The all things EV chat thread

[road2ruin]

Interesting (and well balanced) thread on Twitter that looks at some of the most anti EV stories appearing in the media….

https://x.com/colinwalker79/status/1757443513913127089?s=46&t=m-wLwJBSL1Krp6GA3MWxJg

 

[PJ87]

Interesting (and well balanced) thread on Twitter that looks at some of the most anti EV stories appearing in the media….

https://x.com/colinwalker79/status/1757443513913127089?s=46&t=m-wLwJBSL1Krp6GA3MWxJg

The issue is cold facts like this take time to read , digest etc

However a snappy little picture of made up information takes seconds to read and influence

 

[bobmac]

Well, it's happy birthday to my Nissan Leaf, one today.
One year since I've had to buy petrol, well apart from a gallon for my lawn mower which will be replaced by a battery powered Worx soon.

 

[PJ87]

Well, it's happy birthday to my Nissan Leaf, one today.
One year since I've had to buy petrol, well apart from a gallon for my lawn mower which will be replaced by a battery powered Worx soon.

Wow is it a year already?

Today the Corsa is officially fully paid off, they took their final payment at 9am so bye bye

Can't remember when I last bought diesel. Must have been around Xmas as I sold the car with just under a full tank. However a tank would last months ..

Still loving life?

 

[Deleted member 35577]

The issue is cold facts like this take time to read , digest etc

However a snappy little picture of made up information takes seconds to read and influence

Do you respond to every post in this thread?

 

[PJ87]

Do you respond to every post in this thread?

Yes.

 

[harpo_72]

Has anyone seen the VAG group’s policy on their battery condition?
I think it is “They will replace if it gets below 80% capacity up until it’s 10years old.”
But they don’t confirm when 80% is likely to happen, so you could be 1-2years into its lifetime and be disappointed with the range with no recourse.
It’s stuff like this that really is negative for EV ownership. I would argue the battery suppliers are taking the mick and have seen a cash cow opportunity

 

[PJ87]

Has anyone seen the VAG group’s policy on their battery condition?
I think it is “They will replace if it gets below 80% capacity up until it’s 10years old.”
But they don’t confirm when 80% is likely to happen, so you could be 1-2years into its lifetime and be disappointed with the range with no recourse.
It’s stuff like this that really is negative for EV ownership. I would argue the battery suppliers are taking the mick and have seen a cash cow opportunity

Batteries don't degrade like this on the whole

So 100% isn't 100% .. a buffer is at the top and the bottom .. so that gets managed over time so in 10 years 100% will remain but the buffer will have gone

The 8 year warranty is just for battery failure as they so unlikely to fail

Just seen a Kia soul sold 100k miles 8 years. State of health was 97%!

 

[jim8flog]

Wow 5400 posts in this thread. Surely it just needs everyone to reply Yes or No then the thread can be closed

bit like saying
"do you play golf"
Everybody says yes and then we close every golf thread.

 

[PJ87]

bit like saying
"do you play golf"
Everybody says yes and then we close every golf thread.

I find this thread quite pleasant. I've had a few messages about advise for EV tariffs, second hand cars or just general questions about EVs. I even had a forumer I've never even spoken to email me to ask me for my referral code to octopus as I gave them such high praise on here. That was very nice tbh.

All the moaning on this forum of the place being unwelcoming and "not what it was" still seems a lot of good when people don't pick holes.

 

[jim8flog]

I do. I've never bought a new car and I've never sold a car as roadworthy. Every car I've owned has been run into the ground and then sold to a scrapyard (except for one that was written off after I crashed it). The two cars we currently own are a 12 plate Ford C-Max (given to me for nothing when my dad gave up driving) which has 80k miles on the clock and should last another 8 to 10 years at least and a 63 plate Vauxhall Zafira that we are probably going to trade in fairly soon for a second hand Transit type van for Mrs Colch's work so we can get rid of the caravan. I've never seen the point in buying a new car and watching the value drop by thousands of pounds as soon as you drive it off the forecourt.

For many years now I have bought either new or nearly new (preferably nearly new) and changed them after 3 years. roughly at 4 years old. I do this because the car still has a fairly good value to offset against the cost of the replacement car e.g last car bought as one year old for £13k sold 3 years later for just over £10k

I used to do what you do then found I had to find too much money to buy a replacement because there was next to no value to the old car.

One obvious advantage to new or nearly new is the warranty and the lack of worry about costs of repairs e.g I had one car need a new gearbox within the last 2 months of the warranty period.

 

[harpo_72]

Batteries don't degrade like this on the whole

So 100% isn't 100% .. a buffer is at the top and the bottom .. so that gets managed over time so in 10 years 100% will remain but the buffer will have gone

The 8 year warranty is just for battery failure as they so unlikely to fail

Just seen a Kia soul sold 100k miles 8 years. State of health was 97%!

I think the Korean’s are ahead .. I think the VAG group have a few nasties in the wardrobe that will be socialised in the years ahead.
The buffer is dependent on the battery type as well. My brother was telling me about his Tesla range and then saying I cannot discharge it or charge 100% .. so this causes a big discrepancy to WLTP range figures ( which are a farce on all levels ) Had he gone for the RWD model with the different battery chemistry he would have been able to discharge and charge 100% more frequently.. but this was a smaller range.
The real issue here is how we talk about these cars and how we communicate capabilities and efficiency in a way that all can understand.

 

[PJ87]

For many years now I have bought either new or nearly new (preferably nearly new) and changed them after 3 years. roughly at 4 years old. I do this because the car still has a fairly good value to offset against the cost of the replacement car e.g last car bought as one year old for £13k sold 3 years later for just over £10k

I used to do what you do then found I had to find too much money to buy a replacement because there was next to no value to the old car.

One obvious advantage to new or nearly new is the warranty and the lack of worry about costs of repairs e.g I had one car need a new gearbox within the last 2 months of the warranty period.

This is 90% the reason I went Kia.

I had a lot of issues with my Corsa build quality. Not the EV side but the car side as I mentioned. The 3 year warranty ran out and luckily I extended it.

Kia have very good build quality and 7 year warranty it was a very much right I got 7 years worry free motoring now

Done my spreadsheet up until 2035 in service costs etc aswell

 

[PJ87]

I think the Korean’s are ahead .. I think the VAG group have a few nasties in the wardrobe that will be socialised in the years ahead.
The buffer is dependent on the battery type as well. My brother was telling me about his Tesla range and then saying I cannot discharge it or charge 100% .. so this causes a big discrepancy to WLTP range figures ( which are a farce on all levels ) Had he gone for the RWD model with the different battery chemistry he would have been able to discharge and charge 100% more frequently.. but this was a smaller range.
The real issue here is how we talk about these cars and how we communicate capabilities and efficiency in a way that all can understand.

Agreed. WTLP for example isn't fit for purpose. I look for real range. But that's done by little reviews on YouTube or indi websites

Not the media who still report what the car manufacturers tell them

Did we learn nothing from the emissions scandal?

 

[jim8flog]

This is 90% the reason I went Kia.

I had a lot of issues with my Corsa build quality. Not the EV side but the car side as I mentioned. The 3 year warranty ran out and luckily I extended it.

Kia have very good build quality and 7 year warranty it was a very much right I got 7 years worry free motoring now

Done my spreadsheet up until 2035 in service costs etc aswell

I had considered the Kia but it was so expensive compared to the deal I got on the Peugeot and they also offer annual extension to the warranty at very reasonable cost.

I had a Kona on loan for a day and got really bad back ache in it.

With the Peugeot I had the demo car for a week so it was easy to make up my mind.

 

[PJ87]

I had considered the Kia but it was so expensive compared to the deal I got on the Peugeot and they also offer annual extension to the warranty at very reasonable cost.

I had a Kona on loan for a day and got really bad back ache in it.

With the Peugeot I had the demo car for a week so it was easy to make up my mind.

Did you adjust the lumbar support? I played around with that straight away

Kia is very expensive second hand ATM aswell because of that Warrenty

Kona was 15k with 1.5 year warranty left. Same age Kia would have 3.5 year warranty left , starting around 18k

 

[PJ87]

I think the Korean’s are ahead .. I think the VAG group have a few nasties in the wardrobe that will be socialised in the years ahead.
The buffer is dependent on the battery type as well. My brother was telling me about his Tesla range and then saying I cannot discharge it or charge 100% .. so this causes a big discrepancy to WLTP range figures ( which are a farce on all levels ) Had he gone for the RWD model with the different battery chemistry he would have been able to discharge and charge 100% more frequently.. but this was a smaller range.
The real issue here is how we talk about these cars and how we communicate capabilities and efficiency in a way that all can understand.

Just as a side note here

Below is my powerwall, this is a 3rd party app I use to monitor the energy flow rather than the Tesla app

On the Tesla app when it's full it says 100%

On this app it gives me 109% for the total capacity (usable is 13.5kw) so it is saying my battery ATM can hold 14.71 KW of energy

Believe when it was new it was 15kw but this 14.71 changes all the time, lowest I've seen is 14.67 and highest 14.79 . All within last few months

Depends on state of charge when charged up and other boring things

But the fact of the matter is I have a 10 year warranty on said battery at 70% , that's 9.45kw , I'd very much doubt it will get down that low even in 15 years but will be interesting to see .

It gets discharged most days

 

[harpo_72]

Just as a side note here

Below is my powerwall, this is a 3rd party app I use to monitor the energy flow rather than the Tesla app

On the Tesla app when it's full it says 100%

On this app it gives me 109% for the total capacity (usable is 13.5kw) so it is saying my battery ATM can hold 14.71 KW of energy

Believe when it was new it was 15kw but this 14.71 changes all the time, lowest I've seen is 14.67 and highest 14.79 . All within last few months

Depends on state of charge when charged up and other boring things

But the fact of the matter is I have a 10 year warranty on said battery at 70% , that's 9.45kw , I'd very much doubt it will get down that low even in 15 years but will be interesting to see .

It gets discharged most days

View attachment 51868

Interesting stuff, I suspect it’s temperature related as well.
Also I think battery cycles are the key and what is deemed a full cycle or not.
I don’t think we can ignore the experience we have with mobile phones and their battery cycles. Ultimately the chemistry will dictate this performance but usage is an important factor.

 

[PJ87]

Interesting stuff, I suspect it’s temperature related as well.
Also I think battery cycles are the key and what is deemed a full cycle or not.
I don’t think we can ignore the experience we have with mobile phones and their battery cycles. Ultimately the chemistry will dictate this performance but usage is an important factor.

Ah see that's the science that we have to ignore , it's part of the misunderstanding of EV batteries

"Unlike the lithium-ion batteries found in a phone or laptop, EV batteries utilize complex battery management systems (BMS) that regulate how the batteries are charged and discharged to prolong their life. That means your EV battery is most likely to experience temperature or calendar degradation."

 

[jim8flog]

Did you adjust the lumbar support? I played around with that straight away

It was a loan car for a day. Not going to bother to learn a lot about it for the sake of one day. Additional two big problems I had with it was no way of knowing how to turn lane assist off (my first experience of lane assist and it scared me a lot) and it would not lock, luckily I was parking in a private area.