Nomads to get official handicaps

[hovis]

Anyone that thinks that the membership fee is just about getting a handicap doesn't understand what goes into running a club.

That doesn't make sense. Who joins a club thinking that their £1200 subs is spent on obtaining a handicap?

 

[IanM]

Anyone that thinks that the membership fee is just about getting a handicap doesn't understand what goes into running a club.

....it's probably don't care!

Look. Anything that makes golf more accessible is a good thing. Any issues it causes will come out in the wash! (eventually!)

 

[howbow88]

We can all do that.

Where? The MyEG app is super basic, or at least my Android one is. Is entering scores coming at some point in an update?

 

[Old Skier]

Where? The MyEG app is super basic, or at least my Android one is. Is entering scores coming at some point in an update?

Are you not able to do it through your ISV app

 

[howbow88]

We input the scores and upload the card photo via the Intelligent Golf App.

Ah right. We have been uploading through Master Scoreboard, but only when we have been playing competitions, and these scores were double checked by our handicap secretary before being 'confirmed'. We can't load up scores outside of our organised comps... That is my point/question - where do Nomads upload scores, and how does the app know that they're legit? It seems very trust based to me...

 

[Old Skier]

Ah right. We have been uploading through Master Scoreboard, but only when we have been playing competitions, and these scores were double checked by our handicap secretary before being 'confirmed'. We can't load up scores outside of our organised comps... That is my point/question - where do Nomads upload scores, and how does the app know that they're legit? It seems very trust based to me...

At the moment they don't until EG update there app . The trust issue is no different than what club members are expected to be.

 

[rosecott]

Here in the South West I know of one Club that charges £1 per annum membership plus the County and EG affiliation fees. For that you get a handicap, entry to their competitions (on paying a green fee), the County Card which gives you discounted golf nationwide, insurance from EG etc.. There is also one in my county that charges £36 per annum including county and EG affiliation fees. Neither of these Clubs, which anyone can join from anywhere in the UK, are overwhelmed by nomadic golfers despite the attractiveness of the offering.This new EG scheme will have to go some to beat these deals and I am sure there are equivalent ones elsewhere in the country.

I'm a bit surprised that no action was taken by EG/County Union. CONGU do not seem to have published their view since their manual was superseded by WHS, but it was pretty clear in their last issue:

Dec.8(a) Status of ‘Handicap Only’ or ‘Competition Handicap’ (or the like) categories of golf club membership in the context of a CONGU® Definition of a Member.

It is a matter for individual golf clubs to determine the nature of their categories of membership. However, forms or categories of membership such as ‘Handicap Only’ or ‘Competition Membership’ satisfy neither the spirit nor intent of the definition of a ‘Member’ as contained in the CONGU UHS and do not qualify for the allotment of a CONGU ® Handicap.

 

[D-S]

I'm a bit surprised that no action was taken by EG/County Union. CONGU do not seem to have published their view since their manual was superseded by WHS, but it was pretty clear in their last issue:

Dec.8(a) Status of ‘Handicap Only’ or ‘Competition Handicap’ (or the like) categories of golf club membership in the context of a CONGU® Definition of a Member.

It is a matter for individual golf clubs to determine the nature of their categories of membership. However, forms or categories of membership such as ‘Handicap Only’ or ‘Competition Membership’ satisfy neither the spirit nor intent of the definition of a ‘Member’ as contained in the CONGU UHS and do not qualify for the allotment of a CONGU ® Handicap.

From one of the Clubs‘ websites
”
Club Membership: This allows you to (i) Retain a Golf Handicap in accordance with CONGU the national affiliated body, (ii) Enter Club competitions and play in teams for fixtures against other Clubs, and (iii) Receive a free County Card which offers discounts for golf throughout England. However, you will still need to pay a daily green fee rate unless you sign up for Course Membership.
ClubMembership Fees are as follows:
Mens Fee: £ 35.50
Ladies Fee: £ 33.50”

Would seem a far better prospect than what is being proposed by EG for the nomadic golfer if you want a handicap. It has the added benefit for the County Union of them getting their full affiliation fee from the member.

 

[howbow88]

At the moment they don't until EG update there app . The trust issue is no different than what club members are expected to be.

Thanks for clarifying regarding the app I can't agree with you regarding 'trust' though... A member of a club needs a signed scorecard, or perhaps now with covid, a 'witnessed' round of golf for it to qualify, right? So if you wanted to put in bogus scores, you would at least need an accomplice who is a member at your club. If you're a nomad, surely you can put in whatever score you want on the app and don't need anyone else there to sign/witness it.

The point I'm getting at is that if your committee found that you and your mate were putting in bogus scores, you could find yourself in a bit of trouble. For a nomad, I don't see how anyone could realistically check if they were putting in dodgy scores?

These are honest question by the way. I'm not trying to nitpick, but more interested in how this will all work.

 

[Smiffy]

Thanks for clarifying regarding the app I can't agree with you regarding 'trust' though... A member of a club needs a signed scorecard, or perhaps now with covid, a 'witnessed' round of golf for it to qualify, right? So if you wanted to put in bogus scores, you would at least need an accomplice who is a member at your club. If you're a nomad, surely you can put in whatever score you want on the app and don't need anyone else there to sign/witness it.

The point I'm getting at is that if your committee found that you and your mate were putting in bogus scores, you could find yourself in a bit of trouble. For a nomad, I don't see how anyone could realistically check if they were putting in dodgy scores?

These are honest question by the way. I'm not trying to nitpick, but more interested in how this will all work.

I'm wondering the same thing. Sure, there are a few dishonest club members, (I've played with a few in the past, so know they exist), but I personally think it's a lot harder to "manipulate" the current system than it would be for a few "lads" who aren't members anywhere and are just interested in pot hunting to pull a few fast ones.

 

[SammmeBee]

I'm a bit surprised that no action was taken by EG/County Union. CONGU do not seem to have published their view since their manual was superseded by WHS, but it was pretty clear in their last issue:

Dec.8(a) Status of ‘Handicap Only’ or ‘Competition Handicap’ (or the like) categories of golf club membership in the context of a CONGU® Definition of a Member.

It is a matter for individual golf clubs to determine the nature of their categories of membership. However, forms or categories of membership such as ‘Handicap Only’ or ‘Competition Membership’ satisfy neither the spirit nor intent of the definition of a ‘Member’ as contained in the CONGU UHS and do not qualify for the allotment of a CONGU ® Handicap.

Why should EG tell clubs what their club membership fees should be?

 

[Bdill93]

I'm wondering the same thing. Sure, there are a few dishonest club members, (I've played with a few in the past, so know they exist), but I personally think it's a lot harder to "manipulate" the current system than it would be for a few "lads" who aren't members anywhere and are just interested in pot hunting to pull a few fast ones.

I think "pot hunting" is easily solved - limit the maximum handicap index allowed from Nomads in open comps.

Societies I think have the largest benefit from having official handicaps. I often read on here various handicap systems that are used based around peoples ancient handicaps moving and some blokes spreadsheet. I'd deem it neccessary for players to get this handicap to play. But you could see some serious bandits there too if theres no authentication of the card required.

 

[KenL]

That's no different to the previous system then.

It is quite different to when someone else marked your card and then you both signed it at the end.

 

[KenL]

Where? The MyEG app is super basic, or at least my Android one is. Is entering scores coming at some point in an update?

You can enter a "general play score" on any course from any rated tees on the Scottish Golf app. You need to be close to the course to pick it up.
We also have the Intelligent Golf one but haven't used that to enter scores since the SG one came on line.

 

[IanM]

Regardless of whether these handicaps are more or less rigidly managed than club handicaps (which vary from club to club) one truth remains at any Open Event.

........the better the prize table, the better the winning score will be!

 

[KenL]

It's exactly the same according to what you previously wrote, ie the player and the playing partner sign to verify the card.

Did I say two signatures required? Sorry not what I meant. A verbal verification is what we are doing.
The SG app asks for 2 signatures but nobody is offering their phone to someone else to handle and use their phone at the moment.

 

[Old Skier]

Thanks for clarifying regarding the app I can't agree with you regarding 'trust' though... A member of a club needs a signed scorecard, or perhaps now with covid, a 'witnessed' round of golf for it to qualify, right? So if you wanted to put in bogus scores, you would at least need an accomplice who is a member at your club. If you're a nomad, surely you can put in whatever score you want on the app and don't need anyone else there to sign/witness it.

The point I'm getting at is that if your committee found that you and your mate were putting in bogus scores, you could find yourself in a bit of trouble. For a nomad, I don't see how anyone could realistically check if they were putting in dodgy scores?

These are honest question by the way. I'm not trying to nitpick, but more interested in how this will all work.

The app will require confirmation sig - not yet decided if it is a member of the playing club or the pro shop and they will have to enter a CDH number of that person verifying score.

 

[Old Skier]

I have little confidence they can handle this professionally based on my experience, I had an EG account before WHS switch 2nd week of November I could not log to date that can not solve the issue, very busy I'm told, doing what I ask there's no golf, the problem is Dot.Golf in NZ and there is a time difference, and so it goes on. Shambolic

Check with club that DOB & correct email address was uploaded to EG

 

[Old Skier]

Why should EG tell clubs what their club membership fees should be?

Not sure how a membership fee can cover the affiliation fee, no mention of it.

 

[sunshine]

The app will require confirmation sig - not yet decided if it is a member of the playing club or the pro shop and they will have to enter a CDH number of that person verifying score.

I am guessing that the app will allow anyone with an account (and CDH) to verify the score that has been entered. This will allow 2 visitors who are registered with EG to play a course, record each others scores and confirm them, without adding extra admin burden to the pro shop / host club.