LIV Golf

[Backsticks]

Pressure is on the owgr to do something, so they cannot remain inactive for too long. With each passing week, the rankings are becoming more and more irrelevant, and little better than random numbers. Their credibility is being chipped away by their inaction. Some modification to include SGT players is absolutely necessary before the end of the year, or next years numbers will be meaningless.
I would think Saudi tour points would still be lower than an average World tour tournament at the moment, due to the small size of the field.

 

[Mel Smooth]

Will the world explode or something if the OWGR changes their system?

Has this just not highlighted how restricted the system is, as IainP has said, there are already events that don't fit the exact criteria that still seem to be able to have players earning OWGR points.
Surely making the system more flexible is just future proofing so that as the proffesional game develops, it allows points to be awarded without controversy?

 

[Swango1980]

Will the world explode or something if the OWGR changes their system?

Has this just not highlighted how restricted the system is, as IainP has said, there are already events that don't fit the exact criteria that still seem to be able to have players earning OWGR points.
Surely making the system more flexible is just future proofing so that as the proffesional game develops, it allows points to be awarded without controversy?

To be fair, I don't think the world would explode if OWGR points were not offered to LIV either. But, if they are in future, as others have suggested, they'll probably be a fraction of what players could get on full field events on PGA. I'd be surprised if they offered enough points for a player to realistically reach World Number 1, unless they win most of the Majors

 

[BubbaP]

Pressure is on the owgr to do something, so they cannot remain inactive for too long. With each passing week, the rankings are becoming more and more irrelevant, and little better than random numbers. Their credibility is being chipped away by their inaction. Some modification to include SGT players is absolutely necessary before the end of the year, or next years numbers will be meaningless.
I would think Saudi tour points would still be lower than an average World tour tournament at the moment, due to the small size of the field.

Hard to tell, some examples...

Old calc rules- field of 38, fairly strong, lowest was 124th
62 pts to winner
2021 bmw Wentworth, 64 pts to winner

https://www.owgr.com/events/sentry-tournament-of-champions-9377

New calc rules - Field of 29, but high ranked, lowest was 61st
39pts to winner
Last weeks Italian open 24 pts to winner

https://www.owgr.com/events/tour-championship---72-hole-scores-9675

 

[Beezerk]

Pressure is on the owgr to do something, so they cannot remain inactive for too long. With each passing week, the rankings are becoming more and more irrelevant, and little better than random numbers.

I wouldn't be that dramatic about it by saying with each passing week.
When is the next big tournament with some decent points available, next year?
I've just had a quick look at Rorys schedule, he's playing the Dunhill Links next week then some tournament I've never heard of, hardly massive scoring events.
I think they have plenty of time to sort this out, certainly going to be an interesting few months ahead though.

 

[Val]

LIV golf should have had this all sorted with the OWGR before they even held a tournament or signed a player.

I'm not against it by any means but the whinging and moaning coming out of LIV suggests they thought it was a given regardless without actually checking.

 

[Backsticks]

I wouldn't be that dramatic about it by saying with each passing week.
When is the next big tournament with some decent points available, next year?
I've just had a quick look at Rorys schedule, he's playing the Dunhill Links next week then some tournament I've never heard of, hardly massive scoring events.
I think they have plenty of time to sort this out, certainly going to be an interesting few months ahead though.

Rather than those still in the points system, its more about anyone on LiV who has tournaments winding out of the system, and so is now slipping.
But sorting it by the end of the year will be fine, and the numbers will right themselves through the first few months of 2023. The sooner they fix it, the less it will take the rankings to correct the now accumulating, albeit slowly, errors.

 

[BubbaP]

To be fair, I don't think the world would explode if OWGR points were not offered to LIV either. But, if they are in future, as others have suggested, they'll probably be a fraction of what players could get on full field events on PGA. I'd be surprised if they offered enough points for a player to realistically reach World Number 1, unless they win most of the Majors

Agree, think they'd need to be high placing in majors for that. With current field more about being able to maintain approx ranking if playing well.

 

[Jacko_G]

LIV golf should have had this all sorted with the OWGR before they even held a tournament or signed a player.

I'm not against it by any means but the whinging and moaning coming out of LIV suggests they thought it was a given regardless without actually checking.

Problems arise Val when certain organisations refuse to act like adults and get round a table and talk it through. The blatant refusal and ignorance shown (on both sides at times) is not portraying golf in a good light.

The subsequent media lead anti Liv campaign is embarrassing also.

The PGA (non profit making organisation I believe was caught sitting with over $900 million in the bank) suddenly finds extra money to make additional payments etc.

Some people have been brainwashed into believing one side if the argument. There are a lot of issues that resulted in players moving over not just money like some on here would like to believe.

I'm not in favour or anti Liv, but in general I think it could offer something different and a good alternative to regular golf for the public. The toxic press have created the warfare environment on behalf of the PGA.

From what I have watched to date I think it's been fun and relaxed.

 

[Depreston]

Problems arise Val when certain organisations refuse to act like adults and get round a table and talk it through. The blatant refusal and ignorance shown (on both sides at times) is not portraying golf in a good light.

The subsequent media lead anti Liv campaign is embarrassing also.

The PGA (non profit making organisation I believe was caught sitting with over $900 million in the bank) suddenly finds extra money to make additional payments etc.

Some people have been brainwashed into believing one side if the argument. There are a lot of issues that resulted in players moving over not just money like some on here would like to believe.

I'm not in favour or anti Liv, but in general I think it could offer something different and a good alternative to regular golf for the public. The toxic press have created the warfare environment on behalf of the PGA.

From what I have watched to date I think it's been fun and relaxed.

$900 mil? Going to need proof of that

 

[Backsticks]

The subsequent media lead anti Liv campaign is embarrassing also.

That sounds very Trumpian and conspiracy theorist, and struggling with the less sinister reality that the media, and general comment, overwhelmingly, simply views LIV as adding nothing, but damaging the pro golf entertainment product.

 

[rksquire]

Zalatoris has give the best interview yet, from any player, regarding LIV and his own status - fairly measured, kept emotion out of it and didn't say silly things that will come back to bite him. Watched Monahan's interviews regarding the ranking points; apart from avoiding answering the SA question he smirked through the fact he has a say on the board of the OWGR.... to be fair I find both him and Norman quite unlikeable (to put it mildly). From a few interviews now it seems most players think there will be some agreement at some point in the future (next year);

Thankfully (for golf fans), the actual golf might have something to do with it - a LIV golfer winning a Major devalues OWGR and other 'legitimate' tours; pour showings at ranking events by LIV players devalues their product (lack of competitive edge / sharpness). I know a lot of people on here don't like that, but I'm looking forward to the events where they mingle and interact - it is additional interest, provides another edge to the tournament and shows, actually, teams might just work! (Team PGAT + subservient tours vs Team LIV - it's already divisive and people have already picked their sides).

Cam Smith is the interesting one I think, as his world ranking slips - before joining he was one of the best players in the world, ranked 2 but closing the gap; I think he still is one of the very best in the world. At a push, I'd suggest Smith, DJ and McIlroy are the best current players in the world, taking the year as a whole of course Shuffler is in there. I understand the argument that it was Smiths decision to leave but not having the actual very best talent as part of the metric has to devalue said metric or at least leave it open to question for critics; the rankings can't be a self serving exercise for the PGAT only to promote it's own players - but it is currently is.

It highlights an issue, that isn't just LIV related - Apart from the guys who have 2 memberships (PGAT & DPWT), who is the highest ranked exclusive DPWT player in the world rankings?

 

[Mel Smooth]

That sounds very Trumpian and conspiracy theorist, and struggling with the less sinister reality that the media, and general comment, overwhelmingly, simply views LIV as adding nothing, but damaging the pro golf entertainment product.

BBC website was showing all the golf scores from all the tours last weekend, nothing from LIV. There’s nothing conspiracy theorist about that, it’s quite obvious they are making a decision not to cover it.

 

[Slab]

Zalatoris has give the best interview yet, from any player, regarding LIV and his own status - fairly measured, kept emotion out of it and didn't say silly things that will come back to bite him. Watched Monahan's interviews regarding the ranking points; apart from avoiding answering the SA question he smirked through the fact he has a say on the board of the OWGR.... to be fair I find both him and Norman quite unlikeable (to put it mildly). From a few interviews now it seems most players think there will be some agreement at some point in the future (next year);

Thankfully (for golf fans), the actual golf might have something to do with it - a LIV golfer winning a Major devalues OWGR and other 'legitimate' tours; pour showings at ranking events by LIV players devalues their product (lack of competitive edge / sharpness). I know a lot of people on here don't like that, but I'm looking forward to the events where they mingle and interact - it is additional interest, provides another edge to the tournament and shows, actually, teams might just work! (Team PGAT + subservient tours vs Team LIV - it's already divisive and people have already picked their sides).

Cam Smith is the interesting one I think, as his world ranking slips - before joining he was one of the best players in the world, ranked 2 but closing the gap; I think he still is one of the very best in the world. At a push, I'd suggest Smith, DJ and McIlroy are the best current players in the world, taking the year as a whole of course Shuffler is in there. I understand the argument that it was Smiths decision to leave but not having the actual very best talent as part of the metric has to devalue said metric or at least leave it open to question for critics; the rankings can't be a self serving exercise for the PGAT only to promote it's own players - but it is currently is.

It highlights an issue, that isn't just LIV related - Apart from the guys who have 2 memberships (PGAT & DPWT), who is the highest ranked exclusive DPWT player in the world rankings?

Good pop quiz question

I was gonna go with Dean Burmester ranked in the 60's as he only got pgat card in the last couple of weeks but on checking him I see he was on korn tour earlier this year so its a grey area

 

[BubbaP]

BBC website was showing all the golf scores from all the tours last weekend, nothing from LIV. There’s nothing conspiracy theorist about that, it’s quite obvious they are making a decision not to cover it.

They did have this, with a link to the leaderboard
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/golf/62951117

 

[BubbaP]

Good pop quiz question

I was gonna go with Dean Burmester ranked in the 60's as he only got pgat card in the last couple of weeks but on checking him I see he was on korn tour earlier this year so its a grey area

I'd go Ryan Fox

 

[Swango1980]

BBC website was showing all the golf scores from all the tours last weekend, nothing from LIV. There’s nothing conspiracy theorist about that, it’s quite obvious they are making a decision not to cover it.

Please. can a respectfully ask you to get over yourself. I've just gone onto the BBC Golf Page, and of the 12 News articles on show, they can be split as:

• 5 related to LIV (including 1 related to the LIV results)
• 1 related to weekend PGA Result
• 1 related to LPGA
• 1 related to Ladies European Tour
• 1 related to Italian Open DP World Tour
• 1 related to blind golfers
• 1 related to the funeral of Reay
• 1 related to Ryder Cup

Stop playing the victim by trying to focus on one little element within the BBC, and making it sound like they are actively ignoring LIV. They are quite clearly NOT ignoring LIV in the slightest. If you are sad that you cannot see the leaderboard, why don't you just log into the LIV website. Surely it is just as easy to get access there!? I'm sure there are also good websites that you can get access to the Korn Ferry Tour, Challenge Tour, Sunshine Tour, etc.

 

[Backsticks]

Iain, Swango, you are just providing alternative facts. Please stop.
Some prefer to go with their fact that the BBC didnt report on LIV.....

 

[Mel Smooth]

Please. can a respectfully ask you to get over yourself. I've just gone onto the BBC Golf Page, and of the 12 News articles on show, they can be split as:

• 5 related to LIV (including 1 related to the LIV results)
• 1 related to weekend PGA Result
• 1 related to LPGA
• 1 related to Ladies European Tour
• 1 related to Italian Open DP World Tour
• 1 related to blind golfers
• 1 related to the funeral of Reay
• 1 related to Ryder Cup

Stop playing the victim by trying to focus on one little element within the BBC, and making it sound like they are actively ignoring LIV. They are quite clearly NOT ignoring LIV in the slightest. If you are sad that you cannot see the leaderboard, why don't you just log into the LIV website. Surely it is just as easy to get access there!? I'm sure there are also good websites that you can get access to the Korn Ferry Tour, Challenge Tour, Sunshine Tour, etc.

And over the weekend, they weren’t showing the scores.

It was Mark Crossfield that highlighted it, I’m just putting the information on here buddy.

 

[Bdill93]

Been away a while - now I'm back!

5 events in and I'd struggle to argue that LIV hasn't got better over those events.

Better player in, some great tournaments played - no complaints from me!

Found it pretty funny when Rory gave the LIV players a jab with his "lets see how they go over 72 holes" and it ended up being 54

Overall - I think there's place for both tours now and they should just work together for a solution. I do find spectating LIV on tv more entertaining than a PGA tour event.