LIV Golf

[Deleted member 15344]

You do make me laugh Phil. When players leave who have a big media impact go to LIV, you brush them off as being at the end of their careers, and when young players who have a good deal of potential leave you brush them off has not having a big media impact.

Is it not valid then ?

How many people know who Niemann is ? Is he all over the media when the big comps come around ? Do crowds flock to see him at tournaments?

Your tunnel vision in regards LIV just gets more narrow each time.

What’s happened to Matsyuama ?

 

[Mel Smooth]

Is it not valid then ?

How many people know who Niemann is ? Is he all over the media when the big comps come around ? Do crowds flock to see him at tournaments?

Your tunnel vision in regards LIV just gets more narrow each time.

What’s happened to Matsyuama ?

I'd imagine loads of people know who Niemann is Phil, especially in latin america - and no, people don't flock to see him at tournaments, because they are all in North America, or they were - and the South American golf fans have little chance of going to watch "their man".

 

[Deleted member 21445]

Everyone says the Ryder Cup is the biggest casualty in all this.
The European Ryder Cup Team wouldn't be terrible without the Liv Players.
Still could be a contest

Rory
Rahm
Fitzpateick
Hovland
Hatton
Fleetwood
Lowry
Pieters
S Power
?
?
?

 

[Backsticks]

Everyone says the Ryder Cup is the biggest casualty in all this.
The European Ryder Cup Team wouldn't be terrible without the Liv Players.
Still could be a contest

Rory
Rahm
Fitzpateick
Hovland
Hatton
Fleetwood
Lowry
Pieters
S Power
?
?
?

Nah. RC is just a curio, and not really relavant. It isnt too important. Agree is a casualty, as its the one thing that is already dwad as collateral damage in the war. But I wouldnt cry over it. Much mor important is the avoiding of any serious cleave that gives us a twin track pro golf scene with divided resources. Niemann, Leishman etc, are minor foot soldiers who will not be factors in the winning or losing of the battle. Smith is. But if the indications are right, he is the last defector. And while a loss, it would still give the PGAT a comfortable victory. The Saudi tour being more a Harlem Globe Trotters stage show, with the real sport elsewhere.
There is a real possibility the career of Cam Smith could be the biggest casualty - the man who sold his golfing soul and ended up a one win wonder that could have been much much more.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Everyone says the Ryder Cup is the biggest casualty in all this.
The European Ryder Cup Team wouldn't be terrible without the Liv Players.
Still could be a contest

Rory
Rahm
Fitzpateick
Hovland
Hatton
Fleetwood
Lowry
Pieters
S Power
?
?
?

It’s not going to affect the European team much- looking at the players who have left then most like Westwood , Garcia etc would have been looking at picks but other than that ?‍

The US team will have been hit harder

DJ mainly , but if the like if Koepka and BDC get their form back then they would have been big players for the US

 

[BubbaP]

Everyone says the Ryder Cup is the biggest casualty in all this.
The European Ryder Cup Team wouldn't be terrible without the Liv Players.
Still could be a contest

Rory
Rahm
Fitzpateick
Hovland
Hatton
Fleetwood
Lowry
Pieters
S Power
?
?
?

Surely the Presidents Cup is much more of a casualty.

There's actually been growing nonsense chat about having a ryder cup style PGAT vs. LIV, which I laughed off. As the sniping grows, maybe it would have some legs - but the politics wouldn’t allow it. PGAT would be favourites but it would likely capture the public attention.

 

[woofers]

There is a real possibility the career of Cam Smith could be the biggest casualty - the man who sold his golfing soul and ended up a one win wonder that could have been much much more.

So true, if he signs.

 

[BubbaP]

So true, if he signs.

What's the thinking then?
Cam has 5 year exemptions at 3 of the majors, and 30+ years at the other.

 

[fundy]

Like grease lightening this thread lol, "I got shills, theyre multiplying"........................

 

[Backsticks]

What's the thinking then?
Cam has 5 year exemptions at 3 of the majors, and 30+ years at the other.

The thinking is, that of course, the majors are what matters most, and he will be in all 4 for the next 15 years regardless. But the big problem, is that thats all he will be in. He will be playing only 4 tournaments a year. He is at risk of becoming beached on 6 career wins. So he HAS to win majors. Thats a lot of pressure, and he will be coming into them with the handicap of no other serious tournament experience, or of measuring himself against the other top 30 golfers that he will face in them. When he sits down to press conference his move to Saudi, he could well be drawing a curtain on the sum achievement, and his record in tournament golf, right there, at the age of 29, just as one might have thought in the normal course of events, it was about to really launch. So part LiV move announcement, part retirement announcement.

 

[BubbaP]

The thinking is, that of course, the majors are what matters most, and he will be in all 4 for the next 15 years regardless. But the big problem, is that thats all he will be in. He will be playing only 4 tournaments a year. He is at risk of becoming beached on 6 career wins. So he HAS to win majors. Thats a lot of pressure, and he will be coming into them with the handicap of no other serious tournament experience, or of measuring himself against the other top 30 golfers that he will face in them. When he sits down to press conference his move to Saudi, he could well be drawing a curtain on the sum achievement, and his record in tournament golf, right there, at the age of 29, just as one might have thought in the normal course of events, it was about to really launch. So part LiV move announcement, part retirement announcement.

Thanks for explaining/sharing your views ?, intriguing.

 

[Backsticks]

Thanks for explaining/sharing your views ?, intriguing.

Its like footballers going to play in China or the US. Serious ones do it at 37 or so when their playing days in the top flight are done, and the medals and legacy in the game written. So they cash in for a few years. But and cups or championships they win there are meaningless, and hardly even a footnote, if that, in the career achievents. The occasional one goes that bit younger. Maybe early 30s. Smith is the equivalent. Effectively calling time on his career - but for the not insignificant point of the majors. But like the occasional footballer who is called back from the states to play for his country in a Euros or world cup, its a rare opportunity to play serious football again, and they are generally well 9f the top flight level.

 

[Deleted member 3432]

Its like footballers going to play in China or the US. Serious ones do it at 37 or so when their playing days in the top flight are done, and the medals and legacy in the game written. So they cash in for a few years. But and cups or championships they win there are meaningless, and hardly even a footnote, if that, in the career achievents. The occasional one goes that bit younger. Maybe early 30s. Smith is the equivalent. Effectively calling time on his career - but for the not insignificant point of the majors. But like the occasional footballer who is called back from the states to play for his country in a Euros or world cup, its a rare opportunity to play serious football again, and they are generally well 9f the top flight level.

Good time to go, Major golf tournaments are been won by 20 somethings now, ots a young man's game these days.

Plenty of top players yet to win a big one yet so no big deal.

Personally I don't think there is a single player the game would would miss if they moved one way or the other. Let's be honest the game doesn't have a superstar like Tiger in his prime.

 

[Deleted member 1147]

Good time to go, Major golf tournaments are been won by 20 somethings now, ots a young man's game these days.

Plenty of top players yet to win a big one yet so no big deal.

Personally I don't think there is a single player the game would would miss if they moved one way or the other. Let's be honest the game doesn't have a superstar like Tiger in his prime.

I would miss a few - Rory, Spieth being the main ones.

 

[Wilson]

He actually got given the win rather than won it.
He’s bottled majors for 8 years,that’s his legacy,probably one of the most talented golfers ,who has massively bombed in majors.
A man who calls others greedy but shows how money motivates him,he really didn’t give a poop about that tournament,the same as in 2015 when he was skipping around the fairway.
He’s become a spokesman for the tour and how good it is,but players are still leaving.
Although it’s stabilising there is a place for two tours,yet some can’t get to grips with it.
He failed to shout Fore yesterday twice,why,it’s an automatic shout,is it above him?
Good golfer,total hypocrite imo.

Are you aware he's won 4 Majors already? Did SS let Rory know on the 1st he was going to give the event to him?

 

[Blue in Munich]

He’s becoming very boring now imo.

Rory or Mel? ?

 

[Backsticks]

Good time to go, Major golf tournaments are been won by 20 somethings now, ots a young man's game these days.

Plenty of top players yet to win a big one yet so no big deal.

Personally I don't think there is a single player the game would would miss if they moved one way or the other. Let's be honest the game doesn't have a superstar like Tiger in his prime.

No single player, true. Thats why its the number of players that defect to Saudi that is important. If Smith is the last, then the PGAT holds the victory. LIV will look like a par 3 tournament, and its game over for them and only a matter of time until some diplomatic withdrawal can be engineered. But if another 3 or 4 of the current top 20 jump, then it is contest on, forces divided, and a bit of loss for everyone. It does seem a war LIV has no chance of winning. They just arent going to get enough of the top players to be credible, and 50-100 rankers will not cut it for viewer interest without the top names.

 

[slowhand]

He actually got given the win rather than won it.

Really? Considering he shot the best 72 hole aggregate score of the entire field (17 under, beating Sungjae Im by 1 shot), as well as overcoming a 6-shot deficit caused by the handicapping system, I find your comment rather specious

 

[rksquire]

The PGA Tour 'changes', endorsed by McIlroy et al, could easily have been reported with the headline 'Death of the DPWT'. Whilst we all laugh at GNs ridiculousness (& the laughter is justified), he's not wrong - change has been accelerated and the enticement is $$$, it does feel somewhat rushed and at least partially plagiarized (very loosely speaking). Of course, the announcement makes no reference to the strategic alliance (joke) and it appears, going by Rahms comments, some 'top' European golfers haven't been consulted. McIlroy isn't walking a fine line with his European background - he's all in with the US of A.

Why was Rickie Fowler at the meeting? Surely dressing in orange no longer is enough to be interesting. If he'd went to LIV (and it would have been a good move for him!) he would roundly have been called a 'has-been'. Yet, here he is, jumping in a car with Tiger as the driver (brave or stupid?), to attend a meeting that much higher ranked players weren't invited too. Weird. He must have some photos of JT, Spieth etc. from those Spring Break holidays.

Hideki - the actual power player when it comes to international markets. From various sources it does seem there is an offer from LIV (from a business perspective this makes perfect sense); it also seems the PGA Tour recognize his value (from a business perspective this makes perfect sense) and so, moreso than Smith, the PGA Tour are putting an offer in front of Hideki where he is rewarded over and above the other changes announced.

On a sidenote but LIV related so think it's okay here - the Tour Championship format is a total gimmick, and had it been conceived by an Australian I can imagine the thoughts. The starting positions are nonsense. The prizemoney is basically rewarding guys who have already won a ton of money with a ton more money. The 30 players all get ranking points, but not from the actual official final leaderboard - confusing & contrived. (That said, I very much enjoyed the golf and the fact McIlroy came from '10' back after his first 2 holes on day 1; didn't really enjoy the rhetoric of the last day being the best players going toe to toe - Shuffler wasn't really at it on Sunday). The best player in the world this year (by the OGWR new system) did win it.... but he didn't win anything 'important' this year, apart from, maybe, Jay Monahan's heart!

 

[evemccc]

If it’s all about the ranking then those relative ‘no-name’ currently riding-high in the rankings golfers should have been at the meeting….and not Rickie Fowler ?

If it’s all about who ‘moves the needle’ to quote the PGA Tour’s PIP initiative — then like it or not but that’s what it is in professional sport these days….and that’s why Fowler was there.

So, that accepted, to claim LIV is over and PGA has primacy is absurd. Bryson, Bubba, Brooks, Garcia, Reed (villains are needed!), DJ and Cameron Smith is a significant haul amongst advertisers and in the eyes of the sporting / casual golfing public. To an objective observer, the changes made by the PGA Tour make it a bit of a mockery.

And LIV is not appealing either.


Solution is to treat it all as a bad joke. Neither side or ‘tribe’ (it’s become v tribal) has come out well…that includes Rory and Westwood with their constant jibes