Competitions on 'Away' courses

[rulefan]

The gist of a post relating to a particular ISV prompted this query.
A club wishes to run a competition for its members on a another course. The club asks their ISV if this is possible. The ISV response is :-

"It is possible to run an "away" competition but with a Golf Union-imposed restriction.

The Golf Union restriction is that they will not allow "away" scores to be entered for handicapping purposes. You will need to process the competition as "not handicap counting".

This is a restriction written into the licence the Golf Union has provided to software suppliers."

There then follows a procedure to enter the full results, which requires that the competition indicates "The scorecard will show as "Not Handicap Counting".

Two questions.
1) How do other ISVs handle the situation?
2) How do the players' handicaps get updated?

 

[Old Skier]

The gist of a post relating to a particular ISV prompted this query.
A club wishes to run a competition for its members on a another course. The club asks their ISV if this is possible. The ISV response is :-

"It is possible to run an "away" competition but with a Golf Union-imposed restriction.

The Golf Union restriction is that they will not allow "away" scores to be entered for handicapping purposes. You will need to process the competition as "not handicap counting".

This is a restriction written into the licence the Golf Union has provided to software suppliers."

There then follows a procedure to enter the full results, which requires that the competition indicates "The scorecard will show as "Not Handicap Counting".

Two questions.
1) How do other ISVs handle the situation?
2) How do the players' handicaps get updated?

Is this a club holding a comp “Away” or members of a club taking part in a “Comp Away”. If it’s the former never heard of that, or is it a select few playing away?

 

[rulefan]

Is this a club holding a comp “Away” or members of a club taking part in a “Comp Away”. If it’s the former never heard of that, or is it a select few playing away?

The former. A largish group of players (eg the Seniors or Rabbits sections say) from a club are having an 'outing' at another club. They are playing a competition restricted to themselves but they want their scores to qualify for handicap adjustment. Each player could of course pre-declare their round as a General Play round but does seem a little silly.

 

[wjemather]

The gist of a post relating to a particular ISV prompted this query.
A club wishes to run a competition for its members on a another course. The club asks their ISV if this is possible. The ISV response is :-

"It is possible to run an "away" competition but with a Golf Union-imposed restriction.

The Golf Union restriction is that they will not allow "away" scores to be entered for handicapping purposes. You will need to process the competition as "not handicap counting".

This is a restriction written into the licence the Golf Union has provided to software suppliers."

There then follows a procedure to enter the full results, which requires that the competition indicates "The scorecard will show as "Not Handicap Counting".

Two questions.
1) How do other ISVs handle the situation?
2) How do the players' handicaps get updated?

Sounds like nonsense to me. If anything, I suspect it's more likely that ISVs are simply not able, or not permitted by license, to link to any course (marker) records in WHS other than the ones belonging to the club being serviced.

Presumably scores would need to be manually entered on the WHS Platform, or by players directly using whatever app works (e.g. MyEG). At least, this is my current thinking for our club trip comps later in the year.

 

[Old Skier]

The former. A largish group of players (eg the Seniors or Rabbits sections say) from a club are having an 'outing' at another club. They are playing a competition restricted to themselves but they want their scores to qualify for handicap adjustment. Each player could of course pre-declare their round as a General Play round but does seem a little silly.

Not really a club comp then also ISVs have no ability to select other courses, they could always add the course card to their ISV but then they would need to go through EG to get it activated, seems a lot of phaf when they could just do casual round.

 

[upsidedown]

The former. A largish group of players (eg the Seniors or Rabbits sections say) from a club are having an 'outing' at another club. They are playing a competition restricted to themselves but they want their scores to qualify for handicap adjustment. Each player could of course pre-declare their round as a General Play round but does seem a little silly.

We have an away Board comp over 2 days at 2 different courses and can see both courses are set up in ClubV1 , although they were postponed last year so guess added pre WHS

 

[rosecott]

We have an away Board comp over 2 days at 2 different courses and can see both courses are set up in ClubV1 , although they were postponed last year so guess added pre WHS

Pre-WHS (a very long time pre) I posed the relevant question to what was then the English Golf Union. Our Seniors wanted "Away Days" to be counted for handicaps. The response was an emphatic no, saying that clubs did not have the authority to hold qualifiers on any course other than their own course.

 

[upsidedown]

Pre-WHS (a very long time pre) I posed the relevant question to what was then the English Golf Union. Our Seniors wanted "Away Days" to be counted for handicaps. The response was an emphatic no, saying that clubs did not have the authority to hold qualifiers on any course other than their own course.

Interesting as the club has been doing it for over 20 years, I'll mention it.

 

[jim8flog]

The former. A largish group of players (eg the Seniors or Rabbits sections say) from a club are having an 'outing' at another club. They are playing a competition restricted to themselves but they want their scores to qualify for handicap adjustment. Each player could of course pre-declare their round as a General Play round but does seem a little silly.

They would not have to preregister

The Handicap Committee may consider a player to have pre-registered their
intent to submit an acceptable score for handicap purposes when playing an
authorized format of play in a regular, organized event with other players.

 

[rulefan]

That now would explain the originating ISV's information.
So our Rabbits will have to enter General Play scores but they could ask the away club to run it as a 'restricted' open

 

[jim8flog]

some of what has been said seems contrary to ethos of the WHS to me

2.1a Played in an Authorized Format of Play
Authorized formats of play are:
Format of Play Type of Round
Individual stroke Organized competition
Play

(i) Round Played Within a Player’s Jurisdiction. Subject to other provisions set
out within the Rules of Handicapping, an acceptable score from an
authorized format of play within a player’s home jurisdiction must be
submitted for handicap purposes (see Diagram 2.1a).

 

[rulefan]

They would not have to preregister

The Handicap Committee may consider a player to have pre-registered their
intent to submit an acceptable score for handicap purposes when playing an
authorized format of play in a regular, organized event with other players.

Not sure that an outing day could be considered regular

 

[jim8flog]

Not sure that an outing day could be considered regular

My understanding of English means the comma seperates regular and organised. It is why you see so many rules and contracts without a comma so there is no doubt.

 

[rulefan]

My understanding of English means the comma seperates regular and organised. It is why you see so many rules and contracts without a comma so there is no doubt.

Edited:

A comma in a list (normally) means the words are inclusive. So regular and organized

But when there are only two items in the list a comma should not be used but the words should be connected with the appropriate 'and' or 'or'. But given the 'normal' I suggest that the author of the rule intended 'and'.

 

[jim8flog]

Not sure that an outing day could be considered regular

The other question is how often is regular? Once every year could be considered regular.

 

[Deleted member 15717]

some of what has been said seems contrary to ethos of the WHS to me

2.1a Played in an Authorized Format of Play
Authorized formats of play are:
Format of Play Type of Round
Individual stroke Organized competition
Play

(i) Round Played Within a Player’s Jurisdiction. Subject to other provisions set
out within the Rules of Handicapping, an acceptable score from an
authorized format of play within a player’s home jurisdiction must be
submitted for handicap purposes (see Diagram 2.1a).

any chance of a link to the diagram.

I’m reading the ‘players home jurisdiction’ as being only the country the player has submitted fees for eg. Players at English Clubs can only submit scores at other clubs in England

 

[jim8flog]

any chance of a link to the diagram.

I’m reading the ‘players home jurisdiction’ as being only the country the player has submitted fees for eg. Players at English Clubs can only submit scores at other clubs in England

Rules of Handicapping Rule 2

It also has what has to be accepted from away jurisdictions.

 

[rulefan]

any chance of a link to the diagram.

I’m reading the ‘players home jurisdiction’ as being only the country the player has submitted fees for eg. Players at English Clubs can only submit scores at other clubs in England

 

[Deleted member 15717]

View attachment 36451

Ta.

the diagram wasn’t what I was expecting!

 

[rulefan]

But the issue is not the format of play or the 'acceptability' of scores but the fact that the ISVs license does not permit them to transmit such scores to the WHS.