LIV Golf

[Deleted member 15344]

The word ‘exodus’ has been used for weeks to predict the situation once the FedEx is finished. Time will tell, but it’s getting increasingly difficult to find people who are firmly on Monahans side regarding the stand off he has created.

But Greg Norman said it’s all full now and they only have 48 spots and more players than spots already ?‍

Or are some of this players that currently filling spots going to be binned off ?

Surely it’s clear to see who is on the side of PGAT - all those members that are staying ? Even the likes of the JH Kim who it seems turned it all down and went to the PGA tour and now has earned his card

 

[wjemather]

I'm late to this conversation due to lack of interest in pro golf outside of the majors, so this may have already been covered, however...
Surely any litigation will be entirely dependent on any contracts the pros have signed and the terms and conditions of the various competitions, just as they would be for the rest of us if we decided to leave an employer, take on a second job or play in a sports competition for a rival organisation or league.
Has anyone making the various assertions on here seen said contracts or Ts&Cs? If not, isn't this all just pointless conjecture?

Players are not employees of the tours so do not have employment contracts; this is one of the many things that leads to false analogies with other sports or working life in general.
However the players do sign membership agreements, some of the provisions of which have never been tested and any disciplinary sanctions are almost never made public by the PGAT.

 

[Mel Smooth]

But in the article you linked to earlier Greg Norman is quoted as saying they're full for numbers. So either he's lying or the people saying that there will be an exodus are wrong. Both things can't be true.

Or they have agreements in place for current PGA players who are competing in the Fedex?

They are full for 2023, but that doesn’t mean that the player list for 2023 is the one that is currently listed by LIV.

 

[wjemather]

But Greg Norman said it’s all full now and they only have 48 spots and more players than spots already ?‍

Or are some of this players that currently filling spots going to be binned off ?

Surely it’s clear to see who is on the side of PGAT - all those members that are staying ? Even the likes of the JH Kim who it seems turned it all down and went to the PGA tour and now has earned his card

There are many current LIV participants who are contracted on an event-by-event basis or only for the remainder of this year. Judging by GN's comments, their places have apparently been filled for next year - we know one incoming is Bubba Watson, but we'll have to wait to find out who the rest are; sounds like some big names are nailed on to be among them though. Also makes sense that they'll need more than 48 players to account for potential absences; presumably, these will substantially be Asian Tour players.

 

[ColchesterFC]

Or they have agreements in place for current PGA players who are competing in the Fedex?

They are full for 2023, but that doesn’t mean that the player list for 2023 is the one that is currently listed by LIV.

The bit that most makes me think that Greg Norman is lying is the comment about still getting calls from the agents of top 40 players wanting to join but him saying it's too late. I don't believe for a minute that they would be knocking back those players to keep their current lineup - unless they're happy with having a second rate field of players. They've already shown that money is no object so they could easily pay off some of the lesser players to replace them with the top 40 players that he says are interested.

 

[hovis]

Cam Smith trending on Twitter saying that he and Leishman are signing for LIV after the Tour Championship.

He could be world #1 by then.

All of a sudden the liv tour isn't full of "has been wash outs"

 

[pokerjoke]

The bit that most makes me think that Greg Norman is lying is the comment about still getting calls from the agents of top 40 players wanting to join but him saying it's too late. I don't believe for a minute that they would be knocking back those players to keep their current lineup - unless they're happy with having a second rate field of players. They've already shown that money is no object so they could easily pay off some of the lesser players to replace them with the top 40 players that he says are interested.

However it’s not becoming 2nd rate
Bigger names joining
PGA getting weaker,hence 2nd tier players in fields lately.

 

[Mel Smooth]

The bit that most makes me think that Greg Norman is lying is the comment about still getting calls from the agents of top 40 players wanting to join but him saying it's too late. I don't believe for a minute that they would be knocking back those players to keep their current lineup - unless they're happy with having a second rate field of players. They've already shown that money is no object so they could easily pay off some of the lesser players to replace them with the top 40 players that he says are interested.

Yep, he could be - but he did also say that if a player that was right at the top of the game - so I guess we're looking at guys like Rory, Rahm, Scheffler, Smith etc, were interested in joining, they would look to see if they could accomodate them.

I'm not sure money is no object, they have a budget to work to - which was increased, but I'm not convinced there is a bottmless pit of money there for them to spend as they wish.

At some point, there needs to be a ROI for the PIF.

 

[Mel Smooth]

However it’s not becoming 2nd rate
Bigger names joining
PGA getting weaker,hence 2nd tier players in fields lately.

I think the LIV field is pretty impressive given the time it's been in existence. We've now got world renowned golfers competing in there, some of the most well known figures in the game.

 

[brendy]

Big year for Smith, up until this time last year he was nowhere near as popular or "current" , I think his relevance is slightly overplayed as he just comes across a bit bland and quiet. To me, if he goes, he goes, I wouldn't miss him as much as many others in the top ranks of the PGA/European tours.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

All of a sudden the liv tour isn't full of "has been wash outs"

If Cam Smith does go that would mean 8 out of the top 50 would be playing on the LIV

1 of the Top 10

The tour is still full of journeymen and guys on a last pay day

Yep, he could be - but he did also say that if a player that was right at the top of the game - so I guess we're looking at guys like Rory, Rahm, Scheffler, Smith etc, were interested in joining, they would look to see if they could accomodate them.

I'm not sure money is no object, they have a budget to work to - which was increased, but I'm not convinced there is a bottmless pit of money there for them to spend as they wish.

At some point, there needs to be a ROI for the PIF.

Of course there is a bottomless pit - they were offering Woods $700mil plus , the number already spent must be over a couple billion and players like Smith and Matsyuma won’t be cheap if the likes of BDC is getting $200mil- wasn’t the talk of $500mil plus for Matsyuama ?

 

[Deleted member 3432]

Big year for Smith, up until this time last year he was nowhere near as popular or "current" , I think his relevance is slightly overplayed as he just comes across a bit bland and quiet. To me, if he goes, he goes, I wouldn't miss him as much as many others in the top ranks of the PGA/European tours.

Other than Rory and Rahm not a single one of the top players have an once of charisma on the course.

As examples, Thomas and Cantlay are boring robots. You couldn't tell if they are 10 under or 10 over during a round. Good players sure but I wouldn't be particularly interested in watching them even if I watched much more golf.

Not surprising that the likes of Smith would go, as an Aussie he is playing golf on a different continent and different culture. As a non American very unlikely to have any loyalty to PGA Tour anyway, just a place to work

 

[pokerjoke]

If Cam Smith does go that would mean 8 out of the top 50 would be playing on the LIV

1 of the Top 10

The tour is still full of journeymen and guys on a last pay day



Of course there is a bottomless pit - they were offering Woods $700mil plus , the number already spent must be over a couple billion and players like Smith and Matsyuma won’t be cheap if the likes of BDC is getting $200mil- wasn’t the talk of $500mil plus for Matsyuama ?

Journeymen ?
Plenty on the PGA tour to.
It’s weakening every week,every time a big name leaves.
Lots are getting FOMO hence apparent contact by players management teams.

 

[Mel Smooth]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1557041486914527232

 

[Backsticks]

But in the article you linked to earlier Greg Norman is quoted as saying they're full for numbers. So either he's lying or the people saying that there will be an exodus are wrong. Both things can't be true.

They can be true. You are full. But absorb upgrades by selecting discards.

 

[Backsticks]

If Cam Smith is gone, that's tipping point alright. I hope they all go. I would be hoping all top 48 in the world sign up ready for next year, once they go through the motions of the Fedex Cup. PGAT still has a role as a joint second division with the European tour. But really need to move all the tournaments to the US. Putting them on in the far east or Aus is no good to us. I love my prime time TV that US time is perfect for.

 

[hovis]

No they haven't. Many just think they're

If Cam Smith is gone, that's tipping point alright. I hope they all go. I would be hoping all top 48 in the world sign up ready for next year, once they go through the motions of the Fedex Cup. PGAT still has a role as a joint second division with the European tour. But really need to move all the tournaments to the US. Putting them on in the far east or Aus is no good to us. I love my prime time TV that US time is perfect for.

It would be hilarious if liv ended up and sky and pgat was via YouTube ?

 

[Swango1980]

If Cam Smith is gone, that's tipping point alright. I hope they all go. I would be hoping all top 48 in the world sign up ready for next year, once they go through the motions of the Fedex Cup. PGAT still has a role as a joint second division with the European tour. But really need to move all the tournaments to the US. Putting them on in the far east or Aus is no good to us. I love my prime time TV that US time is perfect for.

Although, the top 48 won't necessarily be the best 48. Maybe, technically, they could be in a point in time. But, form has peaks and troughs, and players get over injuries. Also, some existing LIV players may be rapidly falling down the rankings. So, no idea who the "best" 48 players would actually be going into next season.

 

[Backsticks]

The bottom 15, or those no longer up to it like Phil dont really matter. If you have the top 20, and the bit of promotion relegation each year, the best will keep bubbling in there. I still woundnt be counting them a wins, as far as their career titles go though. But it will be high quality exhibition golf like the pro am that was in Ireland before the Open. Would be nice to see some new top American golf courses too.

 

[ColchesterFC]

They can be true. You are full. But absorb upgrades by selecting discards.

He said that they're full and it's too late with regards to the agents of the top 40 players calling him. If that's true then there can't be an exodus as they're full and it's too late. But I don't for one second think that if Scheffler/McIlroy/Rahm/Thomas/Hovland/Spieth etc wanted to move across to LIV that they would be told "Sorry, we're full, it's too late". Norman would be on TV announcing the signings before the ink was even dry on the contracts.