Alternative to handicaps

[Golf is fun]

You make it sound like a bad thing if someone doesn't want to improve at golf, but it's not really is it? If they just enjoying playing and that's it. Not sure what that has to do with handicaps.

I did not intend for it to be that way at all, in fact the opposite, it's ok to not care about improving at golf at all. People should do what they find fun. However very few people will admit they don't care about improvement because of social norms.

My real intent was to make the point that what people say they want may not align with what they actually want and what their behaviours demonstrate.

 

[Orikoru]

I did not intend for it to be that way at all, in fact the opposite, it's ok to not care about improving at golf at all. People should do what they find fun. However very few people will admit they don't care about improvement because of social norms.

My real intent was to make the point that what people say they want may not align with what they actually want and what their behaviours demonstrate.

Yeah, I just don't know what it has to do with handicaps. Are you saying those people shouldn't be allowed one?

 

[Golf is fun]

Yeah, I just don't know what it has to do with handicaps. Are you saying those people shouldn't be allowed one?

I didn't say that at all.

Some people pointed out that handicaps remove the incentive to improve. Others replied that even with handicaps everyone (or most people) they know what to improve. I simply pointed out that what people say they want may not reflect their true motivations. Nothing more and nothing less.

 

[The Squirrel]

I very much doubt you hit it 250+ with an erratic swing. Unless it's at a links course in summer with a 20mph wind

Why? According to the launch monitor if I really go for it I can reach 108 club head speed. Of course much of what comes out at that point is filth that goes nowhere near that distance nor in a straight line . On the course I suspect my controlled swing is a bit sub 100 in a (failed) attempt at control but give me 3 mulligans on the last and I’m going into berserker mode!

 

[sunshine]

How would you decide who plays in each division?

Based on handicap

 

[sunshine]

I've often wondered what it would be like if, instead of your handicap being say, 12 shots off your round, it was to give you 12 Mulligans instead. Would bring a strategic element as you have to choose when to use them, and also would probably favour the higher handicappers less, because a Mulligan could be used but then wasted with a second attempt that was no better than the first.

I’ve played this before. Really enjoyed it, my driving was excellent because I knew I had a mulligan if I messed up. Bit like a second serve in tennis, it really reduced the pressure. Same for those nervy 3 footers.

I finished level par gross, so you could say the handicap worked perfectly.

 

[Backache]

Logically for the Mulligan's to work as well as the handicap with the same strokes, you have to average one stroke gained per mulligan.
Unless you are losing or OB ing a large number of shots I think it unlikely that most can make up one shot per mulligan.

 

[TheDiablo]

Logically for the Mulligan's to work as well as the handicap with the same strokes, you have to average one stroke gained per mulligan.
Unless you are losing or OB ing a large number of shots I think it unlikely that most can make up one shot per mulligan.

Not necessarily. You would just need to make up a full shot incrementally over the course of the hole.

 

[garyinderry]

Sounds like a good practice game if you get a quiet course to yourself.

Not really practical with a full field.

 

[sunshine]

Logically for the Mulligan's to work as well as the handicap with the same strokes, you have to average one stroke gained per mulligan.
Unless you are losing or OB ing a large number of shots I think it unlikely that most can make up one shot per mulligan.

Drive into trees or heavy rough, no chance of making green in regulation, maybe even a penalty. Mulligan on the fairway saves a shot.
Approach misses the green, eg pulled into a bunker, likely outcome is bogey. Mulligan finds the green, likely outcome is par.
Approach putt comes up 4 feet short, or races 6 feet past. Mulligan you will learn from it and likely leave it within a couple of feet.
Miss a short putt, second attempt you will hole it.

All these examples the mulligan makes up a shot. Granted it assumes you execute the shot at the second attempt.

I guess this game works for someone like me who can play good shots and bad shots.

Probably less helpful for a consistent player who nurdles it around and isn’t reaching greens in regulation with or without mulligans. In that case the mulligans come in to play to get up and down.

 

[Backache]

Drive into trees or heavy rough, no chance of making green in regulation, maybe even a penalty. Mulligan on the fairway saves a shot.
Approach misses the green, eg pulled into a bunker, likely outcome is bogey. Mulligan finds the green, likely outcome is par.
Approach putt comes up 4 feet short, or races 6 feet past. Mulligan you will learn from it and likely leave it within a couple of feet.
Miss a short putt, second attempt you will hole it.

All these examples the mulligan makes up a shot. Granted it assumes you execute the shot at the second attempt.

I guess this game works for someone like me who can play good shots and bad shots.

Probably less helpful for a consistent player who nurdles it around and isn’t reaching greens in regulation with or without mulligans. In that case the mulligans come in to play to get up and down.

All of your examples appear to make what I believe are unfounded assumptions.
If I drive into the rough where I can't hit the green it does not mean that I can't recover onto the fairway beyond where I hit my average drive or if In a particularly poor position to where I hit my average drive.
One of which on average loses me strokes compared with having a stroke the other gains me nothing.

If I'm in a green side bunker the average position from which I have arrived there may be 130-140 yds.
On average I will get closer to the pin from a green side bunker than from a 135 yd shot.

If I miss a 3-4 foot putt and I hole the mulligan I gain nothing compared with having a stroke but there is no guarantee I will hole it I miss plenty when I check my read and then miss again.

If your long putt first putt goes to six feet and your mulligan to three there is no guarantee that you will either miss your six footer or hole your three footer you would be better off with the guaranteed stroke.

How many times when you hit a provisional do you find your original in not to bad a position?

Virtually the only time you can be guaranteed a mulligan is better or no worse is when you know for certain that it is out of bounds or lost.

 

[sunshine]

I think what you’re trying to say is that a mulligan is no guarantee of success? So not as good as a extra stroke?

I agree it’s no guarantee, you have to execute.

But upside is if you execute you can sometimes save 2 shots. E.g. stiff your approach and make birdie vs. missed green and bogey.

 

[Backache]

I think what you’re trying to say is that a mulligan is no guarantee of success? So not as good as a extra stroke?

I agree it’s no guarantee, you have to execute.

But upside is if you execute you can sometimes save 2 shots. E.g. stiff your approach and make birdie vs. missed green and bogey.

Well lets look at it this way, if two 18 handicappers are playing together in a two man scramble, they get a handicap of nine.
The advantage a scramble gives you is far greater than 18 mulligans, you can play every shot twice not just 18 shots and you can decide which is the superior shot after both shots are played rather than being forced to take the second shot should you play one,yet the putative advantage is only nine shots,now people do tend to score better in this format than their handicap ,but not to such an extent that they are regularly nine shots better with a greater advantage.

 

[Golf is fun]

Well lets look at it this way, if two 18 handicappers are playing together in a two man scramble, they get a handicap of nine.
The advantage a scramble gives you is far greater than 18 mulligans, you can play every shot twice not just 18 shots and you can decide which is the superior shot after both shots are played rather than being forced to take the second shot should you play one,yet the putative advantage is only nine shots,now people do tend to score better in this format than their handicap ,but not to such an extent that they are regularly nine shots better with a greater advantage.

Is there a significant difference in that each person only plays the shot once?
That is if I hit two shots in a row I'd expect my second shot to be somewhat better because I have learned from the first experience, yes your partner could learn from watching you, but this is not as effective as actually feeling what went right/wrong.

 

[Backache]

Is there a significant difference in that each person only plays the shot once?
That is if I hit two shots in a row I'd expect my second shot to be somewhat better because I have learned from the first experience, yes your partner could learn from watching you, but this is not as effective as actually feeling what went right/wrong.

There may be a small difference but I doubt it is major .Just as likely is that the advantage could be the other way round in that two different players have different strengths so you always have a potentially strong shot.

 

[sunshine]

Well lets look at it this way, if two 18 handicappers are playing together in a two man scramble, they get a handicap of nine.
The advantage a scramble gives you is far greater than 18 mulligans, you can play every shot twice not just 18 shots and you can decide which is the superior shot after both shots are played rather than being forced to take the second shot should you play one,yet the putative advantage is only nine shots,now people do tend to score better in this format than their handicap ,but not to such an extent that they are regularly nine shots better with a greater advantage.

But each person only plays a shot once. It’s really only a help when putting.

When I get to replay a shot it makes a massive difference to me. For example a provisional shot nearly always goes straight down the middle of the fairway