WHS working well for me

[patricks148]

7 of my best 8 are now from this year, a new low for me after Fridays seniors at Tain of 3.1, but in reality I'm not a 3 handicap by any stretch of the imagination, under the old system id still be of 5, maybe 4 ish.

 

[PJ87]

7 of my best 8 are now from this year, a new low for me after Fridays seniors at Tain of 3.1, but in reality I'm not a 3 handicap by any stretch of the imagination, under the old system id still be of 5, maybe 4 ish.

is that a 3 index tho giving you a course handicap of 5 ish?

 

[PJ87]

Many of us like routine. And it is disruptive when routines are forced to change because we feel we are losing control.

Some people of course love change and new things, and are great at looking forward to new opportunities and new schemes to get started.

My suspicion is that golf clubs members will tend to the former rather than the latter.

ironically golfers are most likely to not be in control. especally of their ball

 

[rosecott]

I personally like it. However I listened to Rick shiels postcast and the lady who was head of the change was on there and gave a good understanding

Guess it's down to a what people read up on and b the information from handicap secs

Ours is terrible. I mean the comp this week was Thursday and we still don't know the results / round not entered into whs which has to be done by midnight no?

You have no idea why the comp was not closed and have nevertheless condemned your Handicap Secretary. We had an evening "qualifier" on Wednesday. I was unable to finalise the competition on Wednesday. One player registered 30 points for the 9 holes which clearly had to be questioned and, as most people would have guessed he had entered Stableford points instead of gross scores. Another player, when contacted, was adamant that he had entered his scores online - the software showed next day that his score was entered at 9.26 on the day after the comp.

In my experience, that kind of thing is a regular occurrence. I don't know about other ISVs but Handicapmaster had already uploaded all the rest of the scores to WHS immediately after they were posted online. All the scores, including a corrected score for the 30 points claimant, were therefore in WHS long before midnight but the comp result could not be finalised until the next day.

Don't lose sight of the reality that Handicap Secretaries are pretty well all volunteers, have to deal with such situations, and do have a life outside of golf.

 

[PJ87]

You have no idea why the comp was not closed and have nevertheless condemned your Handicap Secretary. We had an evening "qualifier" on Wednesday. I was unable to finalise the competition on Wednesday. One player registered 30 points for the 9 holes which clearly had to be questioned and, as most people would have guessed he had entered Stableford points instead of gross scores. Another player, when contacted, was adamant that he had entered his scores online - the software showed next day that his score was entered at 9.26 on the day after the comp.

In my experience, that kind of thing is a regular occurrence. I don't know about other ISVs but Handicapmaster had already uploaded all the rest of the scores to WHS immediately after they were posted online. All the scores, including a corrected score for the 30 points claimant, were therefore in WHS long before midnight but the comp result could not be finalised until the next day.

Don't lose sight of the reality that Handicap Secretaries are pretty well all volunteers, have to deal with such situations, and do have a life outside of golf.

Thing is this isn't the first thing with the handicap sec

He doesn't have a clue about whs . The info he sends out is incorrect.. didn't tell people what to put on the card handicap wise.. even tho clear advice says course handicap .. he is putting out put playing handicap ..

We can now do cards via ig but he insists on the cards being handed it anyways even tho that defeats the objective of modernization

Our group sticks to using eg and doesn't bother with him anymore as you wait and wait then incorrect information

The general manager said from 17th may white tees back open all comps from the whites

On 10th June handicap sec emails out we looking to open white tees.. no mention of when.. so no idea if we played off the correct white tees or not

We have app features he doesn't use which would keep the majority of members informed

He has posted out comp results with the incorrect winner a few times then had to correct

So yes..he is useless


Oh and my fav. Doesn't agree with the course rating thinks it's too low .. so is emailing out to members that it's wrong and it will be challenged

 

[rulefan]

Oh and my fav. Doesn't agree with the course rating thinks it's too low .. so is emailing out to members that it's wrong and it will be challenged

It would be interesting to see his rating report vs the rating team's report. Out of interest, what is the length and current rating?

 

[PJ87]

It would be interesting to see his rating report vs the rating team's report. Out of interest, what is the length and current rating?

Slope or course?

Slope whites 121 yellows 117

Course rating 74.2 yellow 71.8

Distance white 7122 yellow 6633

His talks about rating is all about slope

The massive miss understanding that slope is difficulty

I've emailed him about it a few times but he still continues that we were rated wrong

 

[rulefan]

Even allowing for many tricky objects on the course (bunkers, penalty areas, high stimp greens etc) 74.2 is at the top end for the whites. 71.8 is not at all low for the yellows.
Good luck with his challenge

 

[PJ87]

Even allowing for many tricky objects on the course (bunkers, penalty areas, high stimp greens etc) 74.2 is at the top end for the whites. 71.8 is not at all low for the yellows.
Good luck with his challenge

Well he insists the slope is too low even tho it's only low because we punish stratch and bogey golfers the same .. isn't it the difference between anyways?

 

[patricks148]

no index of 3 playing 3, for some reason at ours once you are below 5 index and playing handicap are the same[/QUOTE]

 

[jim8flog]

I presume your slope is somewhere around the mid 120s then.

Vey similar where I play. At 10.7 I only go up (effectively) by 1

 

[patricks148]

I presume your slope is somewhere around the mid 120s then.

Vey similar where I play. At 10.7 I only go up (effectively) by 1

Once you are above 5 you start getting extra shots , but the higher you get the more shots it looks like you get,. The slope is 134. I can only assume they think its easier or lower handicaps, which it is if you are long, but I'm not and the new layout is effectively 3 shots harder for me now than the old layout, the 3 par 5s i have to lay up on the young guys blast it over, used to be able to at least try and get on in two

 

[Deleted member 3432]

7 of my best 8 are now from this year, a new low for me after Fridays seniors at Tain of 3.1, but in reality I'm not a 3 handicap by any stretch of the imagination, under the old system id still be of 5, maybe 4 ish.

I'm in exactly the same situation as you with 7 out of 8 and going to be down to borderline of CH of 3 after this morning. Never got close to 3 under old system, always between 4 and 5.

In a better place than the start of the season when I had a CH of 7

 

[rulefan]

no index of 3 playing 3, for some reason at ours once you are below 5 index and playing handicap are the same

[/QUOTE]
The Slope would have to be pretty low to not have a variance (unless there is a difference between the CR and Par in Scotland). As you are in Scotland that is likely to be the reason.

CH = HI x (Slope/113) {Scotland} + (CR - Par)

 

[badgergm]

As you feel its reasonable there is nothing to stop you asking your comp committee to adopt your idea as a term of entry.

True, but even if I did, and it was accepted, it wouldn’t solve the problem. The person could be playing in opens, or be playing in inter club matches, etc.
The point is that the system should not allow it.

 

[Biggleswade Blue]

Yes. However would be a better reflection

With three cards it is already the lowest that counts, after adjustment down for any blow-out holes, with a further -2 adjustment. So it’s already 2 shots lower than the adjusted best of your three cards. Doesn’t seem excessively generous to me.

The principle of the new system is to make the game more accessible. Asking for more cards to get started makes it less accessible.

If clubs are bothered about this kind of thing maybe they could put limits on some comps. But clubs can’t want more members, more people playing the game, and in the same breath, make it harder for people to get started.

 

[PJ87]

With three cards it is already the lowest that counts, after adjustment down for any blow-out holes, with a further -2 adjustment. So it’s already 2 shots lower than the adjusted best of your three cards. Doesn’t seem excessively generous to me.

The principle of the new system is to make the game more accessible. Asking for more cards to get started makes it less accessible.

If clubs are bothered about this kind of thing maybe they could put limits on some comps. But clubs can’t want more members, more people playing the game, and in the same breath, make it harder for people to get started.

With handicaps becoming easier to get after July (golf England nomad handicap) almost anyone can sign a card now

So getting more cards in wouldn't be that much of an ask

 

[Biggleswade Blue]

With handicaps becoming easier to get after July (golf England nomad handicap) almost anyone can sign a card now

So getting more cards in wouldn't be that much of an ask

Everyone’s circumstances are different. For some you are right but for others, who perhaps don’t play quite as often, some who are learning so don’t want to register every round as they will be being coached round and trying new things, and perhaps some who are finding it a bit harder to meet people to sign a card for them (especially with reduction of roll-ups) 8 rounds could take a while.

Would 8 rounds make a difference? I’ve just played my 7th. My index after 7 is actually 2.3 higher than it was after 3, as I’ve not got any substantially better rounds in after my 3, and lost the -2 adjustment.

It’s a good discussion and the points you are making are interesting. From my end of (in)experience, I think the system is pretty good and I can’t see the increased number of cards requirement before being allowed to compete making much difference.

 

[badgergm]

With three cards it is already the lowest that counts, after adjustment down for any blow-out holes, with a further -2 adjustment. So it’s already 2 shots lower than the adjusted best of your three cards. Doesn’t seem excessively generous to me.

The principle of the new system is to make the game more accessible. Asking for more cards to get started makes it less accessible.

If clubs are bothered about this kind of thing maybe they could put limits on some comps. But clubs can’t want more members, more people playing the game, and in the same breath, make it harder for people to get started.

The difference in accessibility is very marginal IMO. I don’t believe that most new starters to the game expect to have a handicap that is equally valid to experienced golfers after just thee cards.
And that marginal benefit is not worth it when compared with the disadvantages of increasing the number of occurrences where competitors have manifestly incorrect handicaps, thus rendering the competition unfair for experienced golfers.

 

[badgergm]

Everyone’s circumstances are different. For some you are right but for others, who perhaps don’t play quite as often, some who are learning so don’t want to register every round as they will be being coached round and trying new things, and perhaps some who are finding it a bit harder to meet people to sign a card for them (especially with reduction of roll-ups) 8 rounds could take a while.

Would 8 rounds make a difference? I’ve just played my 7th. My index after 7 is actually 2.3 higher than it was after 3, as I’ve not got any substantially better rounds in after my 3, and lost the -2 adjustment.

It’s a good discussion and the points you are making are interesting. From my end of (in)experience, I think the system is pretty good and I can’t see the increased number of cards requirement before being allowed to compete making much difference.

With respect to finding it hard to get people to sign a card - but such people should be able to play alongside competitors, and get a card in that way. Just that they can’t win competitions until they have a handicap worthy of the name. reasonable and inclusive IMO.