LIV Golf

[Beezerk]

A cording the Big Draw in post 9631 YouTube is finished......
Hence my question about numbers earlier....2.6 billion (YouTube) vs 200 million (The CW).....

Right I didn’t see that, an odd move if that’s the case. How are people supposed to watch it in other countries without a hooky firestick?

 

[Bdill93]

What would be the maximum you'd be prepared to pay to watch a full days worth of golf?

A full day PGA event or a half day at LIV?

£40-80 maybe?

A ticket to Villa if you just go to the odd game is £45+ for some games now so id expect it to be higher than that

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Maybe this time some folk will even pay to get in?

I’m doubtful on that - every event was tickets being given away

However even you must agree, it is a small step in the right direction for them.
Doesn’t matter what channel it is, they have airtime now to bolster the YouTube channel. You and I both may not like it but it looks like it’s here to stay, for a few years at least.

Is it a step in the right direction ?

It’s no longer available in the US on You Tube

So they have reduced the potential viewing in the US to a Channel a long way down the viewing list

If they had got a deal with one of the major networks and a sports network plus overseas rights to media outlets ( as all other sports do ) then it’s a step forward

Something is stopping media outlets jumping at this

Is it the players they have not being that popular ?

Is it the way it’s started up ?

Is it the funding ?

The court cases ?

The CEO ?

No other sport has these issues

 

[Bdill93]

A cording the Big Draw in post 9631 YouTube is finished......
Hence my question about numbers earlier....2.6 billion (YouTube) vs 200 million (The CW).....

There may be 2.6 billion YT users but the biggest golf channel in the world only has 2.44 million subscribers..

 

[Mel Smooth]

A cording the Big Draw in post 9631 YouTube is finished......
Hence my question about numbers earlier....2.6 billion (YouTube) vs 200 million (The CW).....

That will be in the US. There’s been no mention of the rest of the world, but they clearly aren’t going to not show it anywhere else. They haven’t said it will be on You Tube, because I expect there is a process now in place to try and establish tv deals in other areas - until that’s concluded they won’t commit to it being available by stream.
The You Tube steam can be geo blocked in the USA.

 

[Mel Smooth]

Is it a step in the right direction ?

It’s no longer available in the US on You Tube

So they have reduced the potential viewing in the US to a Channel a long way down the viewing list

If they had got a deal with one of the major networks and a sports network plus overseas rights to media outlets ( as all other sports do ) then it’s a step forward

Something is stopping media outlets jumping at this

Is it the players they have not being that popular ?

Is it the way it’s started up ?

Is it the funding ?

The court cases ?

The CEO ?

No other sport has these issues

I read this morning that several high ranking DP world officials aren’t very confident about the court case.
Either way, it will have a very significant impact on the progression of LIV.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

I read this morning that several high ranking DP world officials aren’t very confident about the court case.
Either way, it will have a very significant impact on the progression of LIV.

I don’t expect a court is allowed to force golf tours to allow any player to play on their tour - it’s not a “right” as such and is membership and why wouldn’t the Tours be able to remove players membership ?‍

But it’s that level of toxicity that’s going to stop media partnerships

and LIV partnering with CW hasn’t please everyone in the US

https://twitter.com/x/status/1616362560231702528

 

[Mel Smooth]

I don’t expect a court is allowed to force golf tours to allow any player to play on their tour - it’s not a “right” as such and is membership and why wouldn’t the Tours be able to remove players membership ?‍

But it’s that level of toxicity that’s going to stop media partnerships

and LIV partnering with CW hasn’t please everyone in the US

https://twitter.com/x/status/1616362560231702528

In what way does it benefit the DPWT to prevent players from participating in their events?

There’s one happening right now, with several LIV players taking part, and in no way is it negatively impacting the event, infact, if anything, it draws more interest.

 

[Deleted member 21445]

CW is available on the US Version of freeview , anyone that doesn’t pay for cable gets the non subscription channels

CW is like Dave these days , it’s full of repeats from teen programs and reality programs from the 00’s , it’s been close a few times to stopping but gets by with ad revenue

Golf Digest quote below gives a little more context beyond just the channel itself.

Golf Digest Quote below
"Get your Gossip Girl jokes out of the way now, because crazy as the CW might sound as a broadcast partner, there’s more to it than meets the eye. The network is under new owners in 2023, having undergone a late-summer acquisition by Nexstar, a broadcast and local news station behemoth. The goal, per Nexstar chairman Perry Sook, was to diversify the company’s broadcast offerings, bolstering the success of their NewsNation cable channel with a broadcast TV network focused on entertainment.
In the CW, Nexstar found a network that had been used primarily as a proving ground for its former legacy owners, Paramount and WarnerMedia.
When Nexstar purchased the CW from Paramount and WarnerMedia, they allowed both media companies to retain a 12.5 percent ownership stake in the network, meaning that both Paramount and WarnerMedia now are partially invested in LIV Golf’s broadcast success.
Ironically, both Paramount (CBS) and WarnerMedia (Discovery) are broadcast partners of the PGA Tour with billions in outstanding rights fees owed to the Tour. It’s early to say, but that might make for an awkward encounter on the next Zoom call.
LIV will continue to be responsible for the production of its events. None of the major players from LIV’s first season — from producer Steve Beim to broadcasters Arlo White, David Feherty and Jerry Foltz — will be going anywhere.
After a year of negotiating, it’s difficult to argue that CW was LIV’s first choice in the lucrative world of TV streaming (networks will pay some $16 billion to the five major sports and golf for broadcast rights in 2023), but that might not matter much. In CW, LIV found a nationally televised broadcast network with the ability to reach some 120 million viewers and thats what it needed"

 

[Deleted member 15344]

In what way does it benefit the DPWT to prevent players from participating in their events?

There’s one happening right now, with several LIV players taking part, and in no way is it negatively impacting the event, infact, if anything, it draws more interest.

Is it always about “benefit” ? What is their reason for wanting to play on the ET ?

The players decided that they wanted to play on a closed tour because they were offered a big amount of money , they knew the consequences, they knew that they would need to ask for releases from their home tour to play in the event - so they made their choice and they all gave their reasons

As things progressed they realised whilst the money was good they also closed themselves off to other golf avenues- ranking points , access to majors and Ryder Cup qualification

All of sudden they start to panic and put in a court case to allow them to play ( obviously some decided to just quit ) - it’s a simple case of them wanting every slice of the cake

The ET doesn’t benefit from them being there anymore - if anything it’s giving them negative press when they play , it takes it away from the event that’s happening, ET would prefer to ignore them and move on to the future. Just look at the pathetic crying over not being wished Happy Birthday or not being part of some Ryder Cup footage

I used to really like Westwood , Poulter and Garcia - used to stick up for them on here etc but they have just shown themselves to be arrogant babies and the Tour is better off without them

 

[Mel Smooth]

Is it always about “benefit” ? What is their reason for wanting to play on the ET ?

The players decided that they wanted to play on a closed tour because they were offered a big amount of money , they knew the consequences, they knew that they would need to ask for releases from their home tour to play in the event - so they made their choice and they all gave their reasons

As things progressed they realised whilst the money was good they also closed themselves off to other golf avenues- ranking points , access to majors and Ryder Cup qualification

All of sudden they start to panic and put in a court case to allow them to play ( obviously some decided to just quit ) - it’s a simple case of them wanting every slice of the cake

The ET doesn’t benefit from them being there anymore - if anything it’s giving them negative press when they play , it takes it away from the event that’s happening, ET would prefer to ignore them and move on to the future. Just look at the pathetic crying over not being wished Happy Birthday or not being part of some Ryder Cup footage

I used to really like Westwood , Poulter and Garcia - used to stick up for them on here etc but they have just shown themselves to be arrogant babies and the Tour is better off without them

To be honest Phil, that whole post - particularly the last paragraph demonstrates your personal bitterness towards the players that have gone to LIV, and LIV itself. The babies are those that can’t accept golf has changed, and that the tours are not what they once were.

There hasn’t been any negative press this week other than Donald saying it could be uncomfortable for Stenson, who quite rightly responded by saying it wouldn’t be. The press themselves continue to portray everything they can with as much negativity as positive, in all walks of life, not just golf.
If you want to believe what the tabloids tell you, please do. The voices within the game are towing a different line, and acceptance of LIV is fundamentally well underway - as it should be.
The majors will become more interesting and more dominant within the calendar, and hopefully the Ryder Cup follow the same path of wanting the best players possible representing their country or continents. That’s the long term future that will make golf better, and give it broader appeal.
There are opportunities for both the DPWT and the PGAT to regain their positions, but you only have to look at the women’s game to see how the influence of Saudi money is growing their tours into a truly global game.
The days of American dominance and control within professional golf are over.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

To be honest Phil, that whole post - particularly the last paragraph demonstrates your personal bitterness towards the players that have gone to LIV, and LIV itself. The babies are those that can’t accept golf has changed, and that the tours are not what they once were.

Every single time you post in response you try and attempt to make it about the poster - you are the spitting image of the LIV accounts on Twitter

My “bitterness” is complete nonsense -they made their choice ,they should just crack on and play on their new tour and I suspect most wouldn’t care if they just left and carried on just playing on the LIV - what people do get annoyed about it is when they then start to publicly complain about everything when they haven’t got the self awareness to realise they put themselves in this position - they weren’t forced to go to a tour with no ranking points, no access to other tours , no access to Ryder Cup - they knew the consequences and still went ahead.

What’s this “golf has changed” ?‍

It’s still putting a white ball in a hole for 18 holes ?‍ playing less rounds isn’t some game changer.

There hasn’t been any negative press this week other than Donald saying it could be uncomfortable for Stenson, who quite rightly responded by saying it wouldn’t be. The press themselves continue to portray everything they can with as much negativity as positive, in all walks of life, not just golf.
If you want to believe what the tabloids tell you, please do. The voices within the game are towing a different line, and acceptance of LIV is fundamentally well underway - as it should be.
The majors will become more interesting and more dominant within the calendar, and hopefully the Ryder Cup follow the same path of wanting the best players possible representing their country or continents. That’s the long term future that will make golf better, and give it broader appeal.
There are opportunities for both the DPWT and the PGAT to regain their positions, but you only have to look at the women’s game to see how the influence of Saudi money is growing their tours into a truly global game.
The days of American dominance and control within professional golf are over.

Do you really believe all that ?
“Acceptance of LIV is well underway”

No idea what “tabloids” you think I’m reading but I’m making my own mind up based on what’s happening - maybe you need to stop reading all those LIV accounts on Twitter

The majors are not changing anything to suit LIV

The Ryder Cup won’t allow members of a third tour to play in it

The US Tour is still far and away the dominant tour within the sport and LIV won’t change that.

what’s changed from this time last year ? A handful of golfers got richer and there was 8 different quicker events.

There wasn’t a dramatic shift in viewers to the LIV both at the events and viewing

There is a reason why LIV is not putting any events up against any of the major Tour events

And the underlying issue for LIV will always be that it is unsustainable- it’s solely relying on funding from the state of Saudi - without it the whole thing collapses -and please don’t say because it’s in its infancy because we have already seen how some events can be sustained from the start without the need to be funded

 

[Mel Smooth]

Every single time you post in response you try and attempt to make it about the poster - you are the spitting image of the LIV accounts on Twitter

My “bitterness” is complete nonsense -they made their choice ,they should just crack on and play on their new tour and I suspect most wouldn’t care if they just left and carried on just playing on the LIV - what people do get annoyed about it is when they then start to publicly complain about everything when they haven’t got the self awareness to realise they put themselves in this position - they weren’t forced to go to a tour with no ranking points, no access to other tours , no access to Ryder Cup - they knew the consequences and still went ahead.

What’s this “golf has changed” ?‍

It’s still putting a white ball in a hole for 18 holes ?‍ playing less rounds isn’t some game changer.



Do you really believe all that ?
“Acceptance of LIV is well underway”

No idea what “tabloids” you think I’m reading but I’m making my own mind up based on what’s happening - maybe you need to stop reading all those LIV accounts on Twitter

The majors are not changing anything to suit LIV

The Ryder Cup won’t allow members of a third tour to play in it

The US Tour is still far and away the dominant tour within the sport and LIV won’t change that.

what’s changed from this time last year ? A handful of golfers got richer and there was 8 different quicker events.

There wasn’t a dramatic shift in viewers to the LIV both at the events and viewing

There is a reason why LIV is not putting any events up against any of the major Tour events

And the underlying issue for LIV will always be that it is unsustainable- it’s solely relying on funding from the state of Saudi - without it the whole thing collapses -and please don’t say because it’s in its infancy because we have already seen how some events can be sustained from the start without the need to be funded

You’ve quoted multiple twitter accounts in recent days on here, and you’ve got the ignorance to accuse me of peddling info I get from Twitter. Laughable.

I’m out mate, I’d stick a clown emoji on there but I can’t be arsed looking for one.

 

[BubbaP]

The CW is in 122 million homes and the App has been downloaded 90 million times..

YouTube has 2.6 billion monthly active users....

Is The CW really a step forward..?

Just so we are clear, you seem to be comparing:
The world
to
One country

Are you sure you aren't a US American in disguise ???

I will wait for things official before assuming what fan & can't be done. Only really watched via website before rather than YT

 

[IanM]

@Liverpoolphil you missed "shorts" dude, you missed the bit about "shorts! You could get put on the ignore list for such an error! Life changing!

 

[Imurg]

Just so we are clear, you seem to be comparing:
The world
to
One country

Are you sure you aren't a US American in disguise ???

I will wait for things official before assuming what fan & can't be done. Only really watched via website before rather than YT

It was based on the post that implied that coverage was stopping on YouTube.......it doesn't confirm whether that's US or Global..
Its a bit like most info about LIV...full of gossip, half-truths, doubts and rumours......and assumptions from both sides.
To be honest the whole thing is getting supremely tedious...

 

[Deleted member 1147]

The CW is in 122 million homes and the App has been downloaded 90 million times..

YouTube has 2.6 billion monthly active users....

Is The CW really a step forward..?

I thought LIV went to Youtube for it's coverage because that's what the kids are watching, and they no longer watch TV.
So were they wrong in that assumption, or wasn't that the reason?

 

[doublebogey7]

In what way does it benefit the DPWT to prevent players from participating in their events?

There’s one happening right now, with several LIV players taking part, and in no way is it negatively impacting the event, in fact, if anything, it draws more interest.

It really is not that difficult to work out. DPWT relies on sponsors for the bulk of it's income, sponsors will pay more when the best and most high profile players are playing in their events. Those contracted to LiV are required to play all 14 of their events, so will I be wishing to play in very limited number of DPWT events. Sponsors will then move in to pasters new. LiV of course does not currently have such financial constraints. Finally answer me this question, why would LiV not be improved if their tournaments were fully open events, subject to qualifying criteria, this allowing the top players to pick which events to play. I am not a bot?

 

[Mel Smooth]

It really is not that difficult to work out. DPWT relies on sponsors for the bulk of it's income, sponsors will pay more when the best and most high profile players are playing in their events. Those contracted to LiV are required to play all 14 of their events, so will I be wishing to play in very limited number of DPWT events. Sponsors will then move in to pasters new. LiV of course does not currently have such financial constraints. Finally answer me this question, why would LiV not be improved if their tournaments were fully open events, subject to qualifying criteria, this allowing the top players to pick which events to play. I am not a bot?

LIV events would benefit from being able to have better players in their fields, it’s the same argument I’m using to question why the DPWT and PGAT have intentionally weakened theirs so why would I argue against it?
Although their model isn’t to have full qualification (because they are trying to be different) I do think there should be more opportunities to qualify - maybe one place per team, per event?

 

[Swango1980]

LIV events would benefit from being able to have better players in their fields, it’s the same argument I’m using to question why the DPWT and PGAT have intentionally weakened theirs so why would I argue against it?
Although their model isn’t to have full qualification (because they are trying to be different) I do think there should be more opportunities to qualify - maybe one place per team, per event?

As you say, they can do what they like. If they are trying to be different, they could fundamentally adapt the rules of golf to allow them some whacky formats. If they aim to entertain, and it gets in loads of viewers, then I guess it is really up to them what they thinks will work.

But, whatever they decide to do, also in terms of qualification, will have a direct impact on how that fits in with being awarded world ranking points. That isn't really for any of us to decide within the golf monthly format. But, presumably the guidelines they have to meet needs to be pretty consistent with what happens in other professional tours. If LIV opens up qualification to 25% of the field, is that going to tick the qualification box for the people in charge of world rankings? I doubt it. I'm not sure of any other tour in which all their events are invite only to 75% of the golfers?

Also, let us say 1 person could qualify per event per team. What happens in the next event? Are 75% of the entire field safe, and the 25% of the field that qualified last time the ones that risk losing their place for the next event? Seems harsh if most of the 25% finished high up the individual leaderboard, only for many to lose their place whilst Westwood and Poulter keep their place, despite finishing rock bottom of the leaderboard.