LIV Golf

[Mel Smooth]

The qualifying points is just a project fear from the anti LIV lobby. But its a false one. The pgat doesnt control points, nor entry to the majors. Some are trying to present owgr position as the gateway to majors. It is one of several. If there are no points for Saudi players and they disappear from the owgr, the majors will create another entry point for them. The majors are not in this commercial spat.
Qualifying points is a red herring.

There seems to be a mentality that LIV players should be punished for joining the series by having their access to Majors massively impacted, but the bottom line is, if there is public and commercial demand for those players to be there, then the majors will want them there.
I appreciate you’ve made the point several times on this thread, in my view, it’s the correct one. But time will only tell.

 

[BrianM]

I assume this isn't purely a list of the world's biggest golf tours? I guess "biggest" is subjective, but there there probably are not many metrics that DP is 5th? If it was on player earnings only, then I'd have thought it would be 3rd and LIV probably at 1st (albeit only a small number of players can play, and therefore benefit). However, taking all factors into account, surely the PGA is a clear 1st and DP a clear 2nd. It is arguable if LIV actually counts as a proper golf Tour really and should therefore even be on the list, but that is clearly a circular argument between pro and anti LIV fans.

What I don’t get is the winner on the Korn Ferry Tour got almost double the world ranking points than the winner on the DP tour.
This is where Keith Pelley needs to start earning his money, we need a strong European Tour, but we need to get more big money events to get our Rory’s etc back across the pond.

 

[Beezerk]

There's no way that the Asian tour is above the DP or the Korn Ferry actually

I’d certainly put Korn Ferry above DP, it seems all the breakout players come from the Korn Ferry tour these days.

 

[BrianM]

I’d certainly put Korn Ferry above DP, it seems all the breakout players come from the Korn Ferry tour these days.

Looking at the ranking points awarded, you are 100% right.

 

[sweaty sock]

I assume this isn't purely a list of the world's biggest golf tours? I guess "biggest" is subjective, but there there probably are not many metrics that DP is 5th? If it was on player earnings only, then I'd have thought it would be 3rd and LIV probably at 1st (albeit only a small number of players can play, and therefore benefit). However, taking all factors into account, surely the PGA is a clear 1st and DP a clear 2nd. It is arguable if LIV actually counts as a proper golf Tour really and should therefore even be on the list, but that is clearly a circular argument between pro and anti LIV fans.

The list was my assumption of the order 'twitter' was using to say DP was the 5th ranked tour. My opinion without any real research is that pga and liv are 1 and 2. The rest are much more subjective, as a european, we probably think dp is the best from a career and progression point of view. If I was american, I wouldnt even consider the dp if I had access to the kft, so outside of liv and pga the order is subjective.

My point was that whatever your subjective view is, the DP has fallen a long way from its legitimate pga challenger position in the nineties...

 

[BubbaP]

The ET has a level of access to The Open for example that none of the other tours have

The likes of the KFT have none going into any major and Asian Tour has very minimal

Right, follow now - exemptions. ?
Agree, The Open pretty strong - the others not so much (US Open has some)

 

[Deleted member 15344]

The qualifying points is just a project fear from the anti LIV lobby. But its a false one. The pgat doesnt control points, nor entry to the majors. Some are trying to present owgr position as the gateway to majors. It is one of several. If there are no points for Saudi players and they disappear from the owgr, the majors will create another entry point for them. The majors are not in this commercial spat.
Qualifying points is a red herring.

You keep saying that but I think you will be very surprised

The Masters had fingers pointed at the during the Law suit , they have already asked Mickelson to not turn up - they won’t create any extra access beyond what they have

The Open - again the R&A were pretty clear in what they have said and with asking GN to not turn etc , they also won’t create extra access

The PGA - they will be firmly behind the PGAT and also with the US Open they will stick to their qualifying

The majors won’t add qualfiying spots direct from LiV Tour imo - it’s why the players are going to play on the Asian Tour and also want to keep membership on others

 

[r0wly86]

You keep saying that but I think you will be very surprised

The Masters had fingers pointed at the during the Law suit , they have already asked Mickelson to not turn up - they won’t create any extra access beyond what they have

The Open - again the R&A were pretty clear in what they have said and with asking GN to not turn etc , they also won’t create extra access

The PGA - they will be firmly behind the PGAT and also with the US Open they will stick to their qualifying

The majors won’t add qualfiying spots direct from LiV Tour imo - it’s why the players are going to play on the Asian Tour and also want to keep membership on others

Agree, people will watch the Majors whether LIV players are on it or not, so there is no incentive for them to bend the rules to allow access

 

[BrianM]

Agree, people will watch the Majors whether LIV players are on it or not, so there is no incentive for them to bend the rules to allow access

People will always watch it, but they won’t be winning it competing against all the best players in the world.
Brooks, BDC, DJ and Reed are still world class and are still capable of winning Majors.
So to some people, there would be that wee * next to it.
In my opinion, I think the players would rather they were playing as well, then there’s no ambiguity about the result.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

People will always watch it, but they won’t be winning it competing against all the best players in the world.
Brooks, BDC, DJ and Reed are still world class and are still capable of winning Majors.
So to some people, there would be that wee * next to it.
In my opinion, I think the players would rather they were playing as well, then there’s no ambiguity about the result.

And those players will still be in the majors ?‍

 

[BrianM]

And those players will still be in the majors ?‍

Only if the world ranking points system is sorted.
The big problem with LIV will be the 3 round format in my opinion, if it was just a normal 4 day tournament I don’t think it would be such an issue (forgetting the team element, which is secondary)

 

[r0wly86]

People will always watch it, but they won’t be winning it competing against all the best players in the world.
Brooks, BDC, DJ and Reed are still world class and are still capable of winning Majors.
So to some people, there would be that wee * next to it.
In my opinion, I think the players would rather they were playing as well, then there’s no ambiguity about the result.

But I honestly don't think the Majors care, they don't need to justify their tournaments, they are known around the world and transcend the sport. Majority of people won't care if Zalatoris or McIloroy win a major because BDC wasn't there.

I just cannot see a reason why the Majors would alter their qualification requirements, they gain nothing from it

 

[Imurg]

Only if the world ranking points system is sorted.
The big problem with LIV will be the 3 round format in my opinion, if it was just a normal 4 day tournament I don’t think it would be such an issue (forgetting the team element, which is secondary)

They have exemptions as Major winners for the next few years..those mentioned don't need ranking points for entry..

 

[Mel Smooth]

But I honestly don't think the Majors care, they don't need to justify their tournaments, they are known around the world and transcend the sport. Majority of people won't care if Zalatoris or McIloroy win a major because BDC wasn't there.

I just cannot see a reason why the Majors would alter their qualification requirements, they gain nothing from it

The winner of The Open is Champion Golfer, would it not be a hollow title knowing there are golfers out there that could have potentially challenged for that position?

 

[Deleted member 29109]

The winner of The Open is Champion Golfer, would it not be a hollow title knowing there are golfers out there that could have potentially challenged for that position?

It’s no different to players missing through injury.

Was the PGA any poorer this year with Mickleson missing? Absolutely not.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Only if the world ranking points system is sorted.
The big problem with LIV will be the 3 round format in my opinion, if it was just a normal 4 day tournament I don’t think it would be such an issue (forgetting the team element, which is secondary)

They will still be playing majors due to exemptions they already have and then performing in the majors will keep them in

And if the Tour was set up as per normal then they would be getting ranking points after being around for a year

 

[Imurg]

Successfully defending The Open has happened 3 times in the last 40 years...it's not a common occurrence
Not having last year's winner is unlikely to matter much..

 

[BrianM]

They have exemptions as Major winners for the next few years..those mentioned don't need ranking points for entry..

Clearly, I never thought that through ???

 

[Mel Smooth]

It’s no different to players missing through injury.

Was the PGA any poorer this year with Mickleson missing? Absolutely not.

But that’s always going to be the case, as it always has been. We’re talking about a scenario where the field is engineered to exclude players from competing - who would have a genuine chance of winning.

 

[BubbaP]

Clearly, I never thought that through ???

Ha, it is pretty complicated following individual exemptions and expiry times.
More 'what if' stuff but players like Ancer, Gooch, Wolff for example might be considered future possible challengers