World Handicap System

[rulefan]

Golf Australia have a Daily Scratch Rating which has been operating for a few years.
It is not known how similar this will or will not be to the WHS formula. But feel free to pick out the bones in this.

http://www.golf.org.au/default.aspx...au/site/_content/document/00015547-source.pdf

THe EGA also has a feature

Computed Buffer Adjustment
The USGA Course Rating Manual states: “The USGA Course
Rating and Slope Rating must reflect conditions normal for the
season(s) when most rounds are played”. However, sometimes
rounds are played when neither the weather nor the course
conditions are normal and yet, within the EGA Handicap System,
these rounds directly affect handicaps. The Computed Buffer
Adjustment (CBA) calculation has been developed to determine
those occasions when the conditions deviate so far from normal
that, for handicapping purposes, an adjustment must be made to
compensate.

 

[clubchamp98]

The WHS isn't the same as the USGA system, although it shares most of the principles.

The tweaks apply to them as well, ie fundamentally there will be the one system.

The tweaks create the questions...

're you second para you won't have a fixed handicap of 5, you will have as handicap index (say 5) which will be converted to a course handicap depending on the course and tee ratings. A handicap index of 5 will produce a course handicap of between 2 and 7. Same for your 10 index opponent (his parametersnwill be 7 and 14) so depending on the course and tees you compete on you may be giving 5, 6 or 7 shots to him.

However, I suspect your reference was more to do with quickly shifting handicap index calculations - there are already (in the USGA system) restrictions on how far and how fast handicaps can move; the materialmreferenced at thenstart of this thread makes it clear that this principle will be retained (and probably enhanced).

Is it right - Well as the fundamental principles the USGA system is to handicap for form rather than proven capability it would arguably be exactly right...but even the USGA were starting to move away from this and the WHS 'camel' seems to be quite comfortable with the premise that your handicap will be 'the average of the best 8 from the last 20 adjusted as we think fit'

jeez I think that will cause some head scratching in Most clubhouses.

I will need a night school course to sort that out.

I would reference the made up rules thread when trying to explain this to your op on the First tee.

”yes I know you are off 5 but we’re playing off the whites so you are off 7 and instead of me being off 10 I am off 14 today , so I get 7 shots instead of 5.”

I can’t see that going down to well and will be another nail in the coffin of some players not playing in knockout comps.

 

[upsidedown]

jeez I think that will cause some head scratching in Most clubhouses.

I will need a night school course to sort that out.

I would reference the made up rules thread when trying to explain this to your op on the First tee.

”yes I know you are off 5 but we’re playing off the whites so you are off 7 and instead of me being off 10 I am off 14 today , so I get 7 shots instead of 5.”

I can’t see that going down to well and will be another nail in the coffin of some players not playing in knockout comps.

Doesn't quite work like that !!

Using the USGAv table http://www.fsga.org/files/cm/Handicapping/Slope Charts.pdf

Handicap index 5.4 9.5

Slope 113 5 10

Slope 123 6 10

Slope 133 6 11

Slope 143 7 12

 

[rulefan]

jeez I think that will cause some head scratching in Most clubhouses.

I will need a night school course to sort that out.

I would reference the made up rules thread when trying to explain this to your op on the First tee.

”yes I know you are off 5 but we’re playing off the whites so you are off 7 and instead of me being off 10 I am off 14 today , so I get 7 shots instead of 5.”

Why does it need explaining? You both look at the simple chart. There will be one by the tees, in the proshop and/or locker room.

It will be even easier than the one in the post above as it will only relate to the tees at that course.

Or even use this

http://www.usga.org/course-handicap-calculator.html

 

[duncan mackie]

Doesn't quite work like that !!

Using the USGAv table http://www.fsga.org/files/cm/Handicapping/Slope Charts.pdf

Handicap index 5.4 9.5

Slope 113 5 10

Slope 123 6 10

Slope 133 6 11

Slope 143 7 12

Not sure what you mean by doesn't quite work like that? Those are the correct figures for the top and bottom slope ratings (as the ones you illustrate obviously are are for the ratings you have shown)

 

[upsidedown]

Not sure what you mean by doesn't quite work like that? Those are the correct figures for the top and bottom slope ratings (as the ones you illustrate obviously are are for the ratings you have shown)

It was in reply to clubchamp98 illustrating how it affects a 5 and 10 handicaps in matchplay.

The middle ones are correct too from the table linked .

 

[duncan mackie]

It was in reply to clubchamp98 illustrating how it affects a 5 and 10 handicaps in matchplay.

The middle ones are correct too from the table linked .

Still confused by what you meant - he was quoting the figures I had produced at the extremes, and if his quoted white tees were rated 155 rather than, say, ones they normally played from rated at 113, the words he used would be accurate.

I accept that there aren't a lot of 155 rated courses/tees - but in principle...

 

[upsidedown]

Still confused by what you meant - he was quoting the figures I had produced at the extremes, and if his quoted white tees were rated 155 rather than, say, ones they normally played from rated at 113, the words he used would be accurate.

I accept that there aren't a lot of 155 rated courses/tees - but in principle...

Sorry hadn't seen your post that he was quoting. I used the 4 different scenarios as they would cover most courses that we are likely to encounter in the UK. Argee there are not many around at 155

 

[clubchamp98]

Sorry hadn't seen your post that he was quoting. I used the 4 different scenarios as they would cover most courses that we are likely to encounter in the UK. Argee there are not many around at 155

So you lads who know what you are doing get confused by a table of h/caps what chance mere mortals.

It just seems to me all the changes lately have not exactly been good for the low men.
As nearly all changes in the last couple of years mean a scratch man is just giving more shots everytime he tees up.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

So you lads who know what you are doing get confused by a table of h/caps what chance mere mortals.

It just seems to me all the changes lately have not exactly been good for the low men.
As nearly all changes in the last couple of years mean a scratch man is just giving more shots everytime he tees up.

Not strictly true - the 90% Rule has helped our Cat 1 when it comes to 4BBB Stableford for example - normally would lose a shot but yesterday I played off my HC where as anyone other 5 lost shots

If you are good enough you will still win - any changes over the past 12-24 months haven’t changed the people winning the comps

 

[upsidedown]

So you lads who know what you are doing get confused by a table of h/caps what chance mere mortals.

.

No not confused at all Just didn't read the question properly I also highlighted the more than likely scenario a 5 and 10 handicapper would encounter.

 

[rulefan]

It just seems to me all the changes lately have not exactly been good for the low men.
As nearly all changes in the last couple of years mean a scratch man is just giving more shots everytime he tees up.

Not the WHS then.

But have you bothered to find out how the USGA rating and slope systems work?

 

[clubchamp98]

No not confused at all Just didn't read the question properly I also highlighted the more than likely scenario a 5 and 10 handicapper would encounter.

My only gripe really is when these changes occur I never seem to give anyone less shots.
It seems the powers that Be are helping the high cappers as much as they can .

 

[clubchamp98]

Not the WHS then.

But have you bothered to find out how the USGA rating and slope systems work?

Yes I use it quite regularly , it works there because they have five or six tees so you can pick your slope difficulty.
At my club we have two , but we play all comps from the whites you don’t have a choice.

 

[upsidedown]

My only gripe really is when these changes occur I never seem to give anyone less shots.
It seems the powers that Be are helping the high cappers as much as they can .

And rightly so if it encourages more people to take up the game . Hopefully the new system will take care of the rapidly improving golfer and thus less shots given for matchplay. Yes it's a challenge sometimes giving away lots of shots but us low guys should win more thn we lose and when we do lose , well, well done to the other guy.

Probably why I enjoy County seniors golf so much , you get a great buzz beating someone off 2-3 when you're a 5 Are you playing much this year ?

 

[garyinderry]

Do this new system have a slight flaw in it?


It works well if everyone tries their best in each round. Does it fall down if there are loads of players who essentially give up on their rounds after they have a few bad holes.

There is loads of these types of players. Head goes down and dont push to score the best they can on the day.

They will have a pile of awful cards and then a cracker when they eventually play well and keep it going.

Their average scores won't be representative of their scoring ability.

 

[clubchamp98]

And rightly so if it encourages more people to take up the game . Hopefully the new system will take care of the rapidly improving golfer and thus less shots given for matchplay. Yes it's a challenge sometimes giving away lots of shots but us low guys should win more thn we lose and when we do lose , well, well done to the other guy.

Probably why I enjoy County seniors golf so much , you get a great buzz beating someone off 2-3 when you're a 5 Are you playing much this year ?

Tore my left ankle ligaments three weeks ago , going stir crazy at home.
Played nine holes on Sunday , just can’t get through the ball onto left side so blocking everything right.

I played scratch league golf for twenty years , not played much in the seniors as we play on the Maxitour midweek .

Dont you think the system is a bit skewed , everyone seems to think low cappers play well all the time but we don’t.

3/4 to full handicap
3/4 to 90% even in 4BBB.

It just seems the lads who work on their game to get better are not getting any help.

The last couple of years I have been thrashed by 12/14/15 cappers in the knock out as they can play the game but I am giving 7/9/10. By the way I played quite well in all these games.
Its put me off now .
Under this new system that could be more shots, but will never be less!

 

[patricks148]

My only gripe really is when these changes occur I never seem to give anyone less shots.
It seems the powers that Be are helping the high cappers as much as they can .

Just thought i would make the point i was told by an R&A member. The change is about helping low handicappers. How so you ask? At the moment most of the top Am comps in the world are dominated by US players. on the whole they have much lower handicaps due to their system and most of our players get balloted out of some of these. with these changes it will allow UK players to get just as low. and now find it easier to get into these and the ranking points that come with. Apparently

 

[rulefan]

The last couple of years I have been thrashed by 12/14/15 cappers in the knock out as they can play the game but I am giving 7/9/10. By the way I played quite well in all these games.
Its put me off now .
Under this new system that could be more shots, but will never be less!

The CONGU stats show that 55% of handicap matches are won by the lower handicapper. You must be the exception or are getting older

 

[rulefan]

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