOM etc progress.

Amongst the Saudis themselves there's certainly a curiosity with alcohol, and apparently at the big boxing/music events people are allowed to take their own "water" in with them.

My mate tells a funny story of a young Saudi lad in Rockports (the early 2000's chav footwear of choice) demanding they open the bar on the plane as soon as they took off and wasn't best pleased when he was told they couldn't open it until they were out of Saudi airspace.

It was always strange when the plane left countries like Saudi or Iranian airspace and they announced that the bar was now open and women then took off their headscarves.

 

[Backsticks]

It was always strange when the plane left countries like Saudi or Iranian airspace and they announced that the bar was now open and women then took off their headscarves.

When not in Rome, do as the barbarians.

 

[Mel Smooth]

If Brandel can change his mind, there’s even hope for some on here..

https://x.com/flushingitgolf/status/1733544260538937459?s=46&t=ohmLQATVbQEjZ3yd-oBmxA

 

[SteveW86]

LIV is taking off, saw someone at the club in a High Flyers hoodie the other day.

Any guesses as to their approximate age?

 

[Gopher]

If Brandel can change his mind, there’s even hope for some on here..

https://x.com/flushingitgolf/status/1733544260538937459?s=46&t=ohmLQATVbQEjZ3yd-oBmxA

I think that Brandel talks a lot of sense.. he's right when he says that each tour has what the other wants. The PGAT has history, tradition, legacy, respect and values. LIV has money..

Oh and shorts and music, and money. It's desperate for legitimacy and is trying to buy that and OWGR.. with money. It's buying the best players.. with money. It doesn't make it better. it just has more money.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

LIV is taking off, saw someone at the club in a High Flyers hoodie the other day.

Any guesses as to their approximate age?

72

I know the obvious answer, QI buzzer level, would be 14, but I'm going the other way.

 

[Deleted member 1147]

LIV is taking off, saw someone at the club in a High Flyers hoodie the other day.

Any guesses as to their approximate age?

Trick question
It was actually a Flymo team jumper

 

[Deleted member 1147]

https://x.com/gazzagolf1966/status/1733205679714812292?s=46&t=lAN9AFNPHJizaM7NEsXohw