The all things EV chat thread

[PJ87]

I agree in part. The main challenge is people's attitudes won't change until real progress is seen outside of cities.

I live fairly rural and we should have 15 points within a 3 mile drive. Of those, 2 are always in use, 4 have never worked (at all) and 4 haven't even actually been installed.

My main concern, and the whole ICE cars have loads of parts argument, is that EVs don't. If my O2 sensor goes, I know what it is and I replace it. If my clutch goes, its just the clutch not the whole engine.
Most EVs that I have seen work on completely sealed single unit motors. If that goes its the whole thing that needs replaced .

It is improving, no one can deny. But the drawbacks and flaws need to be acknowledged on both sides, not just the selected side, in order for the argument to hold water.

There are clearly flaws on both sides however an important point people fail to acknowledge is that we need to change , oil is running out long term, we are on verge of climate disaster

Yet people won't make a switch unless it is to something exactly the same as they have now

Another one is meat. People love meat and if came a time we had to stop eating it people won't adoppt a change to make sure the world actually survives because it's inconvenient

Not saying we should do either .. but a slight adaptation of lifestyle compromise to get something that will benefit the planet

 

[Mandofred]

In this area.....looks good on a map....in reality, not so good. Chargers that are only good if you stay at a hotel....or a restaurant etc. IT IS getting better.....no doubt about it.
Give me this....minimum....
1. 200 mile range.....minimum....no doubt about it. Heat on.....radio on.....lights on......driving like zombies are after me.
2. 90% charge in 30 min or LESS.
3. PLENTY of charge points.....EASY to find charge points..........People want convenience, not a treasure hunt. Convenience......really really convenient.....not anywhere near that yet.

Maybe in 5 years....can't see it until then. Hoping new battery improvements will keep things getting better.

I'm a fan...really.....next car I buy I'm hoping will be electric. But not yet.

 

[GreiginFife]

There are clearly flaws on both sides however an important point people fail to acknowledge is that we need to change , oil is running out long term, we are on verge of climate disaster

Yet people won't make a switch unless it is to something exactly the same as they have now

Another one is meat. People love meat and if came a time we had to stop eating it people won't adoppt a change to make sure the world actually survives because it's inconvenient

Not saying we should do either .. but a slight adaptation of lifestyle compromise to get something that will benefit the planet

I don't think anyone is saying we don't need to change. We are constantly reminded that we need to change. Change won't happen without people being brought along "on the journey" so to speak, simply instructing and then being evangelical about it won't get people to change, especially if the support needed to change doesn't really exist.

Of course people want uninterrupted transition, why would they not if it's not an autonomous change?

I sense you live in or around a city where the infrastructure probably isn't too bad. And that's fair enough. But we can't assume that everyone's usecase is the same just because something works for us.

I wouldn't suggest you buy a 500HP car just because I like it and think it's fun.

 

[PJ87]

I don't think anyone is saying we don't need to change. We are constantly reminded that we need to change. Change won't happen without people being brought along "on the journey" so to speak, simply instructing and then being evangelical about it won't get people to change, especially if the support needed to change doesn't really exist.

Of course people want uninterrupted transition, why would they not if it's not an autonomous change?

I sense you live in or around a city where the infrastructure probably isn't too bad. And that's fair enough. But we can't assume that everyone's usecase is the same just because something works for us.

I wouldn't suggest you buy a 500HP car just because I like it and think it's fun.

Whilst I do live near a city with good charges etc I have the home charger

Also those without the living in big cities more likely to have a driveway no?

Home chargers are brilliant for it

Full tank every morning

I charge every 2-3 days but can charge nightly if I wish. Takes but ,30 seconds to set up

 

[PNWokingham]

There are clearly flaws on both sides however an important point people fail to acknowledge is that we need to change , oil is running out long term, we are on verge of climate disaster

Yet people won't make a switch unless it is to something exactly the same as they have now

Another one is meat. People love meat and if came a time we had to stop eating it people won't adoppt a change to make sure the world actually survives because it's inconvenient

Not saying we should do either .. but a slight adaptation of lifestyle compromise to get something that will benefit the planet

just catching up on these 52 pages! I am guessing you are on the side of an electric car rather than a nice raspy v8?

 

[PJ87]

just catching up on these 52 pages! I am guessing you are on the side of an electric car rather than a nice raspy v8?

Don't mind either sides decision it's just when people come up with complete drivel (either outdated about ev) or silly reasons it will never work just to avoid the elephant in the room

 

[bobmac]

I can't really see many people on here disagreeing that the infrastructure is improving. Its just not fast enough if they want to push an agenda. 5000 additional charge points nationwide in 5 months isn't good enough to support the kind of demand that will be needed.

There has been a worldwide pandemic over the last 15 months or so which may have slowed things down a touch.

I've said this all along, EV's aren't for everyone.
If you can charge at home or at work and you only do 100-200 miles a week, they are perfect for commuting and the school run. Others with longer journeys aren't catered for yet but there's years to go before the ban on NEW ICE CAR SALES and prices will get to the point where buying electric is just the better deal.
As far as the evangelist label......
Evangelists preaching is based on a story book written by bronze aged goat herders over 2000 years ago.
My opinions are drawn from science and facts, not religion so maybe a different label could be used because religous is one thing I am not.

 

[GreiginFife]

Whilst I do live near a city with good charges etc I have the home charger

Also those without the living in big cities more likely to have a driveway no?

Home chargers are brilliant for it

Full tank every morning

I charge every 2-3 days but can charge nightly if I wish. Takes but ,30 seconds to set up

See, these are the assumptions that pro-EV people make. I have a driveway but there are 9 or 10 houses in the same street that don't and are on-street. This is replicated in many small villages where space to build was maximised at the expense of things like driveways.

Many mining cottages in our villages are on-street with even little garden space.

As I said before, it works for YOU. But we simply cannot assume that there is a way that it will work for everyone without the investment to rapidly improve the infrastructure.

There is the secondary issue that charging takes time. If I forget to charge and need to do this when I am out, the convenience isn't there. As an example, I went to Tesco on Wednesday night. There was a black Leaf in one of the charge bays when I went in. When I came out 40 mins later it was still there. If someone was needing that charge point, tough titty.
I went over to get petrol, was in, paid and out in less than 3 minutes.

Now I'm not saying charging needs to be that quick, but sitting waiting 40+ minutes on even accessing a charge point is not giving it a positive glow at all.

 

[GreiginFife]

There has been a worldwide pandemic over the last 15 months or so which may have slowed things down a touch.

I've said this all along, EV's aren't for everyone.
If you can charge at home or at work and you only do 100-200 miles a week, they are perfect for commuting and the school run. Others with longer journeys aren't catered for yet but there's years to go before the ban on NEW ICE CAR SALES and prices will get to the point where buying electric is just the better deal.
As far as the evangelist label......
Evangelists preaching is based on a story book written by bronze aged goat herders over 2000 years ago.
My opinions are drawn from science and facts, not religion so maybe a different label could be used because religous is one thing I am not.

I like EVs and the theory behind them, I think they are the future. Not just because we are banning ICEs but because technology is allowing it to become more adaptable for driving. But it's just not there as a complete package.

I'm not sure that you were references as an evangelist. This term was used generally for people that cannot see the wood for the trees, of which I am certain you are not in this category.

There are years to go, and I am sure it will improve but the pace needs to increase in order for it to be viable to people who don't like in cities and don't have this convenient charge at home.

It's another of those circular arguments, much like whether dress codes need to change and I can't add much more than I have. I like EVs and will get one when a) cost to own a reasonable large and not ugly car comes down and b) there is sufficient infrastructure to make owning one not be a complete ball ache of planning charging cycles so that I don't find myself either 1) stranded in the middle of nowhere or 2) waiting half of my day in queues for charge points.

 

[PJ87]

See, these are the assumptions that pro-EV people make. I have a driveway but there are 9 or 10 houses in the same street that don't and are on-street. This is replicated in many small villages where space to build was maximised at the expense of things like driveways.

Many mining cottages in our villages are on-street with even little garden space.

As I said before, it works for YOU. But we simply cannot assume that there is a way that it will work for everyone without the investment to rapidly improve the infrastructure.

There is the secondary issue that charging takes time. If I forget to charge and need to do this when I am out, the convenience isn't there. As an example, I went to Tesco on Wednesday night. There was a black Leaf in one of the charge bays when I went in. When I came out 40 mins later it was still there. If someone was needing that charge point, tough titty.
I went over to get petrol, was in, paid and out in less than 3 minutes.

Now I'm not saying charging needs to be that quick, but sitting waiting 40+ minutes on even accessing a charge point is not giving it a positive glow at all.

Forgetting to charge becomes not a thing tho , just stick the cable in when you get home

Fair enough

Supermarkets need more chargers for sure

Lampost chargers look a very good way around off street

 

[GreiginFife]

Forgetting to charge becomes not a thing tho , just stick the cable in when you get home

Fair enough

Supermarkets need more chargers for sure

Lampost chargers look a very good way around off street

Seems that lamppost charging has been talked about for years with little to no progress. If they cracked that nut then it would vastly improve people's response.

Whilst it's highly unlikely that I would forget to charge and run out of juice in a journey, the issue remains that it could happen and, like your house going on fire, it only needs to happen once for it to cause a real problem.

I appreciate that I could run out of petrol, but it's infinitely easier to rectify that as it stands than if I was stranded with no electrical charge.

 

[bobmac]

Seems that lamppost charging has been talked about for years with little to no progress. If they cracked that nut then it would vastly improve people's response.

Whilst it's highly unlikely that I would forget to charge and run out of juice in a journey, the issue remains that it could happen and, like your house going on fire, it only needs to happen once for it to cause a real problem.

Evs are too expensive Got it
The charging infrastructure isn't there yet. Gotcha
You need more range. Ok
Can't charge at home. Right

The boffins know all this and are working hard to improve things, it will just take time.
I only have two requests....
Can all ice cream vans be converted from diesel to electric please.
We've got no idea what these little kids are breathing in when they're queing for their 99.
Ditto for school buses.

I appreciate that I could run out of petrol, but it's infinitely easier to rectify that as it stands than if I was stranded with no electrical charge.

 

[GreiginFife]

Evs are too expensive Got it
The charging infrastructure isn't there yet. Gotcha
You need more range. Ok
Can't charge at home. Right

The boffins know all this and are working hard to improve things, it will just take time.
I only have two requests....
Can all ice cream vans be converted from diesel to electric please.
We've got no idea what these little kids are breathing in when they're queing for their 99.
Ditto for school buses.



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We agree on that then, It will take time. As all technology changes do.

I get that the RAC can charge. Do you know what the average call out time for the RAC in general is? Also I need to be a member, no? Or are they going to offer this out of the goodness of their corporate soul?

Bob, I get it you love EVs and that's great. As I say, I like them too. But in order for technology (of any sort) to be successful, it needs to be fully supported. Not partially, it'll be fine in a few years, supported. This, ultimately is the other "elephant in the room" that the pro-EV lobby won't accept but focus on the other "elephant" that is we need to change.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

From £40110 so will attract the £310 road tax surcharge (vehicles over £40000).

Ouch ?. Not the road tax, the £40k.

 

[USER1999]

Forgetting to charge becomes not a thing tho , just stick the cable in when you get home

So why do people run out of charge on their phones? All the time?

Because they forget to charge them. Do I? No. But loads do.

 

[PJ87]

So why do people run out of charge on their phones? All the time?

Because they forget to charge them. Do I? No. But loads do.

Because they are constantly on them and never put them down?

Where as your car once your done for day are you going to check that email, take it off charge to make a call. No once it's in plug it in unless u need to go somehwere

 

[BiMGuy]

I agree it's pish that a group of 7 new charging points at a petrol station can't be kept working, and I assume the red light instead of the green one indicates it cant be used, when a brand new installation.

So you don't actually know if they are working or not?

 

[BiMGuy]

So why do people run out of charge on their phones? All the time?

Because they forget to charge them. Do I? No. But loads do.

Just like people forget to put petrol or diesel in their cars an run out.

 

[Bunkermagnet]

So you don't actually know if they are working or not?

You assume not because the access light is showing red......whereas when they are showing green you must assume they are.
That would be common sense reasoning......yes?

 

[Blue in Munich]

Sorry but bunker comes back with points every few weeks that are just pish

Last time it was sensors failing on cars .. like.ice don't have them

This time is constant chargers out of use .. like a petrol garage is never closed (one on the 406 was closed the entire pandemic)

There is plenty wrong with ev which is being addressed but what need to change the most is people's attuides toward change ..

Maybe what needs to change is the plenty wrong with ev, and when that happens people's attitude towards them will change.