WHS Handicap Index - Finally Revealed

[Swango1980]

I'm confused, when you did your Course handicap calculations, did you get the courses mixed up:

Royal Portrush has a higher Slope that your course, if I am reading that graphic correctly.

So, your course (whites) has a slope of 121. so course handicap = 22
Blues at Portrush, Slope of 134, so your course handicap = 24
Whites at Portrush, Slope of 127, so your course handicap = 23

Interestingly, the Slope is still not overly high at Royal Portrush compared to most, I'd say its slope is around average, likely because it is a tough test for Scratch Golfers, and therefore the high Course Rating (your course is also tough for scratch golfers, as CR is still quite high).

However, if you played somewhere like Forest Pines, Course Rating is only 0.5 over par, but it is a tough test for bogey golfers, with a Bogey Rating of 101.2 (I can confirm this, played there a fair bit). This results in a slope of 149, and you'd have a handicap there of 27. So, although Forest Pines would be an easier course for the scratch golfer compared to Royal Portrush, or even your course, it is much tougher for bogey golfers. Therefore, higher handicappers will get more shots at Forest Pines than the other 2.

 

[PJ87]

I'm confused, when you did your Course handicap calculations, did you get the courses mixed up:

Royal Portrush has a higher Slope that your course, if I am reading that graphic correctly.

So, your course (whites) has a slope of 121. so course handicap = 22
Blues at Portrush, Slope of 134, so your course handicap = 24
Whites at Portrush, Slope of 127, so your course handicap = 23

Interestingly, the Slope is still not overly high at Royal Portrush compared to most, I'd say its slope is around average, likely because it is a tough test for Scratch Golfers, and therefore the high Course Rating (your course is also tough for scratch golfers, as CR is still quite high).

However, if you played somewhere like Forest Pines, Course Rating is only 0.5 over par, but it is a tough test for bogey golfers, with a Bogey Rating of 101.2 (I can confirm this, played there a fair bit). This results in a slope of 149, and you'd have a handicap there of 27. So, although Forest Pines would be an easier course for the scratch golfer compared to Royal Portrush, or even your course, it is much tougher for bogey golfers. Therefore, higher handicappers will get more shots at Forest Pines than the other 2.

If I out my figures in it says I'm 24 at mine off whites

Done on this site

https://www.usga.org/course-handicap-calculator.html

 

[Swango1980]

If I out my figures in it says I'm 24 at mine off whites

Done on this site

https://www.usga.org/course-handicap-calculator.html

Something has gone wrong somewhere when using that site. Your course has a slope of 121. Your Index is 20.2. So, your Course Handicap = 20.2 x 121 / 113 = 21.6 (i.e. 22)

 

[PJ87]

Something has gone wrong somewhere when using that site. Your course has a slope of 121. Your Index is 20.2. So, your Course Handicap = 20.2 x 121 / 113 = 21.6 (i.e. 22)

So you don't use the sites and add the course ratings aswell as slope?

 

[Swango1980]

So you don't use the sites and add the course ratings aswell as slope?

Ahh, I think I know what has happened here. The site you used is for the USA. In their Course Handicap Calculator, they also include the difference between Par and CR. We do not. So, don't use the USGA app

 

[PJ87]

Ahh, I think I know what has happened here. The site you used is for the USA. In their Course Handicap Calculator, they also include the difference between Par and CR. We do not. So, don't use the USGA app

So basically just get your index .. times by slope and divide by 113?

 

[Swango1980]

Ahh, I think I know what has happened here. The site you used is for the USA. In their Course Handicap Calculator, they also include the difference between Par and CR. We do not. So, don't use the USGA app

Note, if the courses were in USA, and using their app, you would play off:

Your Course (Whites) = 24
Your Course (Yellows) = 21
Portrush (Blues) = 27
Portrush (Whites) = 22

 

[Swango1980]

So basically just get your index .. times by slope and divide by 113?

Correct. And that will tie up with the charts at each club. The Apps you are directed to use (such as howdidido) will no doubt do this for you as well (no idea what they will look like yet, but still ages to go, just over a week)

 

[azazel]

Remember the calculation principles are quite different. Ratchet vs Average. If all the 'old' national systems produced the same answer there would have been no reason to change.

Yeah, I get the differences and don't have any particular issue with the new system, just a bit of a curiosity that as my index goes down my course and playing handicap goes up even though they're all based on the same course. I guess my better than average scores generally aren't as far below the average as my higher ones are higher, if that makes sense?!
We'll see what happens when/if Scottish golf use CSS rather than course rating for the differentials and anything else the next few days may bring.

 

[PJ87]

Correct. And that will tie up with the charts at each club. The Apps you are directed to use (such as howdidido) will no doubt do this for you as well (no idea what they will look like yet, but still ages to go, just over a week)

We all in my group had a look at our index's on golf England last night and it does sound a bit mad

The 13.9 handicapper is now off index 7.8
The 20 handicapper is now off index 14.5
Mine was 25.4 now 20.2
The 16.7 handicapper is now 11.5

So I've lost 3 shots playing handicap off whites
The 14 is now playing 8
The 20 is playing 16
The 17 is playing 12

Seems like the slope or index is wrong

Think the slope is low tbh it's a tough course

 

[Swango1980]

We all in my group had a look at our index's on golf England last night and it does sound a bit mad

The 13.9 handicapper is now off index 7.8
The 20 handicapper is now off index 14.5
Mine was 25.4 now 20.2
The 16.7 handicapper is now 11.5

So I've lost 3 shots playing handicap off whites
The 14 is now playing 8
The 20 is playing 16
The 17 is playing 12

Seems like the slope or index is wrong

Think the slope is low tbh it's a tough course

How many scores have WHS been able to use to calculate each players Index? At my club, those who will end up with a course handicap of 2 or more less than Congu, had only a few scores submitted since Jan 2018.

 

[azazel]

Ahh, I think I know what has happened here. The site you used is for the USA. In their Course Handicap Calculator, they also include the difference between Par and CR. We do not. So, don't use the USGA app

The R&A online calculator seems to take into account the difference between par and CR, no?

 

[Swango1980]

The R&A online calculator seems to take into account the difference between par and CR, no?

I've not seen it, but just googled it. It gives you the option whether you want that bit included or not before you get started. It needs to, as the R&A is applicable worldwide, not just UK

 

[azazel]

I've not seen it, but just googled it. It gives you the option whether you want that bit included or not before you get started. It needs to, as the R&A is applicable worldwide, not just UK

Ah, so you reckon that, while the R&A site gives you the option to include that calculation, it isn't going to be implemented here?

 

[PJ87]

How many scores have WHS been able to use to calculate each players Index? At my club, those who will end up with a course handicap of 2 or more less than Congu, had only a few scores submitted since Jan 2018.

Not many cards mine is 7 plus my joining cards (if you include the 9 hole comps) 4 just normal 18 holes

6 cards seems about average

 

[Swango1980]

Ah, so you reckon that, while the R&A site gives you the option to include that calculation, it isn't going to be implemented here?

It definitely won't be implemented in the UK.

 

[jim8flog]

Yes, just got my friend to check, and he got same message

So, basically, unless e-mail addresses and DOD are on WHS platform, golfers will get no further than this.

So, who is going to type all these manually? Who is going to wait until the ISV send this information to WHS, like they were supposed to?

I know tis was a yesterday post but just spotted this

DOD Did you not clean the handicap database of the deceased.

 

[YandaB]

The R&A online calculator seems to take into account the difference between par and CR, no?

It looks like it gives you the option with the helpful hint: "you may or may not be required to include Course Rating and Par in this calculation. Check with the golf club, the Committee or the Authorised Association", a simple drop down of which country you are to be playing in would be better imho.

 

[Swango1980]

Not many cards mine is 7 plus my joining cards (if you include the 9 hole comps) 4 just normal 18 holes

6 cards seems about average

That is probably a big reason why then

Firstly, the joining 3 cards were probably completely ignored (they were last week anyway, but not checked if they have rectified that). So, if you only have 7 cards in, it only takes the average of your lowest 2 scores to get Index. If 6, it takes average of lowest 2 and subtracts 1. So, if you only have a few scores, your best card could result in quite a low index. As you submit more cards, this should hopefully refine itself into something more "accurate"

 

[azazel]

It definitely won't be implemented in the UK.

Grand, thanks.