The participation link doesn't half distort matters if the sport is played by people from either India or China.
Andy Murray Retiring Soon
- Thread starter ger147
- Start date
The number of tennis players worldwide has zero relevance on the barriers that brits have to it.
Golf is no more difficult to take up than tennis. How many free public courts are there now?
Plus Murray bloody moved to Barcelona. Not really what Timmy down the road can do.
Golf is no more difficult to take up than tennis. How many free public courts are there now?
Plus Murray bloody moved to Barcelona. Not really what Timmy down the road can do.
MegaSteve
Tour Winner
Well, Sir Steve has taken himself off to China to run their rowing program...
I agree with most of this post, and that's why Redgrave and Hoy aren't with the others in my Top 3 but I don't get the elitist perception of tennis?
Everyone has the chance to pick up a tennis racquet in the school playground, it's on the PE curriculum, many comp primary schools have after school clubs etc etc.
There's over 20 nations represented in the top 30 men's players, many of which aren't exactly the richest nations on earth.
Travel around Europe and many villages have free to play courts.
Happy to be enlightened, I just don't see how it can viewed as elitist and/or with barriers to enter?
Imo anyone may be able to have a go at school, but to take it up properly involves crazy money to the average family.
My work colleagues lad was the county champion aged 6 through to 9 and even then it was a lesson a week minimum at £40. Plus it was over 2hrs commute. I don't think many average families can cover that.
Change tennis for nearly every sport other than football in this country. Same result. Doesn't make it elitist.
That may be the case, but elitism has been used as a reason for discounting golf. I see a lot more kids playing golf than tennis.
Bunkermagnet
Journeyman Pro
Having done work at and for some of the staff at Queens, I can tell you elitism is firmly at the top of their tree. A commoner playing tennis, heavens forbid.
You can see that, but I'd suggest the participation numbers at junior level in this country aren't close between the sports. I'd give you very good odds if you think you can show 'a lot' more kids play golf than tennis 😉
There are free tennis courts all over the UK, and all over the world. It's a truly global game with little barrier to entry. That's what makes Murray one of our greatest athletes imo, certainly above any golfer, rower or velodrome cyclist
You can play tennis on dodgy school courts or municipal courts but to play it properly you have to join a club in this country. At that point it becomes as elitist as golf, perhaps more so as, sticking my neck out here, my perception is that there are far more golf clubs out there than tennis clubs.
I am happy to agree with your point about tennis on the continent. Drive around France, Holland, Belgium, Spain, others I'm sure, and good tennis courts available to use are easy to find and widely used by all ages. The elitist angle is more of a British issue.
I'll throw some other names in for some debate, Gareth Edward's, Jonny Wilkinson, Martin Johnson. Is rugby not widespread enough? Perhaps.
If Chris Froome wasn't Kenyan then he would have a great shout. A road cyclist, no barrier there.
Bobby Moore, Bobby Charlton?
Jimmy Anderson?
I am happy to agree with your point about tennis on the continent. Drive around France, Holland, Belgium, Spain, others I'm sure, and good tennis courts available to use are easy to find and widely used by all ages. The elitist angle is more of a British issue.
I'll throw some other names in for some debate, Gareth Edward's, Jonny Wilkinson, Martin Johnson. Is rugby not widespread enough? Perhaps.
If Chris Froome wasn't Kenyan then he would have a great shout. A road cyclist, no barrier there.
Bobby Moore, Bobby Charlton?
Jimmy Anderson?
I didn’t know of any free courts back home (Southampton) when growing up. Of course I didn’t have google then. But all I will say in regards to participation is that whilst playing golf at weekends or during summer. I’ve seen more kids on the course than on the courts when I drive to work.
But to be honest I really don’t think that it’s relevant when discussing the greats though if I’m honest. The very best in any sport make it due to them being the very best. If anything if a sport is more elitist then surely the odds of making it in said sport is even more likely as that’s another barrier to you making it in the first place.
Slime
Tour Winner
Steve Redgrave.
He won 5 golds over 5 Olympic Games ....................... but he never rowed alone, there was always someone else rowing with him.
Just saying.
Always a sign of your place in sport when even your peers are sad you are retiring https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/tennis/46854720
I hope he can have a good Australian open, but fear he's perhaps not in the best place mentally and his body won't be willing. I assume he's going to try and get to Wimbledon for the home farewell and glad he's going out now rather than doing something like Seve and trying to eek it out forever when his body was telling him it was over.
I don't know how you could ever define an ultimate sportsman as it's so subjective (perhaps makes top 100 courses look easy) but Redgrave still ranks up there in my mind, but acknowledge the likes of Hoy, Farah etc
I hope he can have a good Australian open, but fear he's perhaps not in the best place mentally and his body won't be willing. I assume he's going to try and get to Wimbledon for the home farewell and glad he's going out now rather than doing something like Seve and trying to eek it out forever when his body was telling him it was over.
I don't know how you could ever define an ultimate sportsman as it's so subjective (perhaps makes top 100 courses look easy) but Redgrave still ranks up there in my mind, but acknowledge the likes of Hoy, Farah etc
USER1999
Grand Slam Winner
Steve Redgrave.
He won 5 golds over 5 Olympic Games ....................... but he never rowed alone, there was always someone else rowing with him.
Just saying.
Yeah, but Steve just sat in the boat.
USER1999
Grand Slam Winner
#passenger.
You'll see what you want to see, in whatever environment you're in at a time. I didn't realise just how many houses had for sale signs outside until I was looking to buy a house. I didn't realise how many women were pregnant until my wife was etc etc. If you've never looked for free tennis courts, or kids playing tennis, then you'll never notice them. I'd wager you spend a vast amount of time around golf clubs in comparison to tennis clubs, so of course you'll see that. This is in no way a criticism by the way, just a nuance of life.
The 2nd paragraph is literally what I've been saying. Murrays achievements in a global sport with little barrier to entry should imo be regarded higher than similar achievements in elitist sports, or those with a small footprint. There's simply less people with the interest or inclination taking up those sports as a junior or competing as professionals.
I say all of this as someone with no history playing tennis at all, and if Wimbledon was shown on BT Sport I'd probably never watch a single minute of it. Nor am I in any way Scottish!
Whilst I clearly disagree, I can’t argue with with the argument you put forward and can see why you would find merits in it.
Tbh I’d not pay to watch tennis either, but I would do for golf. Does that make it a more relevant sport 😉😉
So he let the others do the real oar pulling?Steve Redgrave.
He won 5 golds over 5 Olympic Games ....................... but he never rowed alone, there was always someone else rowing with him.
Just saying.
.Good point, I forgot.
Jacko_G
Blackballed
This would have been so much simpler if people would just accept that Sir Andy is Britain's greatest ever athlete.
Just going round and round now.
Guys who sit in boats and on horses etc just don't cut the mustard.
Just going round and round now.
Guys who sit in boats and on horses etc just don't cut the mustard.
I am happy to agree that golf is better than tennis 😉ðŸ‘ðŸ»
