LIV Golf

[wjemather]

Info via Phil Mickleson

Can anybody give an explanation other than the USGA is colluding with the PGAT.

PGA uses OWGR rankings to qualify

#128 Hossler just got in as a reserve

#103 Tringale
#111 Munoz
#110 Kokrak

All ranked higher than Hossler but seem to have been ignored.

I dont know the answer but seems wrong ?

OWGR is not (and hasn't been) an official criteria for exemption into the PGA Championship, but it's common that players in the top 100 not otherwise exempt will get a special invitation. This year several players outside the top 100 were also invited, including both Ryder Cup captains, a few leading European players, the Australasian order of merit winner, and Paul Casey.

Instead of OWGR, the PGA Championship uses PGA Championship points as its main exemption criterion, which is based on money earned on the PGA Tour. The top 70 (the word eligible had been added - the only evidence of a change being made at the behest of the tour) on the list are automatically exempt, and any remaining places (and alternates) after invitees have been added are also filled from the list. This is how Hossler gets in, as #77 on the points list.

Alex Smalley, at #78, was next in, as a replacement for Davis Love III. The next 3 on the list (Griffin, McNealy & Dahmen) are already in, so Lee Hodges is the next alternate at #81.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Info via Phil Mickleson

Can anybody give an explanation other than the USGA is colluding with the PGAT.

PGA uses OWGR rankings to qualify

#128 Hossler just got in as a reserve

#103 Tringale
#111 Munoz
#110 Kokrak

All ranked higher than Hossler but seem to have been ignored.

I dont know the answer but seems wrong ?

It appears Mickleson has deleted the post - guess that’s what happens when there wasnt much research done

 

[Deleted member 29109]

View attachment 47714


It appears Mickleson has deleted the post - guess that’s what happens when there wasnt much research done

Paul Casey got in who is ranked lower.

The LiV PR team clearly didn’t check things properly before sending out their tweets and forum content for people to post.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1656731105188249616

 

[Depreston]

Back to the golf...

Tulsa this weekend!

Gooch going for an unprecedented 3-peat in his home state is going to be superb to watch, he's been playing some ridiculous golf recently.

Keeping a keen eye on Bryson too, feel like he needs to start living up to his talent.

Goochs coach also works with Clark and Finau

think he will be able to up his rate nee bother

 

[Depreston]

View attachment 47714


It appears Mickleson has deleted the post - guess that’s what happens when there wasnt much research done

He never learns just spouts off and the followers lap it up

 

[Mel Smooth]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1656731105188249616

So they don't have to pay their fines unless they want to go back on the DP Tour...

That'll tell 'em..

 

[Deleted member 15344]

So they don't have to pay their fines unless they want to go back on the DP Tour...

That'll tell 'em..

And the players that haven’t resigned including those no longer on the LIV tour


Wonder what Mickleson will say

 

[Mel Smooth]

And the players that haven’t resigned including those no longer on the LIV tour


Wonder what Mickleson will say

Their fines were paid by LIV Phil, it was well documented at the time - there's really been no drama about Larazzabal, Otaegui etc going back to the DP Tour has there? See, mutual cooperation can work....

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Their fines were paid by LIV Phil, it was well documented at the time - there's really been no drama about Larazzabal, Otaegui etc going back to the DP Tour has there? See, mutual cooperation can work....

“
In total, 26 players were today informed individually of the sanctions applicable to them based on the specific conflicting tournaments they each played in, as a DP World Tour member, without being granted a release.

These sanctions include fines and, where appropriate, tournament suspensions. The sanctions imposed were determined on a case-by-case basis; acknowledging differences between the events in terms of the impact on the DP World Tour’s broadcast partners, sponsors and stakeholders.

Where fines were issued to players they ranged from £12,500 to £100,000 for each individual breach of the Conflicting Tournament Regulation.

The total cumulative suspension imposed on any single player for breaches in the period June 22, 2022, to April 2, 2023 is a maximum of eight DP World Tour tournaments, comprising a combination of one or two week suspensions.”


So LiV paid for fines that were issued today

 

[Mel Smooth]

“
In total, 26 players were today informed individually of the sanctions applicable to them based on the specific conflicting tournaments they each played in, as a DP World Tour member, without being granted a release.

These sanctions include fines and, where appropriate, tournament suspensions. The sanctions imposed were determined on a case-by-case basis; acknowledging differences between the events in terms of the impact on the DP World Tour’s broadcast partners, sponsors and stakeholders.

Where fines were issued to players they ranged from £12,500 to £100,000 for each individual breach of the Conflicting Tournament Regulation.

The total cumulative suspension imposed on any single player for breaches in the period June 22, 2022, to April 2, 2023 is a maximum of eight DP World Tour tournaments, comprising a combination of one or two week suspensions.”


So LiV paid for fines that were issued today

You asked me about the players who hadn't resigned that were no longer on the LIV tour, their fines were paid by LIV. The statement from the DPWT is ambiguous - it says (in the bit you didn't quote) that players who have resigned will only pay those fines if they want to rejoin the tour - so, if all the players now resign, where does that leave them - eligible to pay the fines or not??
All it will mean is that any existing LIV / DPWT players will now quit the DPWT so we won't get to enjoy the rivalry we saw out in Dubai earlier this year - shame.
Also, where does the DPWT stand legally for players that have played conflicting tours before without permission - it's happened multiple times - surely they have to be fined as well right, otherwise it undermines the very position the DPWT are arguing from.
My god, it could have all been handled so much better - the DPWT is done as a standalone tour.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

You asked me about the players who hadn't resigned that were no longer on the LIV tour, their fines were paid by LIV. The statement from the DPWT is ambiguous - it says (in the bit you didn't quote) that players who have resigned will only pay those fines if they want to rejoin the tour - so, if all the players now resign, where does that leave them - eligible to pay the fines or not??
All it will mean is that any existing LIV / DPWT players will now quit the DPWT so we won't get to enjoy the rivalry we saw out in Dubai earlier this year - shame.
Also, where does the DPWT stand legally for players that have played conflicting tours before without permission - it's happened multiple times - surely they have to be fined as well right, otherwise it undermines the very position the DPWT are arguing from.
My god, it could have all been handled so much better - the DPWT is done as a standalone tour.

There are players who played on LIV last year who are now playing on DP Tour again who have been fined or Suspended etc

There are some that still play on LIV now and some resigned and those that have resigned if they wish to rejoin the DP Tour ( suspect when they are no longer needed by LIV ) then they will need to pay a fine and also serve a suspension


I know it’s hard for you to move past pre conceived ideas or regurgitating what’s been said elsewhere on social media - as witnessed by your recent reaction to the Mickelson rant but take a step back just once and read what’s said and what’s posted.

Which tours have players played on after asking for a release and it being denied ? Who are the players ?

 

[doublebogey7]

You asked me about the players who hadn't resigned that were no longer on the LIV tour, their fines were paid by LIV. The statement from the DPWT is ambiguous - it says (in the bit you didn't quote) that players who have resigned will only pay those fines if they want to rejoin the tour - so, if all the players now resign, where does that leave them - eligible to pay the fines or not??
All it will mean is that any existing LIV / DPWT players will now quit the DPWT so we won't get to enjoy the rivalry we saw out in Dubai earlier this year - shame.
Also, where does the DPWT stand legally for players that have played conflicting tours before without permission - it's happened multiple times - surely they have to be fined as well right, otherwise it undermines the very position the DPWT are arguing from.
My god, it could have all been handled so much better - the DPWT is done as a standalone tour.

Surely that was the basis of the argument made by the LiV players at the court of arbitration,. where they lost.

 

[Mel Smooth]

There are players who played on LIV last year who are now playing on DP Tour again who have been fined or Suspended etc

There are some that still play on LIV now and some resigned and those that have resigned if they wish to rejoin the DP Tour ( suspect when they are no longer needed by LIV ) then they will need to pay a fine and also serve a suspension


I know it’s hard for you to move past pre conceived ideas or regurgitating what’s been said elsewhere on social media - as witnessed by your recent reaction to the Mickelson rant but take a step back just once and read what’s said and what’s posted.

Which tours have players played on after asking for a release and it being denied ? Who are the players ?

Well Phil, I guess the ones that are no longer on LIV that still want to play on the DPWT, will have any additional fines covered by LIV, as they agreed to this from the get go.
The ones that want to stay on LIV will do so, and resign their membership.
So how does the DPWT benefit?

Westwood is on record saying he's played on conflicting tours without ever needing permission.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Well Phil, I guess the ones that are no longer on LIV that still want to play on the DPWT, will have any additional fines covered by LIV, as they agreed to this from the get go.
The ones that want to stay on LIV will do so, and resign their membership.
So how does the DPWT benefit?

Westwood is on record saying he's played on conflicting tours without ever needing permission.

You guess ? Well they were discarded by LIV so I’m going to guess they will be left to their own devices

so it’s not playing on another tour after being refused a release then ?


And I’m sure there are tours or events where a player doesn’t need to ask for a release

The players asked for a release - was turned down , they played and were fined - so has that situation happened before

 

[Mel Smooth]

You guess ? Well they were discarded by LIV so I’m going to guess they will be left to their own devices

so it’s not playing on another tour after being refused a release then ?


And I’m sure there are tours or events where a player doesn’t need to ask for a release

The players asked for a release - was turned down , they played and were fined - so has that situation happened before

Who will be left to their own devices? Can you name them..
Come on Phil, how does this move strengthen the DPWT? - The'll lose some very good players to LIV, and they've cut off the return path for anybody who drops off the LIV roster, who will now go to The Asian Tour - which Pelley himself has acknowledged is a big threat to them.

 

[Deleted member 21445]

View attachment 47714


It appears Mickleson has deleted the post - guess that’s what happens when there wasnt much research done

Reposted with more info

https://twitter.com/x/status/1656765577132736512

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Who will be left to their own devices? Can you name them..
Come on Phil, how does this move strengthen the DPWT? - The'll lose some very good players to LIV, and they've cut off the return path for anybody who drops off the LIV roster, who will now go to The Asian Tour - which Pelley himself has acknowledged is a big threat to them.

Who said anything about strengthening the ET


The players left to go and play LIV and the ET made a decision backed up through the courts

The return path hasn’t been “cut off” - it’s there if they wish but we all know that it’s near impossible for them to leave LIV without a big bill to pay.

The Asian Tour is no threat - it’s another tour without any major media deal in the major golf markets. The best players again from Asia Tour will look to move to the PGAT

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Reposted with more info

https://twitter.com/x/status/1656765577132736512

Again without understanding how the USPGA Qualifying works

Did he not learn the first time

 

[Mel Smooth]

Who said anything about strengthening the ET


The players left to go and play LIV and the ET made a decision backed up through the courts

The return path hasn’t been “cut off” - it’s there if they wish but we all know that it’s near impossible for them to leave LIV without a big bill to pay.

The Asian Tour is no threat - it’s another tour without any major media deal in the major golf markets. The best players again from Asia Tour will look to move to the PGAT

Well Phil, I think it's fair to ask how the DPWT will benefit as a result of their actions, because no organisation on gods green earth will prosper if they keep making decisions that make the product worse. You can't answer it, that's fair enough...
Now, didn't you say something similar about LIV not being a threat about this time last year, and yet here we are, with the PGAT scrambling for more funds to keep their players on board, multiple players complaining about the revised schedule, an OWGR system that is completely worthless, a strategic alliance that is routinely destroying the former European Tour, and yet despite all that, LIV is gaining momentum and popularity.
The best players on the Asian Tour qualify for LIV, and I wouldn't be surprised if they are contractually obliged to fulfill that commitment.