LIV Golf

[Deleted member 21445]

Question

Presidents Cup has been heavily effected by the Liv v PGAT divide which is a shame.

Which international team do we think is stronger

ROTW TEAM.
Hideki Matsuyama
Sungjae Im
Tom Kim
Corey Conners
Adam Scott
K.H. Lee
Mito Pereira
Sebastian Munoz
Cameron Davis
Christiaan Bezuidenhout
SI Woo Kim
Taylor Pendrith


LIV ROTW TEAM

Smith
Niemann,
Ancer
Lahiri
Oosthuizen
Leishman
Schwartzel
Grace
Ortiz
Jones
Kaewkanjana
Khongwatmai

 

[Jacko_G]

You are confusing two very different things.

The better you are, the more chance you will put yourself in pressure situations, and therefore be better at performing under pressure. I.e. Michael Jordan was fantastic in high pressure situations of scoring when the team needed to. I am not denying that some people are less effected by pressure.

This is completely different to your argument that all pressure is the same. Monty had faced pressure all his career, Ryder Cup, numerous Tour wins all would have been pressure situations and yet he overcame them time after time. However the US Open was more pressure, not only do majors create more pressure but that fact that Monty had been close many time before and never won before made even more pressure for him. Ergo not all pressure is the same, this was MORE pressure than he normally faced.

Also see Tom Watson in the 2009 Open, if he was in that situation in a Seniors Major or a run of the mill tournament would he have chipped so badly to leave an 8 footer to win, and would he have missed that 8 foot putt. The fact is that the putt to win the Open creates a lot more pressure than other scenarios.

The fact is pressure is pressure and it effects people differently. That is the fact. What one person sees as pressure can be a bread and butter situation to someone else.

 

[Mel Smooth]

There is no attempt to get a bite - I would hope an expect a grown man to not use those sort of phrases - but I guess it seems your go to which helps you dismiss anyone relevant counter points


Can you see how blinkered you are towards LIV

In response to the caddy issue all I can see people question is the players - can’t see anyone “knock down LIV” over it but I can see people asking why the players haven’t done anything about it when they are the ones that employ the caddy ?

So can you answer why Koepka didn’t say anything about the treatment of caddies when he was playing on the PGAT ? If they were treated so badly why was nothing said by all the players ?

In fact any players autobiography I have read they don’t mention how poor their caddies are treated ? In fact some talk about how much of a laugh they have on your

Lol. No I can’t answer why Brooks didn’t say anything Phil, but I can tell you this, the caddies at LIV are better cared for on all fronts.

You wanting to blame that on the player is akin to me blaming bad building site conditions for my labourer on a big site I’m working on, on myself, rather than the man responsible for running the site.

It ain’t me that’s blinkered mate.

 

[Crow]

And this adds to the conversation how?

It adds as much as 90% or more of the rest of the posts.

And I don't think "conversation" applies to this thread.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Lol. No I can’t answer why Brooks didn’t say anything Phil, but I can tell you this, the caddies at LIV are better cared for on all fronts.

You wanting to blame that on the player is akin to me blaming bad building site conditions for my labourer on a big site I’m working on, on myself, rather than the man responsible for running the site.

It ain’t me that’s blinkered mate.

I’m not that interested in the caddies at the end of the day - I watch golf for the golfers and not the person the golfer has picked to carry their bag.

Let’s be honest you never cared about caddy welfare and are using what LIV are doing as a point scoring exercise towards the PGA - as opposed to be concerned about how the caddy is treated.

Players are in prime position to look after their caddy - they employ the caddy to work for them not the tour hence why if a player plays on a different tour the caddy goes with them.

It’s not about apportioning “blame” when there is no issue - there is only perceived issue being created by LIV as some sort of commercial exercise

Can you think of any caddy that has complained about their working conditions

It adds as much as 90% or more of the rest of the posts.

And I don't think "conversation" applies to this thread.

I can never understand why if someone has an issue with a thread or what’s being said in the thread why they continue to read it and post in it ?‍

If there is a thread I don’t like then I just don’t bother reading it ?‍

 

[BrianM]

It takes some doing, but I think this is a contender for the stupidest comment ever made on this thread. Or, if I put it more politely, most naïve

One thing I’m not, is stupid, not sure why you felt the need to personally insult me on a golf forum.
Sadly this says a lot more about you than me.
In future, I’d appreciate if you could stay away from the personal attacks.

 

[Crow]

I can never understand why if someone has an issue with a thread or what’s being said in the thread why they continue to read it and post in it ?‍

If there is a thread I don’t like then I just don’t bother reading it ?‍

I am mildly interested in LIV, but I don't want to read the same old over and over again, can you not understand that at least?

I drop into this thread now and again to see what's going on, but to make sure I've not missed anything interesting I'd need to read umpteen pages of schoolyard squabbles.
I don't have an interest in that, hence my frustration with the way so many threads here go.

 

[Mel Smooth]

I’m not that interested in the caddies at the end of the day - I watch golf for the golfers and not the person the golfer has picked to carry their bag.

Let’s be honest you never cared about caddy welfare and are using what LIV are doing as a point scoring exercise towards the PGA - as opposed to be concerned about how the caddy is treated.

Players are in prime position to look after their caddy - they employ the caddy to work for them not the tour hence why if a player plays on a different tour the caddy goes with them.

It’s not about apportioning “blame” when there is no issue - there is only perceived issue being created by LIV as some sort of commercial exercise

Can you think of any caddy that has complained about their working conditions

So LIV looking after caddies isn’t an issue because you don’t want it to highlight that the PGA tour, don’t do the same or ensure the players can and do?

Hilarious.


On your second point, I once bought some clubs off a guy who’s dad had caddied and they used to jump out of guesthouse / hotel windows to avoid paying the bill. Obviously conditions have improved since then, and guess what, they’ve just taken another step forwards in the last few months, thanks to you know what.

 

[Swango1980]

One thing I’m not, is stupid, not sure why you felt the need to personally insult me on a golf forum.
Sadly this says a lot more about you than me.
In future, I’d appreciate if you could stay away from the personal attacks.

I didn't call you stupid at all, so don't get offended. I said your comment was stupid. Some of the most intelligent people on the planet sometimes say silly things, so don't worry about it.

 

[Swango1980]

That's twice you've tried that pathetic line and twice you've failed to get a bite or a reaction. Try again dor a third or give up.

Ohh the irony, informing someone they have failed to get a bite or a reaction with their comment, by reacting directly to that comment

 

[Deleted member 1147]

To sum up this thread:

- the PGA tour is terrible and has always been. As such the players have had to leave to get paid enough.
- the PGA tour is great because the players are paid well and there is more competition on that tour
- Saudi is evil and therefore so is LIV
- The PGA tour plays in China and is sponsored by companies who trade in with evil regimes, and is therefore evil as well
- the caddies are looked after better on LIV and there is a nice plane
- LIV is just a pre-retirement tour
- LIV has a team aspect which is great
- LIV has a team element that is crap
- certain players are joining LIV
- oh no they aren't

ad nauseum

Anything else?

 

[Swango1980]

To sum up this thread:

- the PGA tour is terrible and has always been. As such the players have had to leave to get paid enough.
- the PGA tour is great because the players are paid well and there is more competition on that tour
- Saudi is evil and therefore so is LIV
- The PGA tour plays in China and is sponsored by companies who trade in with evil regimes, and is therefore evil as well
- the caddies are looked after better on LIV and there is a nice plane
- LIV is just a pre-retirement tour
- LIV has a team aspect which is great
- LIV has a team element that is crap
- certain players are joining LIV
- oh no they aren't

ad nauseum

Anything else?

Yes, some recent ones:

-pressure is pressure
-there are different levels of pressure

 

[Jacko_G]

Ohh the irony, informing someone they have failed to get a bite or a reaction with their comment, by reacting directly to that comment

Irony - indeed. Go and get yourself a wee ice cream as a treat.

 

[Swango1980]

Irony - indeed. Go and get yourself a wee ice cream as a treat.

Cheers. Send me your address and I'll post you the invoice.

 

[r0wly86]

The fact is pressure is pressure and it effects people differently. That is the fact. What one person sees as pressure can be a bread and butter situation to someone else.

that is akin to saying that the common cold and ebola is the same, diseases are diseases after all and some people's immune system can handle it, and others can't

 

[Deleted member 29109]

Seems some of the LiV boys have signed a letter to Peter Dawson uncle Greg has had written for them.

 

[Deleted member 1147]

Yes, some recent ones:

-pressure is pressure
-there are different levels of pressure

- PGA tour ropes are safer

 

[Deleted member 1418]

To sum up this thread:

- the PGA tour is terrible and has always been. As such the players have had to leave to get paid enough.
- the PGA tour is great because the players are paid well and there is more competition on that tour
- Saudi is evil and therefore so is LIV
- The PGA tour plays in China and is sponsored by companies who trade in with evil regimes, and is therefore evil as well
- the caddies are looked after better on LIV and there is a nice plane
- LIV is just a pre-retirement tour
- LIV has a team aspect which is great
- LIV has a team element that is crap
- certain players are joining LIV
- oh no they aren't

ad nauseum

Anything else?

You missed out YouTube is a brilliant platform for viewing LIV; YouTube is a crap platform for viewing LIV.

 

[GB72]

To sum up this thread:

- the PGA tour is terrible and has always been. As such the players have had to leave to get paid enough.
- the PGA tour is great because the players are paid well and there is more competition on that tour
- Saudi is evil and therefore so is LIV
- The PGA tour plays in China and is sponsored by companies who trade in with evil regimes, and is therefore evil as well
- the caddies are looked after better on LIV and there is a nice plane
- LIV is just a pre-retirement tour
- LIV has a team aspect which is great
- LIV has a team element that is crap
- certain players are joining LIV
- oh no they aren't

ad nauseum

Anything else?

Nope, pretty much sums it up. Actually one of those things where I wish that both sides could lose and a third option game forward as the pinacle of golfing competion as I have found the behavior of pretty much everyone involved in this whole debacle pretty disagreeable and cringeworthy. The solution when this started all those months ago would have been pretty simple, negotiate and grant releases for a few players to play a set number of LIV events each year with agreements on who could play what and perhaps with reciprocal agreements that those playing LIV events maybe agree to play one of the smaller PGA events in exchange to boost the appeal of that tournament. LIV agrees not to expand the fields and even maybe include some up an coming pros so they have experience and a bit of a name when they hit the PGA Tour and they agree to a contract whereby participation cannot be at the expense of certain events. Instead, we get this. Aside from the Sportswashing elememt (which seems to be ignored in so many other sports because it is not challenging the current elite body) I have an equally poor view of the PGA Tour, DP Tour (which could not look more like the PGA tour's puppy if it tried) and LIV.

 

[rksquire]

Question

Presidents Cup has been heavily effected by the Liv v PGAT divide which is a shame.

Which international team do we think is stronger

ROTW TEAM.
Hideki Matsuyama
Sungjae Im
Tom Kim
Corey Conners
Adam Scott
K.H. Lee
Mito Pereira
Sebastian Munoz
Cameron Davis
Christiaan Bezuidenhout
SI Woo Kim
Taylor Pendrith


LIV ROTW TEAM

Smith
Niemann,
Ancer
Lahiri
Oosthuizen
Leishman
Schwartzel
Grace
Ortiz
Jones
Kaewkanjana
Khongwatmai

The LIV ROTW TEAM is stronger generally, but the margin isn't that great just yet.... however, the USA team remains very strong, it definitely isn't as badly affected so far by LIV. But you never know, in the face of adversity etc., the ROTW team may pull of a miracle. If it's a USA dominant performance I think that will only increase the noise of the selection of LIV players for the other international teams going forward. It would be a shame for these events to be overshadowed by the golfing powerplay but it does seem that is inevitable.