A question about course rating

[rulefan]

This isn't true since golfers only play to handicap (or better) about 1/5 of the time, on average. Their expected scores are at least a stroke or two higher than this.

Demonstrated by their Index being the average of the BEST 8 from 20.

 

[Foxholer]

This isn't true since golfers only play to handicap (or better) about 1/5 of the time, on average. Their expected scores are at least a stroke or two higher than this.

That was the reason for the quote marks around 'expected'.

 

[mikejohnchapman]

I think there is some truth as really only a handful of players would use it very infrequently and rating a course is not a short time frame exercise. I would also ask ‘why’?

We are trying to get our yellows rated for ladies. The main reason being it gives an alternative to their single option of playing from the red tees and provides a championship option and also makes it more accessible for county / regional events.

 

[Doh]

We have done this for our ladies we also have done it for the men off the red tees which makes sense in the winter.

 

[wolrab79]

In my opinion all uk golf clubs should get courses rated of all tees for all sexes, my daughter plays national competitions and the courses are always lengthened to represent the standard of play by England golf or Wales golf etc.. I think a bigger problem is the tees for ladies are too short and demeaning for good lady golfers who hit a 260-280 yards drive on a par 5 that is 394 yards long. Men don't have that problem if you play off 54 handicap then you play of the yellows or back tees whatever. She regularly practices at two clubs who have been told by England golf not to get the courses rated for ladies of the back tees??? Surely this will hold back any future development of lady golfers?

 

[doublebogey7]

In my opinion all uk golf clubs should get courses rated of all tees for all sexes, my daughter plays national competitions and the courses are always lengthened to represent the standard of play by England golf or Wales golf etc.. I think a bigger problem is the tees for ladies are too short and demeaning for good lady golfers who hit a 260-280 yards drive on a par 5 that is 394 yards long. Men don't have that problem if you play off 54 handicap then you play of the yellows or back tees whatever. She regularly practices at two clubs who have been told by England golf not to get the courses rated for ladies of the back tees??? Surely this will hold back any future development of lady golfers?

I very much doubt that is the case, given that EG is trying to encourage all tees to be gender-free. More likely the county assessors are not keen to do it as it adds a not an insignificant time to the process.

 

[wjemather]

In my opinion all uk golf clubs should get courses rated of all tees for all sexes, my daughter plays national competitions and the courses are always lengthened to represent the standard of play by England golf or Wales golf etc.. I think a bigger problem is the tees for ladies are too short and demeaning for good lady golfers who hit a 260-280 yards drive on a par 5 that is 394 yards long. Men don't have that problem if you play off 54 handicap then you play of the yellows or back tees whatever. She regularly practices at two clubs who have been told by England golf not to get the courses rated for ladies of the back tees??? Surely this will hold back any future development of lady golfers?

In my experience, it is club committees and county rating teams that are the obstacle, not EG. (I posted about this earlier; see #8)

Anyway, not having tees rated may prevent submission of scores for handicapping, but it doesn't prevent play from those tees. If clubs are not allowing women to play from longer tees, then that is an issue to be raised with the club.

 

[PJ87]

We would like a course rating for our yellows tees for female players, we have been told that it cant be done because the course is over 6000yds. It doesn't seem right to me and I am wondering if our men's handicap secretary is just trying to fob us off.

Can anyone tell me if there is any truth in what he says.

Just had a look our red tees are 6187 yards so I'd suggest he is fobbing you off

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Just had a look our red tees are 6187 yards so I'd suggest he is fobbing you off

Likewise..we are 6192yds off yellows and these have been rated for ladies.

 

[chellie]

I was told they will only rate white and yellow tees for ladies if the club plans to run competitions that ladies can enter from those tees.

 

[rulefan]

I was told they will only rate white and yellow tees for ladies if the club plans to run competitions that ladies can enter from those tees.

As it is a pretty costly exercise for the County it seems a pretty pragmatic stance.

 

[mikejohnchapman]

I was told they will only rate white and yellow tees for ladies if the club plans to run competitions that ladies can enter from those tees.

I'm sure we have had this debate before. I am convinced the wrong question was asked during the initial assessment. It wasn't "what tees do you want rating for men and ladies?" it was "what tees do your men and ladies play from?" Hence in most cases it was Red for ladies and yellow / White for men. If the questions was asked now I suspect there might be different answers.

 

[rulefan]

We would like a course rating for our yellows tees for female players, we have been told that it cant be done because the course is over 6000yds. It doesn't seem right to me and I am wondering if our men's handicap secretary is just trying to fob us off.

Can anyone tell me if there is any truth in what he says.

None

 

[Foxholer]

Likewise..we are 6192yds off yellows and these have been rated for ladies.

I think the presence of a particular female member would likely have provided incentive for that!

 

[Foxholer]

I was told they will only rate white and yellow tees for ladies if the club plans to run competitions that ladies can enter from those tees.

There's a simple reply to/for that then.

 

[sweaty sock]

Maybe a silly question, but why does any course need rating for women? Surely the simple answer is that its one rating for everyone and your handicap levels the field? Sorry i know its a bit off topic...

 

[wjemather]

Maybe a silly question, but why does any course need rating for women? Surely the simple answer is that its one rating for everyone and your handicap levels the field? Sorry i know its a bit off topic...

I can't think of a reason why a single rating would not work for everyone. However, one of the major factors in course rating is distance and women simply don't hit the ball as far, so there would be significant consequences to not having different ratings; e.g. extremely few scratch women (current index would need to be about +6), handicaps well over 54 to compensate, etc.

 

[Bdill93]

Maybe a silly question, but why does any course need rating for women? Surely the simple answer is that its one rating for everyone and your handicap levels the field? Sorry i know its a bit off topic...

I think it just negates the difference in distances!

If the ladies are forced to play off the whites at my place, theyre given an additional number of strokes on top of their Playing Handicap.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

I think the presence of a particular female member would likely have provided incentive for that!

Indeed. She practices off the Whites - when I played 18 with her a few weeks back we played off these tees - she knocked it round in 4 under

Off the Whites we have carries from some tees that many ladies would really struggle with - indeed carries that many gents struggle with and why many of our Seniors play off the Yellows, and why the main midweek rollup is played off Yellows (as many Seniors play in it)

 

[Steve Wilkes]

Maybe a silly question, but why does any course need rating for women? Surely the simple answer is that its one rating for everyone and your handicap levels the field? Sorry i know its a bit off topic...

I agree I don't think it's a silly question, Courses are rated based on a scratch golfer and 'Bogey' golfer, If Mens and Ladies handicaps were based on the same standard, then a Player who goes round in scratch would hit about the same distance regardless of gender and the same for a 18 handicapper, I can't see how a female golfer could go round in the same scores of 90 or under as a male without hitting roughly the same distances. The only difference is maybe is max of say 60 handicap for female, but would a 54+ handicapper really play of the Whites or Yellows when the Reds would be nearer their ability