The Footie Thread

[Piece]

What, an owner that hasn't raised season ticket prices in 10 years is now supposed to lower them as a sorry? I'm fine with him keeping the season ticket price that I've already paid and the apology he's already issued, thanks all the same.

Good for you, I'm happy you're happy.

Perhaps I live in a different football world where doing something for the fans is more than just a "sorry about that". After all, it's been rammed down our throats during lockdown that football is nothing without fans. Clearly, it really isn't, is it?

 

[Blue in Munich]

I would have like to see the words or the intention from these six clubs to make a substantial voluntary donation to grass roots on top of this "fine". Plus maybe reducing season ticket prices as a "sorry" to the fans.

Good for you, I'm happy you're happy.

Perhaps I live in a different football world where doing something for the fans is more than just a "sorry about that". After all, it's been rammed down our throats during lockdown that football is nothing without fans. Clearly, it really isn't, is it?

So capping season ticket prices for 10 years isn't doing something for the fans; capping the air fares to Porto for the Champions League final at £199 when bucket airlines had prices the roof wasn't doing something for the fans; buying a club that was about to go under & building it up to what it is today isn't doing something for the fans; what exactly does he have to do to gain your approval?

As a fan that has been going for over 40 years, this owner has done more than enough for the fans, and we are very grateful to him. Did the club make a ricket with the ESL? Yes they did, but they were the first to realise their error. If an apology only counts to you if it comes with a cash handout then clearly you do live in a different world, and not one I want to be a part of.

 

[clubchamp98]

You are going back 30 years - the game has moved on from then whether we like it or not - the clubs aren’t going to go back to how it was before the CL

Maybe but imo it was better then .
Football is at saturation point and the CL is boring until the knockouts, there’s something on the games then.
That’s sadly lacking in the league stage.
But we all know it’s just about money now!

 

[Piece]

So capping season ticket prices for 10 years isn't doing something for the fans; capping the air fares to Porto for the Champions League final at £199 when bucket airlines had prices the roof wasn't doing something for the fans; buying a club that was about to go under & building it up to what it is today isn't doing something for the fans; what exactly does he have to do to gain your approval?

Other clubs have frozen their season ticket prices (granted maybe not over 10 years, so that is commendable). Sheik Mansour offered to pay official travel to the Champions League final; they are many other examples of subsidised travel, not just to elite finals, but for a rainy cold away Tuesday night in Stoke for example. Many owners have come in and saved a club, mine included. My opinion is your examples aren't really any different to what most clubs are already doing/have done anyway; call it Business As Usual examples if you want.

As a fan that has been going for over 40 years, this owner has done more than enough for the fans, and we are very grateful to him. Did the club make a ricket with the ESL? Yes they did, but they were the first to realise their error. If an apology only counts to you if it comes with a cash handout then clearly you do live in a different world, and not one I want to be a part of.

After the ESL debacle and COVID lockdown, I was hoping to see a shift in attitude from all of football to the fans, not just the ESL clubs. Having said that, back to my original point of view, if one or two ESL English clubs are going above and beyond to assist fans, flow additional money down the pyramid or do something that isn't what I consider BAU then that's great and it will be the start of a happier football world IMHO. Others then may follow suit and the game could change for the better. The fact that you are willing to see things as OK (general statement - please take that the right way ), then it's likely things will never change. I think we both want things to change in football, and part of that for me, is more fan appreciation whether through a season ticket "hand out", small discount on merch, fairer share of football revenue or whatever. Just something that shows that game-going fans really do matter and preserving the football pyramid matters, rather than tokenised words that football is "nothing without fans". Granted, seismic business football model changes are required for that to happen, but perhaps I'm dreaming if I think anything different would happen in light of recent events, however small, to start the process of change for the betterment of the game.

You are obviously happy and that's fine. . This fan isn't. In fact, I'm considering not renewing my season ticket because of the above despite the fact we are back in the EPL.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Other clubs have frozen their season ticket prices (granted maybe not over 10 years, so that is commendable). Sheik Mansour offered to pay official travel to the Champions League final; they are many other examples of subsidised travel, not just to elite finals, but for a rainy cold away Tuesday night in Stoke for example. Many owners have come in and saved a club, mine included. My opinion is your examples aren't really any different to what most clubs are already doing/have done anyway; call it Business As Usual examples if you want.



After the ESL debacle and COVID lockdown, I was hoping to see a shift in attitude from all of football to the fans, not just the ESL clubs. Having said that, back to my original point of view, if one or two ESL English clubs are going above and beyond to assist fans, flow additional money down the pyramid or do something that isn't what I consider BAU then that's great and it will be the start of a happier football world IMHO. Others then may follow suit and the game could change for the better. The fact that you are willing to see things as OK (general statement - please take that the right way ), then it's likely things will never change. I think we both want things to change in football, and part of that for me, is more fan appreciation whether through a season ticket "hand out", small discount on merch, fairer share of football revenue or whatever. Just something that shows that game-going fans really do matter and preserving the football pyramid matters, rather than tokenised words that football is "nothing without fans". Granted, seismic business football model changes are required for that to happen, but perhaps I'm dreaming if I think anything different would happen in light of recent events, however small, to start the process of change for the betterment of the game.

You are obviously happy and that's fine. . This fan isn't. In fact, I'm considering not renewing my season ticket because of the above despite the fact we are back in the EPL.

Nothing was going to change after the ESL stuff because unfortunately those clubs hold the cards with the Prem League and not the other way around

The Premier League has now got to the stage that it just keeps the money rolling in .

Whilst people point fingers at clubs for all the ills and woes of the game maybe there should also be fingers pointed at - Sky, players and their agents - they are all smack bang in the middle of the money wheel

The arrival of people like Abramovich and Mansoor changed the whole outlook - millions after millions spent not just on the top players but also the midrange players were suddenly picking up £50k a week , one of the reasons why the clubs went to the ESL was to allow them to get more money in to be able to spend on the big players

Just look this summer - it’s been 12 months of many people counting the pennies yet the Prem will prob spend millions upon millions , clubs are going to look to spend £100mil on Kane , £150mil on Haaland

It’s not going to change - the bubble won’t burst because people continue to buy sky buy more importantly sell the rights abroad.

It’s just the way it is now and I can’t see what will stop it

 

[larmen]

If you take the Champions only out of one of the domestic cups and go back to European cup champions only.
Home and away knock out. Why could it not work?
I would rather watch that than some meaningless CL game.
2/3/4 th place go in a mini league in Europe ARC ( Also Rans Cup)
Cup winners cup. FA a only .
That’s five places in Europe that’s enough imo.

Someone would be knocked out in the 1st round and crying about not making any money.

which is possibly a good thing?

 

[Blue in Munich]

Other clubs have frozen their season ticket prices (granted maybe not over 10 years, so that is commendable). Sheik Mansour offered to pay official travel to the Champions League final; they are many other examples of subsidised travel, not just to elite finals, but for a rainy cold away Tuesday night in Stoke for example. Many owners have come in and saved a club, mine included. My opinion is your examples aren't really any different to what most clubs are already doing/have done anyway; call it Business As Usual examples if you want.

https://www.chelseafc.com/en/foundation/blue-pitches

https://www.chelseafc.com/en/foundation

https://www.chelseafc.com/en/news/2021/02/15/chelsea-fc-launch-say-no-to-antisemitism-website

Chelsea started subsidising away travel for fans to most if not all domestic games back in 2014 so I think Roman has covered Tuesday nights in Stoke. I'm also aware that when the pitch has been relaid at Stamford Bridge, the old one has been relaid at non-league clubs with whom we have an affiliation. I believe they also sponsor or assisted in setting up a local bus service in the Cobham area at the behest of the local Councillor.

So is Chelsea's owner actually doing anything for the fans or the community, or is all this just business as usual?

After the ESL debacle and COVID lockdown, I was hoping to see a shift in attitude from all of football to the fans, not just the ESL clubs. Having said that, back to my original point of view, if one or two ESL English clubs are going above and beyond to assist fans, flow additional money down the pyramid or do something that isn't what I consider BAU then that's great and it will be the start of a happier football world IMHO. Others then may follow suit and the game could change for the better. The fact that you are willing to see things as OK (general statement - please take that the right way ), then it's likely things will never change. I think we both want things to change in football, and part of that for me, is more fan appreciation whether through a season ticket "hand out", small discount on merch, fairer share of football revenue or whatever. Just something that shows that game-going fans really do matter and preserving the football pyramid matters, rather than tokenised words that football is "nothing without fans". Granted, seismic business football model changes are required for that to happen, but perhaps I'm dreaming if I think anything different would happen in light of recent events, however small, to start the process of change for the betterment of the game.

You are obviously happy and that's fine. . This fan isn't. In fact, I'm considering not renewing my season ticket because of the above despite the fact we are back in the EPL.

When you originally posted about reducing season ticket prices and doing more than just saying sorry, I took it as it read; that the owners of the clubs involved should be saying sorry to their own fans or making restitution to their own fans. I didn't see anything about them flowing money down the rest of the football pyramid, and I based my response to your post on how my club has treated me. And yes, I'm very happy with that.

Am I happy with the way the game is administered; no, I'm not, but that wasn't what the original post asked. Yes, wealth should be distributed more fairly and no, there shouldn't be footballers earning in a month what nurses & coppers earn in a lifetime. But the blame for this lies squarely at the feet of those in the FA, Premier League & UEFA who have sold the TV rights to Sky & the game down the river.

I do not feel underappreciated in any way, shape or form by my club & my owner, and I'm happy with what he has done for me as a fan. Where I do feel underappreciated is by Sky, who have been given licence by the domestic governing bodies to bugger about with kick off times to their heart's content and by UEFA; my contempt for them is well recorded on this site. They have interfered with European competitions to drag as much money out of the fans as possible, and in doing so have succeeded in diminishing the importance of the domestic cup competitions. Sadly as @Liverpoolphil has said, that genie is well & truly out of the bottle & I don't see anything changing anytime soon.

 

[clubchamp98]

Someone would be knocked out in the 1st round and crying about not making any money.

which is possibly a good thing?

They could just divvy up the TV money at the start.
So all teams get the same no matter how far you go.
The winners get a bonus ( insert sum here) so winners get more that’s how it should be.

 

[Blue in Munich]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/57435400

 

[ColchesterFC]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/57435400

I must be missing something, but how does thicker lines help eliminate narrow offsides? By making the attacker's line thicker it moves it closer to the goal so will still be offside even with a thicker defender's line. It's still all going to be about where they choose to draw the line.

 

[Liverbirdie]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/57435400

Maybe less thick officials may be better.

 

[Blue in Munich]

I must be missing something, but how does thicker lines help eliminate narrow offsides? By making the attacker's line thicker it moves it closer to the goal so will still be offside even with a thicker defender's line. It's still all going to be about where they choose to draw the line.

And that is the issue; where they choose to draw it & what frame they use. I can remember one this season where the ball appears to have left the foot of the attacker; sorry, but the ball is played the moment it is hit, not when it leaves the foot.

 

[Blue in Munich]

Maybe less thick officials may be better.

Some responses to this from a football chat room;

Won't stop them from freezing the frame at different times, depending on the club

They'll still then have a way to fudge it to suit the answer they want

If both lines are made thicker, how does change anything?

Last bit of that article is farcical.
Decisions were less consistent...but at least they were faster!

It doesn't, just gives them a "well, we adjusted it to make it better" excuse
It'll still be the same (description removed to avoid a royal Fraggering) at Stockley Park making mistakes week in, week out

Still the same thickness of referees adjudicating though unfortunately

Didn't know you posted on that site Pete...

 

[Orikoru]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/57435400

The game is being run by idiots. Try no lines and using your eyes for God's sake!

 

[fundy]

And that is the issue; where they choose to draw it & what frame they use. I can remember one this season where the ball appears to have left the foot of the attacker; sorry, but the ball is played the moment it is hit, not when it leaves the foot.

you only have to see how many frames they go through on snicko in the cricket to see if theres been an edge to know how accurate the pick a frame is currently!

 

[Piece]

The game is being run by idiots. Try no lines and using your eyes for God's sake!

and then you'll have managers and fans wanting technology to help...rinse...repeat

 

[Orikoru]

and then you'll have managers and fans wanting technology to help...rinse...repeat

No, my point is use the video replay but simply look at it and see if he looks offside. It feels like the answer is staring them in the face but they've walked straight past it. Occam's Razor I think they call it.

 

[sunshine]

restricting entry to the CL to champions would be a start. It's farcical that we have just had a "Champions League" final featuring 2 clubs from the same country, neither of who qualified as champions.

Although I agree with you, creating the champions league i.e. introducing a group stage instead of straight knock out, was a stroke of genius. It made the competition much more interesting. I remember a period in the 90s after the group stage had been introduced but the competition was still limited to league champions - for me that was the peak period. Of course it's now become a bloated monster.

 

[sunshine]

I just ordered one of these. Bit of retro quality for only 30 quid.

I am a fan of the 1990 England shirts (especially the home shirt), immortalised by the World in Motion video and Gazza's tears.

But £30 for that! It looks like something you'd get in a market stall for a fiver.

 

[Orikoru]

Although I agree with you, creating the champions league i.e. introducing a group stage instead of straight knock out, was a stroke of genius. It made the competition much more interesting. I remember a period in the 90s after the group stage had been introduced but the competition was still limited to league champions - for me that was the peak period. Of course it's now become a bloated monster.

I don't know though - I only know this because of Champ Manager 01/02 but in those years there were two group stages! Once you get through the first one the second round was a group stage as well. I don't think the group format was to make it more exciting, it's just to ensure everyone gets at least 6 games for the £££. Instead of crashing out unexpectedly and missing out.