Jason.H
Well-known member
The G1Z1 thread is much better ?
LIV Golf
- Thread starter MarkT
- Start date
Depreston
Club Champion
he's a helmet
woofers
Medal Winner
The same, the money is right for them so they go. I wouldn‘t do so. They go because the tour chiefs have organised the tour in the middle east and for some it’s the only earnings they can get. Shame on the tour chiefs, they never get criticised. Judging by your post count you’re relatively new on here, so you won’t have seen my posts calling out Justin Rose for talking crap when he said it was an opportunity for them to experience and see for themselves the issues, or my posts applauding Paul Casey’s stance as UNICEF ambassador and doing the right thing, and then my disappointment at him for changing his mind and taking the saudi dollar.
So, not sweeping it under the carpet. OK?
rksquire
Head Pro
They (the players) are there for the money. They are greedy and selfish. This was as true years ago when they (European contingent) all relocated to Florida etc. and structured their year around the PGA Tour calendar. The fact they've jumped at the prospect of more cash should not be a surprise. But I'm still interested.
The Saudi regime and their continued atrocities / views should be roundly condemned. I have a hard time believing Golfers need to be sole instigators of this, or indeed receive the type of unbalanced media coverage they are getting when the likes of Eddie Howe (I'm just here to manage a football club, I couldn't answer to anything else), Kane, Southgate, Joshua, Fury, Hamilton etc. get an easier time. Shouldn't Sky and the BBC stop reporting on Newcastle's matches? Shouldn't those, as football supporters and golf fans, boycott Newcastle matches when their team is playing them, just as they're planning not to watch LIV?
I've no interest really in getting into a political row or any row with @Ethan , that's not really why I come on to the forum, and his comments contribute more more greatly to the forum than mine. But I can't agree that the pressers have been 'balanced' - I believe hard questions had to be asked, but just like Eddie Howe, these guys aren't politicians. They are independent contractors following the money. They're not politicians. They're greedy. Seen Justin Thomas's interview yesterday, he was asked about LIV but I remember back to his homophobic slur and how quickly the media moved past this.
The Saudi regime and their continued atrocities / views should be roundly condemned. I have a hard time believing Golfers need to be sole instigators of this, or indeed receive the type of unbalanced media coverage they are getting when the likes of Eddie Howe (I'm just here to manage a football club, I couldn't answer to anything else), Kane, Southgate, Joshua, Fury, Hamilton etc. get an easier time. Shouldn't Sky and the BBC stop reporting on Newcastle's matches? Shouldn't those, as football supporters and golf fans, boycott Newcastle matches when their team is playing them, just as they're planning not to watch LIV?
I've no interest really in getting into a political row or any row with @Ethan , that's not really why I come on to the forum, and his comments contribute more more greatly to the forum than mine. But I can't agree that the pressers have been 'balanced' - I believe hard questions had to be asked, but just like Eddie Howe, these guys aren't politicians. They are independent contractors following the money. They're not politicians. They're greedy. Seen Justin Thomas's interview yesterday, he was asked about LIV but I remember back to his homophobic slur and how quickly the media moved past this.
Swango1980
Well-known member
Dear me. Of course the players looked uncomfortable answering questions. They are golfers, not politicians. And, even politicians would be uncomfortable answering questions that are designed to make them feel....uncomfortable. This is the media age we live in.
Regardless of what answer they give, there will be people like you who will twist anything they say into your own agenda. They will criticise appalling human rights records, and then people like you will say they ignore human rights issues. Even better if they make a slip of the tongue, like the Greg Norman's mistake comment, and people in the media can have a field day. I didn't even watch that particular interview, but I am told he wasn't literally asked "what did you think of the murder of a journalist", and he directly answered "everyone makes mistakes". It was clear the point he was really trying to make is that we can all improve our ways going forward, whether as individuals or societies, and he was just clumsy in the way he did it. However, people like you no longer care about context. Just stick a few words or statements together, and suddenly you can rip someone's character to pieces without ever knowing them.
But hey, you have the moral high ground so I guess you can judge people as you please without any counter argument allowed.
Anyway, we can moan all day about the human rights record (which we all agree is terrible), but it makes no difference to the main debate. I'm more interested in the implications to how it impacts the game of golf. Is it here to stay? Will more top golfers join? Will the PGA play hard ball, or will they have to concede some ground? After all, as it stands, if they ban the likes of DJ, Bryson, Reed, Fowler along with the other big names, they seriously weaken their brand. When DJ joined, that seemed to be a huge turning point. Even then, some tried to dismiss it as he may well be a has been at the age of 37 and the fact he has had a quiet few months. That was probably clutching at straws. Now Bryson is getting involved, at 28 years old, that really stirs the pot. Like him or loath him, he has clearly been one of the biggest characters on tour in the last year or so. I wonder how much LIV offered him? Reportedly over $100 million. I think he has been robbed, relative to Phil Mickleson anyway who got $200 million. I'd have though Bryson would be a much bigger character to have on LIV based on the stage he is at with his career.
Slab
Occasional Tour Caddy
Given their opposition stance I've been pondering the question... Does the PGA Tour exist for the players or do the players exist for the PGA Tour?
(It doesn’t sound like it’s a partnership as I understand the term)
(It doesn’t sound like it’s a partnership as I understand the term)
PJ87
Journeyman Pro
the PGA only cares about its brand , it doesnt give a rats about the players only that they are the best they can get on board
they want to be the top tour and a monopoly. They dont want to share talent
im glad the LIV is causing them a headache. maybe they will take note and change a bit
Swango1980
Well-known member
No. However, people can exercise their right to not watch them. And, if enough people do so, I'm sure Sky and the BBC will act upon it to satisfy their viewers. However, if only a handful of people refuse to watch Newcastle games, BBC and Sky will go about their normal business. The world will still go round. Meanwhile, as the Saudi regime is on our doorstep, it will highlight even more the atrocities they commit. Whatever impact that will have on their regime in the long term, who knows? However, I can't believe a Saudi Arabian baby is born evil. They are brainwashed to be that way based on their culture (which of course, they do not see as being evil). However, the more they are exposed to western culture, and their criticism, the more likely it is that young Saudi Arabians will grow up wanting to have a better global image. This doesn't happen overnight. However, it is my belief that it is better this way around, rather than just shutting them off, giving them little to no exposure to our culture, and just letting them to continue doing what they do.
Regarding Justin Thomas, he apologised for what he said. I can see how he did it. As I grew up as a kid, all sorts of phrases were used to express sudden emotions. Often words like "gay" were thrown around without any thought as to what you were really saying. I assume Thomas did a similar thing, where he instinctively said the word without thinking. I doubt it is because he is homophobic, but I don't know him personally so I can't say that for sure, but I'd say I have enough reasonable doubt to say his expression doesn't provide enough proof that he is. He apologised, move on. What else do we expect? Should the media slate him for at least a year, 2 years, the rest of his career? Should he be sacked and not allowed to play professional golf anymore? Should we send him to prison, maybe even behead him? I'm not generally a big fan of his (just in golfing terms, not really my opinion of his character), but I'm not the type that likes to sharpen my knife any time someone has a slip of the tongue and then apologises for the impression. He also suffered consequences, after all he lost sponsors such as Ralph Lauren and Woodford Reserve. May well have closed the door on future sponsors as well. So, I wouldn't get too worried on the media moving past this. There are always new stories for the media to cover (e.g. LIV tour), so you shouldn't expect them to continue talking about what Thomas said in January 2021.
Crow
Crow Person
I was one of those 110K and I have to say that, from an entertainment perspective, I found the video as dull as ditch water.
PJ87
Journeyman Pro
would you like to see them play with hickory clubs for one of the rounds?
D
Deleted member 1147
Guest
So they don't pay players when they're injured (for years on end in some cases), and don't have a healthy pension plan in place for them when they retire?
woofers
Medal Winner
So, moving on from the moral rights and wrongs as we have all pretty much said our piece and hopefully can agree to disagree on various stances as there is little to be gained from going round and round over the same ground.
The next questions are: if the big name latecomers who didn’t want the bother of flying over the Atlantic, now join the tour, who gives way? Is there a finite number who can sign up ? If there are only 48 players per event, are the tour numbers restricted to 48, or 60 for example ? And who decides from the 60, or ‘pool’, if they’re all ‘available’ who can play? Is there a waiting list to join the tour ? Could it be liking joining a golf club and finding you can’t get a game? Or does Greg say to the low ranking and amateurs who have bailed him out at Centurion “thanks guys, here’s your money, see you some time when you’re a bigger draw”?
The next questions are: if the big name latecomers who didn’t want the bother of flying over the Atlantic, now join the tour, who gives way? Is there a finite number who can sign up ? If there are only 48 players per event, are the tour numbers restricted to 48, or 60 for example ? And who decides from the 60, or ‘pool’, if they’re all ‘available’ who can play? Is there a waiting list to join the tour ? Could it be liking joining a golf club and finding you can’t get a game? Or does Greg say to the low ranking and amateurs who have bailed him out at Centurion “thanks guys, here’s your money, see you some time when you’re a bigger draw”?
Bdill93
Undisputed King of FOMO
Theres space for 8 more entrants before people start being cut. Only 16 holes of the 18 are in play at any one time this weekend.
Crow
Crow Person
Not particularly, I'd just like to have seen something a little more interesting to watch.
This was like skulking in the background with a video camera.
D
Deleted member 1147
Guest
That's just what the kids like...it's new, innovative and dangerous
PJ87
Journeyman Pro
so they should be praised for taking some of their prize money and putting it into a pension?
players have to play 15 events and make the cut .. or finish 150th in the world .. they get deffered income as a pension
woofers
Medal Winner
No, LIV have specifically stated that it’s 48 players, 12 teams at each event.
PJ87
Journeyman Pro
I think it will be a case of a pool of players ready with the best 48 selected each time
DJ might get injured or busy one week and someone gets drafted in
better tho have 60 players than bang on 48
woofers
Medal Winner
Brings an interesting dimension into the employees vs independent contractors discussion……
woofers
Medal Winner
So, you can sign up to this tour and not get a game then?
Mel, what’s the answer?
