The all things EV chat thread

[PJ87]

Quite an interesting visual aid as to how far 100kw of production of energy will get you in distance (in km) for 4 cars. 2 electric and 2 hydrogen

Whilst hydrogen is brilliant to refill speed wise you can see why electric has been pushed as it is the more efficient use of energy

Similar visuals been done before with fossil fuel power I'd have to find it but it was similar, apart from walking / cycling electric is the most efficient form of personal transport

 

[3 jabber]

View attachment 54898

Quite an interesting visual aid as to how far 100kw of production of energy will get you in distance (in km) for 4 cars. 2 electric and 2 hydrogen

Whilst hydrogen is brilliant to refill speed wise you can see why electric has been pushed as it is the more efficient use of energy

Similar visuals been done before with fossil fuel power I'd have to find it but it was similar, apart from walking / cycling electric is the most efficient form of personal transport

I love how you only ever see your side of an argument

 

[PJ87]

I love how you only ever see your side of an argument

I love how you appear "keen" on switching to an EV whilst rehashing the same view over and over.. almost like you just posting for a reaction

"Don't know if this is a good or bad thing, thinking of buying an EV and looking at 2nd hand. Year old, £23k saving on list price. Seriously? Are these cars going to become worthless?!?!"

"I quite fancy an EV but can't get my head around owning a car when it's 10 years old, the batteries have a range of 50 miles and it has virtually zero 2nd hand value."

"I'm considering a car change and very undecided what to go for. Thought long and hard about an EV but as a private cash buyer they are not worth it. 2nd values plummeting, can pick one up for good money about 3 or 4 years old but as I tend to keep my cars around 5 years or so it will be worth next to nothing when I come to sell it. It appears they are not all they are cracked up to be."

 

[stevied]

View attachment 54898

Quite an interesting visual aid as to how far 100kw of production of energy will get you in distance (in km) for 4 cars. 2 electric and 2 hydrogen

Whilst hydrogen is brilliant to refill speed wise you can see why electric has been pushed as it is the more efficient use of energy

Similar visuals been done before with fossil fuel power I'd have to find it but it was similar, apart from walking / cycling electric is the most efficient form of personal transport

The most abundant element in the universe but no natural sources. Good old hydrogen!

 

[3 jabber]

I love how you appear "keen" on switching to an EV whilst rehashing the same view over and over.. almost like you just posting for a reaction

"Don't know if this is a good or bad thing, thinking of buying an EV and looking at 2nd hand. Year old, £23k saving on list price. Seriously? Are these cars going to become worthless?!?!"

"I quite fancy an EV but can't get my head around owning a car when it's 10 years old, the batteries have a range of 50 miles and it has virtually zero 2nd hand value."

"I'm considering a car change and very undecided what to go for. Thought long and hard about an EV but as a private cash buyer they are not worth it. 2nd values plummeting, can pick one up for good money about 3 or 4 years old but as I tend to keep my cars around 5 years or so it will be worth next to nothing when I come to sell it. It appears they are not all they are cracked up to be."

I like the idea of an EV but unlike you I see both sides of the arguement. Great in principle but with everything going on in the EV world I'm not convinced now is the time to switch. I'm sure you will tell me it is though.

 

[PJ87]

The most abundant element in the universe but no natural sources. Good old hydrogen!

I'd really like to see hydrogen come to the table (even if it isn't as efficient) just to get more people away from fossil fuels however with the date getting closer for banning sale of new cars combined with more and more EV chargers. Models etc entering the market they will need to seriously ramp up role out in a shorter space of time. The infrastructure isn't even about yet and they closed some of the refilling stations already.

 

[bobmac]

I like the idea of an EV but unlike you I see both sides of the arguement. Great in principle but with everything going on in the EV world I'm not convinced now is the time to switch. I'm sure you will tell me it is though.

No-one is telling you to buy an EV, buy what you want.
Just encouraging you to make the decision based on facts, not misinformation
eg
The car you quoted the Mokka e ultimate is £41,295 RRP but £31,999 showroom
The Mokka ultimate petrol is £33,715 RRP but £32,999 showroom

 

[harpo_72]

I like the idea of an EV but unlike you I see both sides of the arguement. Great in principle but with everything going on in the EV world I'm not convinced now is the time to switch. I'm sure you will tell me it is though.

To be honest I was worried about cost and depreciation. But then I took an in depth view of my vehicle usage and how we treat our cars.
We do a few long trips a year but mainly less than 30miles a day. So charging at services is occasional and our supplier offers us charging at 7p a kilowatt.. so we save a bit.
But for me it’s not an environmental choice, and to suggest it is would be hypocritical. Anyone who buys a new car frequently is impacting the environment. There is a big question about sustainability and repair and maintenance, which is overlooked.
I disagree with the costs of EVs to a degree I would argue the public is being lied to. Tesla’s price cutting was beneficial and also helped to highlight there is a bit of dishonesty from the major manufacturers. The tariffs on China produced cars are protecting them but I don’t see the Europeans really dropping their prices. I don’t want to be flooded with inferior China products either, but we need them in our market to keep it competitive.
I would suggest you purchase a nearly new EV if your interested and push the price down some dealership will negotiate some will not .. those that don’t will go out of business. Make sure you know about the batteries and warranties etc …

 

[Bunkermagnet]

No-one is telling you to buy an EV, buy what you want.
Just encouraging you to make the decision based on facts, not misinformation
eg
The car you quoted the Mokka e ultimate is £41,295 RRP but £31,999 showroom
The Mokka ultimate petrol is £33,715 RRP but £32,999 showroom

As the retail list price is over £40k. that example would also be subject to the increase VED for the follwoing 5 yrs

 

[larmen]

…

As the retail list price is over £40k. that example would also be subject to the increase VED for the follwoing 5 yrs

Is that like stamp duty? 250k or whatever it is you pay, 249,999 it’s free?
The property market adjusted, housed were 249 or 275+ (2007 numbers). Does the car market adjust to it?

 

[cliveb]

The most abundant element in the universe but no natural sources. Good old hydrogen!

There are huge stores of hydrogen underground. And unlike oil, which takes millions of years to form, a lot of hydrogen is generated quite quickly by water seeping into the rock and reacting with iron. It's effectively a renewable.

Problem is that until recently none of the drilling companies have cared about it. They focus on drilling where there is oil and gas, which is a different geology to where you find hydrogen. That might change soon.

 

[Bunkermagnet]

…

Is that like stamp duty? 250k or whatever it is you pay, 249,999 it’s free?
The property market adjusted, housed were 249 or 275+ (2007 numbers). Does the car market adjust to it?

No it;s VED (or car tax as it was commonly known). Currentlly, for most ICE vehicles under 3 ton it's £190 but if the retail listed price is over £40k then for the 5 years after it's first birthday it's an extra £390 a year. From April 2025, it will included all EV's and be retro applicable (so no matter how old it is).
Thats as I understand it anyways

 

[bobmac]

As the retail list price is over £40k. that example would also be subject to the increase VED for the follwoing 5 yrs

Another reason not to buy a new EV.

Better off comparing a nearly new Mokka with a nearly new Mokka e
2023 Mokka 10,000miles...£21,495
2023 Mokka e 9,914 miles....£18,994

Some will say EVs are too expensive, now they are saying they're too cheap.
Buy what you want

 

[Bunkermagnet]

Another reason not to buy a new EV.

Better off comparing a nearly new Mokka with a nearly new Mokka e
2023 Mokka 10,000miles...£21,495
2023 Mokka e 9,914 miles....£18,994

Some will say EVs are too expensive, now they are saying they're too cheap.
Buy what you want

Or any EV under 6 yrs old with a retail list price over £40k

 

[jim8flog]

Hydrogen-
Had a article on my FB feed showing a hydrogen car with a range of 1500km

Trouble in this country is that there is so little infrastructure for it.

Reminds of when I considered switching a gas guzzler I owned to run on propane.

 

[PJ87]

Or any EV under 6 yrs old with a retail list price over £40k

I don't follow the 40k part here? The over 40k bit is only from next year. I bought brand new in January and I pay no tax ATM and I'm not subject to the over 40k charge (even though mine cost 42k) nor is any EV at present .. any EV registered before April 1st 2025 is not subject to that tax.



So second hand is perfect to buy ATM

 

[Bunkermagnet]

I don't follow the 40k part here? The over 40k bit is only from next year. I bought brand new in January and I pay no tax ATM and I'm not subject to the over 40k charge (even though mine cost 42k) nor is any EV at present .. any EV registered before April 1st 2025 is not subject to that tax.

View attachment 54901

So second hand is perfect to buy ATM

RAC VED info
This says it retro applied, and VED will be paid by all vehicles.....

 

[PJ87]

RAC VED info
This says it retro applied, and VED will be paid by all vehicles.....

Yes VED will be but the higher rate won't be.

 

[jim8flog]

RAC VED info
This says it retro applied, and VED will be paid by all vehicles.....

In simple terms the the new rate of VED will apply to all electric vehicles from April 2025 regardless of when the were first registered

It says backdated but the important point is actually understanding what that means in terms of the legislation-

If a car was previously taxed at zero cost (exempt) it will no longer be so.

Using low emission ICE cars as an example if the VED was £30 when new when the new rate of VED moved to the higher level it did not apply to an old car so they carry on paying £30.

 

[PJ87]

In simple terms the the new rate of VED will apply to all electric vehicles from April 2025 regardless of when the were first registered

It says backdated but the important point is actually understanding what that means in terms of the legislation-

If a car was previously taxed at zero cost (exempt) it will no longer be so.

Using low emission ICE cars as an example if the VED was £30 when new when the new rate of VED moved to the higher level it did not apply to an old car so they carry on paying £30.

It is easy to miss the information though as they try to make it clear as mud..when I got the niro the sales people weren't sure themselves, considering they were selling the car you would expect them to know tbh so why would people who don't drive EVs to know.

They also were rattling off that octopus intelligent would work with ev6 to someone else.. when it won't because it hadn't for a year .. so the dealers need to keep their information levels up for the products they sell

But then that's life across the board now days. For example I had an issue when insuring the car (they couldn't find on their system as had just been registered) anyways one guy was "tough that's that" the lady I got on the second call spent 2 hours on the phone with me going back and forth to the underwriters understanding the issue rather than just "computer says no" response of the guy before

(For context the provider didn't have the niro 22 model ,it's a 24 plate, in the 4 trim level, only the 2 trim so they refused to insure as the 4 didn't exist according to them. Even when I found a second hand one on auto trader with a number plate the lady said the system wasn't finding it, long and short they insured as a 4 from the previous model with a big note on the file "this is 24 model")