Crow
Crow Person
But the average punter who refuses to pay Sky et al can now watch the best (according to your analysis above
).
LIV Golf
- Thread starter MarkT
- Start date
But the average punter who refuses to pay Sky et al can now watch the best (according to your analysis above
).
BubbaP
Occasional Player of Golf
Agree about leaderboards not being the same. We've just interpreted "best v best" differently ?
Have probably read too many times on the internet that the players you mention were 'rubbish has beens' also ???
Harry Putter
Member
So what's your view..? Forget the internet ramblings. Are players who finished top 10 in a major European Tour event last year some of the best or not? What do you personally think?
BubbaP
Occasional Player of Golf
? It's been a good event, no doubt.
Depending on how you look at it, perhaps a quarter strength verses the 3 strong majors.
A few weeks later the Arnold Palmer on the PGAT had a significantly stronger field though - just the way it has gone with the two tours.
Of course at the moment with the court case the DPWT events are not banning players, just making them not welcome. If things had taken a different course, some high ranked US players could have been regulars on the DPWT - but just speculation.
"Best" is subjective. A regular poster believes only the top 30 really matter, I've suggested it goes a bit deeper than that - it's just opinions though.
The point I was trying to make was that the very top players rarely did play against each other in significant numbers that often.
ColchesterFC
Journeyman Pro
Not sure I'd agree with that. I don't think anyone could seriously argue that the PGA tour hasn't been weakened by losing players like DJ, BDC and Smith, but I'm not sure that it's been a great victory for Norman, Saudi and LIV. I'm sure that with the hundreds of millions that they've thrown at it so far they would've hoped for better results and more big names in their field. In my book the only winners are the players that have added a couple of extra zeroes to their bank balances. I don't think the PGA tour or LIV can claim any kind of victory and the only result for the golf fan is that they will be watching poorer competition in both events.
Swango1980
Well-known member
Every player has the opportunity to qualify for the biggest events, if they are good enough. Sure, we know that there are other ways to qualify. There are plenty of players who play at the Masters who are not good enough to win (several past winners), but all the best players are still able to compete.
There are 2 obstacles that don't make this the case for LIV. Firstly, players have to really be invited first, and even if they are willing to play, it may only happen if they can negotiate a massive contract. Secondly, it is clear that most of the top players in the world simply do not recognise LIV as a legitimate tour, by not agreeing to play despite the money on offer. A tour will never become great if the greatest players don't want to play on it.
LIV has not managed to get over those hurdles yet. And, in all honesty, the Saudi Arabian link is controversial to.some, but I'd agree it is less controversial to broadcasters. The biggest controversy for them is that I'd is quite clear the biggest golf tour in the world is 100% against LIV. Certainly, that puts Sky in a position to not get anywhere close to.supporting LIV. However, any broadcaster interested in showing golf will think twice, as they'd not earn brownie points with the PGA (if they wanted to show their events in future). Furthermore, although some like LIV, it is clear many fans also hate LIV. So, broadcasting it massively splits opinion, which makes it controversial. If most of the best players in the world had no issue with it, and there is a guaranteed route for every player to.play on LIV if good enough, then things would start to change
Oddsocks
Ryder Cup Winner
If it makes you guys feel better, SA have just invested into media rights and sponsorship of a much lower grade sport, motocross. This series has been struggling for years and the SA’s have just purchased broadcasting rights (for what is one of the smallest resale markets globally for that sport) as well as investing at least 1 SA sponsor into the series to inject privateer prize money.
It’s something this sport has needed for decades and I see very little to gain for SA/SA sponsors, maybe they really are pushing for change!
Does this make me an SA-bot , liv-bot or pga-antibot as it’s all getting confusing?
It’s something this sport has needed for decades and I see very little to gain for SA/SA sponsors, maybe they really are pushing for change!
Does this make me an SA-bot , liv-bot or pga-antibot as it’s all getting confusing?
rksquire
Head Pro
I don't really get the defense in favour of Sky re: Boxing & NUFC and promotion of SA backed events / clubs..... if you're outraged about where the funding is coming from, the 'legitimacy' or 'credibility' of the event is irrelevant - you can't have selective outrage. If the 'credibility' means you ignore the Human Rights element for Boxing or NUFC, it is unfair to then use the Human Rights element to decry the credibility of LIV; the credibility of one versus the other has be questioned on the same terms (the standard of golf, the courses, the quality of field, tournament duration, format, etc,) and it's fine to come to the conclusion it's not credible; it's also fine to conclude it's disrupted the status quo of what really was a PGAT stranglehold and this may be upsetting / overdue / unnecessary / divisive (or any other opinion).
D
Deleted member 21445
Guest
Interesting to hear Bryson say Liv talks are going well with Peter Dawson from the world ranking points organisation.
Also that Liv are being totally flexible with changing their model to fit the criteria.
Also that Liv are being totally flexible with changing their model to fit the criteria.
Swango1980
Well-known member
LIV are in a position to be incredibly flexible, they are a start up company and money is not a problem. That is the problem for the PGA. This start up company can be extremely flexible to aim for more and more success. Success that is not going to benefit the PGA Tour.
The proposed Football Super League, if it had actually gone ahead, would have been in a position to be extremely flexible, at the expense of all other football as we know it (hence the absolute outrage). However, the reason for them doing it was to earn money (not that they had the money already to do what they wanted), and the fact football is huge and there was so much negativity around it, that it never looked like it would achieve what it wanted.
However, let us say they (football Super League) already had all the money they wanted, and they offered clubs billions and billions to take part. Think of a club as an individual golfer. Some clubs may decline the offer, as they are already hugely successful, and likely to be successful for many years, and they don't need the negativity about joining the Super League. Other clubs are desperate for the money, they see a lottery win, and decide to take it. Likely clubs that were at a high level, but now struggling financially. Maybe the odd big club, that are still well off, decide to take the money. And, to make up the numbers, some "less good" clubs are offered a deal they can't refuse.
It is clear to football fans that this can't be good for football, and it is purely about the money. No promotion of relegation, just a bunch of clubs randomly put together to play in another football competition.
It is very similar to LIV. I can understand why many of the players signed up to it, but it doesn't mean it is good for golf and good for the sport. The fact that the benefit some take from it is that it is free doesn't seem to be a great benefit to golf. Any sport wants to attract fans willing to invest in it, not people who want a free lunch. That doesn't make it sustainable
Imurg
The Grinder Of Pars (Semi Crocked)
So if the changes required are ..
Drop the shotgun start
Play 72 holes
With a Cut
Ability to qualify to play
Doesn't that make it the same as the PGAT..?
D
Deleted member 15344
Guest
A few things from that
How does BDC know what’s happening unless GN is telling them - and that’s the same GN who said that wouldn’t lose points or any of the other promises he made that were false
And if they change to get points it still needs to be a year and the changes will make it no different to the PGAT or other tours apart from the money
D
Deleted member 25172
Guest
You forgot the main things that would separate the two - it's louder. And they can wear shorts. The keys to #GrowTheGame
evemccc
Well-known member
1) Very few golf fans watch every PGA Tour event - most watch the weekends of the Majors, Players and Ryder cup / Wentworth at most
2) I feel confident the numbers of those hard-core golf on TV fans who are ‘missing out’ by having fields weakened are easily, overwhelmingly outweighed by those (ie EVERYONE) now able to watch golf, advert interruption free, for free, on YouTube with LIV
D
Deleted member 15344
Guest
With LIV seemingly now chasing Telly deals the free and advert free is surely going to change
GB72
Money List Winner
I am not sure that LIV would care too much. I actually think that the PGA Tour may have been their own worst enemy here. The end result is that LIV may have to change to become a Tour matching the PGA model but actually being a truely global tour with events all over the world. Should that happen, it could become over time a whole diferrent prospect that could seriously challenge the PGA Tour as the number one tour in golf. It certainly coul attract golfers from around the world who want to play at the highest level but also want to play in their home country or be able to pick a schedule that does not necessitate a move to the US.
That would certainly make the global landscape interesting.
IanM
Journeyman Pro
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I am leaving Golf Monthly. Nuts to you all!! I have been offered a mountain of cash to post elsewhere!!
Ah, but I still want to post when I feel like it and play in "meets" when it suits me! Whaddya mean you've deleted my profile? See you in Court!!
Yep, it's that daft.
Ah, but I still want to post when I feel like it and play in "meets" when it suits me! Whaddya mean you've deleted my profile? See you in Court!!
Yep, it's that daft.
pokerjoke
Money List Winner
People still picking holes in Liv after most of the previous picking has turned out false
BDC has been in meetings,his team would obviously have been made promises and commitments and he would have made his final decision off that.
He mentioned at the end of his interview it would take time,but also said Liv was only going to get bigger and better,and players were going to get very rich.
BDC has been in meetings,his team would obviously have been made promises and commitments and he would have made his final decision off that.
He mentioned at the end of his interview it would take time,but also said Liv was only going to get bigger and better,and players were going to get very rich.
pokerjoke
Money List Winner
PJ87
Journeyman Pro
Exactly. People will like what they want and if they don't like it they can't be won over
Friend of mine when talking about the field last night
"If they don’t get ranking points and to play the majors it won’t last"
"Even if it lasts , and I’m not sure it’s still rubbish"
For one he has never watched it , so how can you completely judge?
Then the fact first it was it won't get off the ground
Then it won't get a top 50 player
Then oh they are all past it
Then won't get a top 10 player
Always a reason
