LIV Golf

[Swango1980]

No issue really with Sir Nick’s comments - everyone is entitled to an opinion

My questions though to those on this thread who are vehemently against LIV Golf…

Would you have the same narrative energy if the PGL (which Rory was explicitly not against…despite it being a ‘closed-shop’) had got off the ground?

You’re against it because of “SA and human-rights abuses” OR you’re against it because it’s “not a real-tour and it’s a closed-shop”

Both are valid positions..

But what then re: the PGL? And what about the DP World Tour and SA, and dealing with other countries and regimes either through sponsorship or touring there with almost as equally not great human rights abuses…

I for one doubt anyone would have bated an eyelid if the PGL had got off the ground and Rory, JT, Spieth, DJ and Smith had joined in - and it was a closed-shop. The Country-Club kids at No Laying Up would be front and centre cheerleaders for it..

It’s blatant self-interest and hypocrisy from many in the US golf world and it’s painfully obvious

Not heard of the PGL, but if it was a closed shop, not good in my opinion.

I'm less concerned about money coming from Middle East, as I've mentioned before. Although if money is just thrown at something to begin with, I wonder how that business will become sustainable once someone wants to pull the money on the cash. Will there be enough interest in the business model to keep it going?

 

[evemccc]

This ?

https://www.golfmonthly.com/news/what-is-the-premier-golf-league

“With the rumoured Saudi-backed Super League causing controversy as to the origin of the funds, the wealth of the PGL is said to be funded through private equity and high net worth individuals in the United States and not Saudi Arabia or other sovereign wealth funds.”

The Forbes article will give better context IMO. Private equity and Saudi

 

[Backsticks]

The last thing we need is yet another tour try causing further splits in the worlds best golfers.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

The Forbes article will give better context IMO. Private equity and Saudi

It’s also 3 years old ?‍

https://www.todays-golfer.com/news-...trying-to-partner-with-and-save-the-pga-tour/

“Andrew Gardiner always suspected this day would come. For a while, the Saudis used to be part of his plan for a Premier Golf League (PGL) before he decided they were better off without them. He insists he isn’t angry that his former partners pursued a copy-cat format. He actually considers it a compliment, an endorsement that his concept works. “

 

[evemccc]

It’s also 3 years old ?‍

“

So what? I said it was all PRE Liv — do you have to try and have an argument about every little thing.. jeez??‍?

You’ll have read (or perhaps not) that Rory was in conversations with them about a 48-man elite closed shop from 2014…

 

[Deleted member 15344]

So what? I said it was all PRE Liv — do you have to try and have an argument about every little thing.. jeez??‍?

You’ll have read (or perhaps not) that Rory was in conversations with them about a 48-man elite closed shop from 2014…

Surely it’s better to look at the current situation as opposed to 3 years ago ? You mentioned it was being financed by Saudi etc where as the more up to date articles state it isn’t ?‍

Also it seem they are discussing with the PGA etc about how they can work together - so it’s seems to be in the current situation the opposite of LIV

 

[evemccc]

Surely it’s better to look at the current situation as opposed to 3 years ago ? You mentioned it was being financed by Saudi etc where as the more up to date articles state it isn’t ?‍

Also it seem they are discussing with the PGA etc about how they can work together - so it’s seems to be in the current situation the opposite of LIV

Yes, because surely the usurping of the PGL by the Saudi’s - by withdrawing their funding and stealing the idea to start what is now LIV - meant the PGL in its original guise didn’t get off the ground

But @Liverpoolphil the original point was that many people are strongly anti-Liv because it’s not a tour and a closed-shop…and I asked would you have been against it…because a lot of those who are helping to fly the flag of the PGA Tour now (No Laying Up for example) were fairly positive towards it…and the Tour’s biggest star Rory was fairly ambivalent about it for years..

Things evolve and clearly by the second article you linked they have. The CEO of the PGL sees the wind of change that LIV have precipitated - massive increased money to the top players both in PIP and in Tour purses, as well as somewhat of a half-way house to an elite 48 player field by way of ‘elevated events’ — he now wants to work with the Tour

But Phil, it’s not and never has been the “opposite of LIV” — the principle of an elite 48 person tour of star players….you SHOULD be absolutely against because that is the reason you and others have given for their opposition to Liv

 

[evemccc]

That's not an argument, just a valid point and part of the valid discussion here. If you can't accept that then you should either grow up or accept that the whole ethos here is putting your point of view across and maybe having people counteract it. I mean Jeez.........

You’re on ignore so I have only just seen this..

This is the comment I made initially about the PGL…

“My questions though to those on this thread who are vehemently against LIV Golf…Would you have had the same narrative energy if the PGL (which Rory was explicitly not against…despite it being a ‘closed-shop’) had got off the ground?”

(Bolded to emphasise PAST tense…)

Phil then asked what the PGL was. So I link an article from 2020 that outlines precisely what the PGL WAS and how it came into existence…

He complains that it is 3 years old…

Totally irrelevant when the question I asked specifically references something that could have happened, but didn’t….PAST tense

?

 

[Dando]

apparently the next big earth shattering signing is none other than……..Anthony Kim

Barrel scrapping comes to mind

 

[Imurg]

Just seen this....the guy hasn't played competitive golf in over a decade...has no world ranking, no status on any Tour....1nothing but a name from 10-12 years ago....
That needle might not move at all.....

And, apparently, another executive has left...Greg's going to be a busy boy.....

 

[Beezerk]

apparently the next big earth shattering signing is none other than……..Anthony Kim

Barrel scrapping comes to mind

Why would they be fighting with barrels ??‍?

 

[BubbaP]

.....
Its a bit like most info about LIV...full of gossip, half-truths, doubts and rumours......and assumptions from both sides.
To be honest the whole thing is getting supremely tedious...

Just seen this....the guy hasn't played competitive golf in over a decade...has no world ranking, no status on any Tour....1nothing but a name from 10-12 years ago....
That needle might not move at all.....

And, apparently, another executive has left...Greg's going to be a busy boy.....

??????

Do hope the weather improves soon!

 

[Imurg]

??????

Do hope the weather improves soon!

Its still dark

 

[PJ87]

Just seen this....the guy hasn't played competitive golf in over a decade...has no world ranking, no status on any Tour....1nothing but a name from 10-12 years ago....
That needle might not move at all.....

And, apparently, another executive has left...Greg's going to be a busy boy.....

On the flip side tho, good on him

 

[Backsticks]

That would be a very bad move from LIV if true. One, it really torpedos their credibility as top flight sport, and reinforces them as a collector of has beens, seniors, and the injured. Two, it suggests they really have drawn a blank in attracting any further real top golfers. Its becoming a bit of a freak show.

 

[Swango1980]

I'm sure it isn't true, unless Kim has been playing pro golf somewhere, and has proved and gained credibility that he can compete at that level. I doubt even LIV would stop so low? Otherwise, they could just start asking other golfers who fell off face of the planet years ago (thinking names like Jeff Overton, Boo Weekly). Signing Kim seems almost as unlikely as signing Gareth Bale, who by what I've heard, isn't half bad (for an amateur at least)

 

[Dando]

Why would they be fighting with barrels ??‍?

Oh crap ??‍

 

[AussieKB]

Heard on the grape vine rumour mill tik tok aunt betty website news of the world sport on Sunday, that the PGA tour is folding, going to be it's last year so enjoy boys.....

 

[evemccc]

Dustin Johnson
Brooks Koepka
Cameron Smith
Bryson DeChambeau
Phil Mickelson
Henrik Stenson
Patrick Reed
Sergio Garcia
Bubba Watson
Louis Ostheizen
Joaqauin Niemann
Paul Casey
Lee Westwood
Ian Poulter
Martin Kaymer
Marc Leishman
Matthew Wolff
Talor Gooch
Kevin Na

Now we all know that it’s overwhelmingly due to pots of money..
But let’s be real, that isn’t a bad set of golfers for a start-up Tour to get in 12 months

 

[Deleted member 15344]

You’re on ignore so I have only just seen this..

This is the comment I made initially about the PGL…

“My questions though to those on this thread who are vehemently against LIV Golf…Would you have had the same narrative energy if the PGL (which Rory was explicitly not against…despite it being a ‘closed-shop’) had got off the ground?”

(Bolded to emphasise PAST tense…)

Phil then asked what the PGL was. So I link an article from 2020 that outlines precisely what the PGL WAS and how it came into existence…

He complains that it is 3 years old…

Totally irrelevant when the question I asked specifically references something that could have happened, but didn’t….PAST tense

?

Think you need to calm down a touch

Let’s just clear a few things up

Someone countering a point or providing some facts isn’t “arguing”

No one was “complaining” about an article being 3 years old - it was just a statement of fact

You attempted to bring some level of “whataboutary” to try and highlight some level of hypocrisy aimed at people when it comes to Rory and PGL and Saudi money

I highlighted to you that it’s not using Saudi money from the latest article

This was your response

The Forbes article will give better context IMO. Private equity and Saudi

So does an article that’s 3 years old give better context of Saudi money being used or a more current one from last year where the person himself states that they aren’t using Saudi money

As for it being a closed shop - I can’t see anything in the articles about any qualifying process etc

BUT “IF” Rory was involved in a closed shop golf league financed by Saudi state money then the attitude will still be the same

But he isn’t so it’s irrelevant attempts at whataboutary and one that was lacking some facts