LIV Golf

[Lord Tyrion]

It’s going to be 54 holes of strokeplay with the players not giving a monkeys about the team

I get that but as Mel pointed out it does draw in the betting markets, I don't bet but the market is huge, and viewers may buy into it.

As a shotgun start it is also a days golf compressed into 4-5 hours rather than a whole day and there will be no dead time whilst the last few groups take 10 minutes to decide a shot as the director can move to any hole and find a group playing. On Sunday in the PGA Scheffler played one hole and one shot in a spell of 45 minutes. I don't think it was his fault but how can that be good tv?

Let's face it, if they did more of the same then there is nothing to differentiate it from the US or European tours. It might be gimmicky but then perhaps it needs a bit of that to make ripples. If we go back to the Packer analogy, cricketers playing in pyjama's, what is that about? Roll on all these years..........

 

[fundy]

I get that but as Mel pointed out it does draw in the betting markets, I don't bet but the market is huge, and viewers may buy into it.

As a shotgun start it is also a days golf compressed into 4-5 hours rather than a whole day and there will be no dead time whilst the last few groups take 10 minutes to decide a shot as the director can move to any hole and find a group playing. On Sunday in the PGA Scheffler played one hole and one shot in a spell of 45 minutes. I don't think it was his fault but how can that be good tv?

Let's face it, if they did more of the same then there is nothing to differentiate it from the US or European tours. It might be gimmicky but then perhaps it needs a bit of that to make ripples. If we go back to the Packer analogy, cricketers playing in pyjama's, what is that about? Roll on all these years..........

Id be pretty certain that there will be next to no volume bet on the team events, it will be bet on the individual winner, because thats what the bookies know, thats what the punters know and thats what will be offered with any liquidity on the betting sites

Hard to bet on the teams when no one knows whos in which teams until close to the off too

Over time this may change slightly but certainly wont happen overnight, the betting will follow not lead on the team event being a success

 

[Depreston]

I get that but as Mel pointed out it does draw in the betting markets, I don't bet but the market is huge, and viewers may buy into it.

As a shotgun start it is also a days golf compressed into 4-5 hours rather than a whole day and there will be no dead time whilst the last few groups take 10 minutes to decide a shot as the director can move to any hole and find a group playing. On Sunday in the PGA Scheffler played one hole and one shot in a spell of 45 minutes. I don't think it was his fault but how can that be good tv?

Let's face it, if they did more of the same then there is nothing to differentiate it from the US or European tours. It might be gimmicky but then perhaps it needs a bit of that to make ripples. If we go back to the Packer analogy, cricketers playing in pyjama's, what is that about? Roll on all these years..........

if the PGA came up with this proposal i'd be just as critical though because it's just scattergun. There was potential to really develop a good team event ok the teams and how to get people invested was always going to be difficult but this is just a 54 hole individual strokeplay event. There's a gap sure but the LIV have filled it with sand.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

Id be pretty certain that there will be next to no volume bet on the team events, it will be bet on the individual winner, because thats what the bookies know, thats what the punters know and thats what will be offered with any liquidity on the betting sites

Hard to bet on the teams when no one knows whos in which teams until close to the off too

Over time this may change slightly but certainly wont happen overnight, the betting will follow not lead on the team event being a success

Every journey begins with a first step . I'm sure they are not expecting everything to fall into place in the first tournament. It will take time to grow, or flop within a year of course.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

if the PGA came up with this proposal i'd be just as critical though because it's just scattergun. There was potential to really develop a good team event ok the teams and how to get people invested was always going to be difficult but this is just a 54 hole individual strokeplay event. There's a gap sure but the LIV have filled it with sand.

I don't disagree with your comments. I suspect they are prepared to be flexible though and change how they do things to improve and engage. The point is, they are not tied to 72 hole strokeplay, same system week after week.

 

[Swango1980]

I get that but as Mel pointed out it does draw in the betting markets, I don't bet but the market is huge, and viewers may buy into it.

As a shotgun start it is also a days golf compressed into 4-5 hours rather than a whole day and there will be no dead time whilst the last few groups take 10 minutes to decide a shot as the director can move to any hole and find a group playing. On Sunday in the PGA Scheffler played one hole and one shot in a spell of 45 minutes. I don't think it was his fault but how can that be good tv?

Let's face it, if they did more of the same then there is nothing to differentiate it from the US or European tours. It might be gimmicky but then perhaps it needs a bit of that to make ripples. If we go back to the Packer analogy, cricketers playing in pyjama's, what is that about? Roll on all these years..........

There are disadvantages with the shotgun start. Personally, as an event develops currently, the leaders emerge from the pack. And I enjoy watching the lions share of their rounds, and see how they cope under the pressure as they get to the finishing line. With a shotgun start, there will be so much going on, inevitably we will see a lot of footage of players not in contention. If big name players like Dustin are not in contention, undoubtedly we'll still see their shots, which will take away some time from the leaders. Not just watching their actual shots, but also the time the commentators have to build up the difficulty of a particular shot they have to play, or praise an excellent shot they just played under pressure. Furthermore, if there are any stand out holes on the course, like driveable par 4's, then the broadcasters may feature those more simply because there are always players on them. Especially early in the rounds, even on the final day. Again, some might say that is great as we see more of a feature hole, but then it may take away from watching some of the leaders playing other holes at any given time.

I wonder what it will be like for fans at the event. Yes, there will be more action to watch as you get to the end of the day. However, currently we know that the ultimate winning putt will be on the 18th green. With a shotgun start, it could be impossible to know where that glory moment will be, especially if scores are tight. I can imagine fans frantically trying to get from one part of the course to another to see that winning moment. Inevitably, there will be fewer fans for the winning player to celebrate that moment, as the fans will be spread over the course.

On balance, I think shotgun starts can be good at club level, when you want everyone finished about the same time so that food can be served and presentation completed. But, I don't think it will enhance golf from a fans perspective when watching the professional game.

 

[Mel Smooth]

You joking ?

Build an “affiliation” to a made up team that won’t be the same again ?‍

What “gap” do you think needs filling ?

Phil, there are people who I’m sure the current golf model fully satisfies there needs, maybe you’re one of them. But, there are loads of people who have no interest in watching 4 days of tournament golf, played over what, 45 hours approx? The whole Liv weekend will be a 3rd of that,

The same gap they tried to fill with the “6’s” and ended up being a damp squid because the majority actually prefer to watch the individual format ?

Or the mixed format which did the same

Is golf on a decline somewhere that means we need to find an alternative format ? Are we really struggling at the moment ?

When the British Masters comes around do they struggle to sell the tickets - same with the PGA , The Open ?

There always seems to be their small minority that have this narrative that we must find something new and different - is it because cricket did something new ?

I could sort of understand if the sport was struggling badly and people just weren’t watching but that’s not the case

People imo want to watch good golf from the top players regardless of the format

The Saudi thing isn’t about “growing the game” or “bringing excitement” into the sport - it’s just rich oil barons sport washing and wanting to use their money to start ti dominate sport - that’s all it is

The minute the PGA and ET ban players from entering their tournaments will the best thing for the sport - spreading it out amongst multiple tours fighting for the riches is not good for the sport or the spectators

You think they’ll ban DJ?
He’s part of the reason sponsors pump good money into the tour. Trust me, there’ll be a lot of the top players on the PGA looking at the LIV series a little differently today.

 

[Swango1980]

if the PGA came up with this proposal i'd be just as critical though because it's just scattergun. There was potential to really develop a good team event ok the teams and how to get people invested was always going to be difficult but this is just a 54 hole individual strokeplay event. There's a gap sure but the LIV have filled it with sand.

Agreed. Even if the team event was a bit like F1, where you had manufacturer teams like Callaway, Titleist, PING etc and some non-golf manufacturer teams like Red Bull, Adidas, Nike, it could make it more interesting from a team perspective. Golfers would sign up for that team, and then it would be a partnership while they were contracted to that team.

However, just random teams every week is a complete turn off. Unless the team actually represents something (e.g Ryder Cup), who cares. I watch the Pro-Am at Pebble Beach each year on the TV. Mainly because I like the course, and it is interesting to see the odd celebrity hit a shot (even though I don't know most of them). I have zero interest in the team scores though. And, I have absolutely no interest in watching any PGA event when they occasionally have pros playing as pairs. I have zero attachment to any team, even if I am a big fan of any of the individual players. I'd love to see McIlroy or Woods win another major (or any big event), but if McIlroy and Woods played as a pair in an event, regardless of prize money, I really don't care too much if they win or not.

 

[Mel Smooth]

Saturday evening, few beers, bets on, sat in the garden watching the LIV event draw to a conclusion as multiple players and teams fight for a MASSIVE prize, or late Sunday night/early hours of Monday morning, trying to stay awake to watch the Canadian Open stumble to an end.
Oh yeah, and one of them is free to watch without paying any subscriptions or breaking any laws.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Phil, there are people who I’m sure the current golf model fully satisfies there needs, maybe you’re one of them. But, there are loads of people who have no interest in watching 4 days of tournament golf, played over what, 45 hours approx? The whole Liv weekend will be a 3rd of that,

Loads ? So they want to watch 3 days instead ? And how come they didn’t go and watch the 6’s ?

Why did that not suceed ? Why don’t people flock to see the par 3 champs ?

You think they’ll ban DJ?
He’s part of the reason sponsors pump good money into the tour. Trust me, there’ll be a lot of the top players on the PGA looking at the LIV series a little differently today.

Yes they will ban him - he will already be losing sponsers over it

The PGA tour will have no issues going at this

 

[fundy]

Loads ? So they want to watch 3 days instead ? And how come they didn’t go and watch the 6’s ?

Why did that not suceed ? Why don’t people flock to see the par 3 champs ?


Yes they will ban him - he will already be losing sponsers over it

The PGA tour will have no issues going at this

He will when one of his main sponsors is sponsoring the Canadian Open thats on at the same time!

 

[Imurg]

The pace of play will be exactly the same as ever.
There may be fewer players all starting at the same time but it'll take the usual amount of time to get round...
An issue with going to watch a shotgun start is that you have 5 hours to get to see whoever you want..
And it's not that stellar a field really..apart from DJ and a few others it's mainly a bunch of has-beens or never will be's...
DJ doesn't care about legacies and traditions.. he's making his money so he can retire and make more babies with Paulina..
I don't see the need for this series.. the changing teams bit seems odd... what's the point of that?
No plans to tune in or follow...

 

[Mel Smooth]

Loads ? So they want to watch 3 days instead ? And how come they didn’t go and watch the 6’s ?

Why did that not suceed ? Why don’t people flock to see the par 3 champs ?


Yes they will ban him - he will already be losing sponsers over it

The PGA tour will have no issues going at this

I think you’re underestimating the influence of the Saudi money.
The reason this will succeed is because it has huge financial backing, and, it does appeal to many many golf fans.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

I think you’re underestimating the influence of the Saudi money.
The reason this will succeed is because it has huge financial backing, and, it does appeal to many many golf fans.

I think you are in for a shock

They can’t even sell tickets to it at the moment to the point they are giving them away

There is no real coverage and non of the main stream media channels will touch it

It won’t be a success with no one watching it

 

[BubbaP]

....
If players play the Liv tour then back to PGA or dp world tour for the next week like it should work there won't be an issue ..but the PGA don't like not getting to call the shots.


Don't think they can ban him from majors bar the PGA

I've quoted this, but applies to several posts.
The PGA Tour and the US PGA (who run the major) are different things.

As Wayne fired at Greg ...
"I have 2 comments. Will you stop referring to it as the PGA. It's the PGA Tour. Secondly from someone who has known Greg for 50 years. Greg is only about Greg," wrote Grady.

 

[Backsticks]

Consider cycling. There are teams, but even in a sport where working as a team has a genuine influence on how a rider can do, nobody cares about the teams, or supports them. Its still all about the individual. With golf there isnt even a player cooperation dynamic for the good of theteam. Even F1 has some element of that. But in golf it is irrelevant and simply a major misjudgement. It sounds like an idea from corporate suits who dont actually know anything about sport.
They may as well just pick a random group of players every week, and give them a bonus. Fans, even if they are watching the individual element, wont give a monkeys. Its a nothing.

 

[Mel Smooth]

I think you are in for a shock

They can’t even sell tickets to it at the moment to the point they are giving them away

There is no real coverage and non of the main stream media channels will touch it

It won’t be a success with no one watching it

How many times!!
it’s on YoubTube, the infrastructure for broadcasting it is already going in. Basically, if you have a phone and an internet connection, you can watch it anywhere on the planet.

One feels like one is banging one’s head against a brick wall here ?

 

[PJ87]

How many times!!
it’s on YoubTube, the infrastructure for broadcasting it is already going in. Basically, if you have a phone and an internet connection, you can watch it anywhere on the planet.

One feels like one is banging one’s head against a brick wall here ?

If it was on twitter they would be fine ?

 

[Deleted member 15344]

How many times!!
it’s on YoubTube, the infrastructure for broadcasting it is already going in. Basically, if you have a phone and an internet connection, you can watch it anywhere on the planet.

One feels like one is banging one’s head against a brick wall here ?

So what if it’s on you tube ? People still won’t watch it - do you even understand the golf market and the people that watch the comps ?

you are dreaming if you think this is going to be a success - money doesn’t buy everything and not all sportswashing works

 

[Golfnut1957]

Saturday evening, few beers, bets on, sat in the garden watching the LIV event draw to a conclusion as multiple players and teams fight for a MASSIVE prize, or late Sunday night/early hours of Monday morning, trying to stay awake to watch the Canadian Open stumble to an end.
Oh yeah, and one of them is free to watch without paying any subscriptions or breaking any laws.

Cool lifestyle dude, you have me convinced. All round your place for the highlight of the year.