WHS and par/bogey comps

[Colin L]

I know that, but I'm not sure how that helps in terms of ensuring that as far as possible your handicap matches your proven ability. More counting rounds, particularly in competition would help that.

No disagreement that keeping up a steady return of scores is essential to maintaining a handicap index that reflects current ability. The question really is whether the "scores" in certain formats are reliable. In my limited world of club golf, all my social games are matchplay and that is a bit limiting. I tried returning a general play score from a bounce four ball match - holing everything out. It wasn't too bad but you have to consider that I'm not a particularly competitive person or a good enough golfer to have a quiver of shots to choose from depending on the situation. There is a serious tactical limitation in looking at a GPS watch, guessing a club and then hitting and hoping. In short, keeping a proper score in a match isn't likely to affect my gameplay or strategy. You can't affect that which doesn't exist.

 

[rulefan]

How exactly would you determine what score you would use for updating your handicap index after a match where your opponent conceded after 10 holes or where you conceded holes after your opponent scored in net eagles?

There are procedures for that under WHS that are there not, which other countries have taken up. /QUOTE]
So MLS or NDB is a legit alternative to actual scores in the latter case?

 

[wjemather]

How exactly would you determine what score you would use for updating your handicap index after a match where your opponent conceded after 10 holes or where you conceded holes after your opponent scored in net eagles?

MLS and the usual holes not started (nett par or par+1) procedures would be used to determine hole scores to be recorded for concessions and unplayed holes.

 

[rulefan]

MLS and the usual holes not started (nett par or par+1) procedures would be used to determine hole scores to be recorded for concessions and unplayed holes.

I understand that but I wonder how realistic the outcome would be on the day, when the player knows the outcome of each hole not finished.

 

[AdamC28]

Sounds like I’ve messed up today. On 2 or 3 occasions I picked up as soon as I knew I had a minus. Seems I should have putted out as this would have a negative effect for handicap purposes.

 

[Old Skier]

We were getting my fourball to hole out as though it was a medal round even if the hole was lost. Only exception was one guy who went OOB and then we couldn't find the provisional despite only just rolling off the fairway so he put zero for that hole. Much more realistic score towards handicapping that way

If this is a team comp scores are not admissible for HC purposes.

 

[Colin L]

If this is a team comp scores are not admissible for HC purposes.

I expect Homer meant that each player holed out. After all, each would have had to pre-register.

 

[doublebogey7]

I understand that but I wonder how realistic the outcome would be on the day, when the player knows the outcome of each hole not finished.

Are you suggesting golfers may be less than honest in this situation, or have I misread you?

 

[rulefan]

Are you suggesting golfers may be less than honest in this situation, or have I misread you?

No. It's just that knowing that you will be given a predetermined score doesn't mean that you would have made that score if you had played out. You may have got par on the holes not played.

 

[doublebogey7]

No. It's just that knowing that you will be given a predetermined score doesn't mean that you would have made that score if you had played out. You may have got par on the holes not played.

Isn't net par the score you are given for a score not played?

 

[wjemather]

No. It's just that knowing that you will be given a predetermined score doesn't mean that you would have made that score if you had played out. You may have got par on the holes not played.

Adding net pars (+1) for unplayed holes in match play would be no different to how a stroke play round that is abandoned early or a scaled up 9-hole score is treated.

 

[rulefan]

Isn't net par the score you are given for a score not played?

Adding net pars (+1) for unplayed holes in match play would be no different to how a stroke play round that is abandoned early or a scaled up 9-hole score is treated.

I didn't mention net par.

 

[wjemather]

I didn't mention net par.

Yes, you implied NDBs should be added for unplayed holes(?), which isn't what would happen.

 

[Old Skier]

I expect Homer meant that each player holed out. After all, each would have had to pre-register.

If I misunderstood @HomerJSimpson post then I apologies but it seemed to suggest it was a ream event to me.

 

[Colin L]

If I misunderstood @HomerJSimpson post then I apologies but it seemed to suggest it was a ream event to me.

Sorry, my response was a bit cryptic. What I meant was that you can individually play out a general play round within a four ball match. In the match you obviously use your better ball and concessions can be taken, but for your card you have to hole out even though the putt was conceded or you were out of the hole for any reason. You need a marker and if the occasion arose you would have to apply stroke play rules with regard to your score for handicapping.
Can be done, but I would be dubious about doing it in a competition match. But that's mainly to do with my capacity to carry two thoughts in my head at the same time.

 

[rulefan]

Yes, you implied NDBs should be added for unplayed holes(?), which isn't what would happen.

"You may have got par on the holes not played."

Where is the implied NDB?

 

[wjemather]

"You may have got par on the holes not played."

Where is the implied NDB?

#22 "So MLS or NDB is a legit alternative to actual scores in the latter case?"

 

[rulefan]

#22 "So MLS or NDB is a legit alternative to actual scores in the latter case?"

My last post was referring to a player who may have parred if play had continued as opposed to the default awarded because his opponent had conceded.

 

[wjemather]

My last post was referring to a player who may have parred if play had continued as opposed to the default awarded because his opponent had conceded.

But NDB never comes into it, unless MLS resolves that is the most likely score.
Also, in #29 you stated "You may have got par on the holes not played"; from what you have said since, did you mean "holes started not completed"?

 

[Black Buzzer]

I'm having a bit of a conversation with my club about this. Either we're playing match play against the course or we're playing stroke play. If I have a ten footer for a half I want to be having a go at it, not dribbling it down close to make sure I still get a handicap score. To do anything else makes a nonsense of the competition. SO - Rule 21.3. Have a read of it and see whether you agree with me. It says in as many words that the player is encouraged to pick up as soon as they have lost the hole. You pick up, mark either a 0 or any score that means you lose the hole, and move on. It also says, explicitly, that there is no penalty for marking an incorrect hole score where that score would have no effect on the result of the hole played (Exception to Rule 3.3b). You lose the hole, mark a net bogey, and move on to the next hole. It means you can have a go at a putt for a half as you would do at match play and still play a handicap round. Otherwise you may as well play another boring stableford. No, I'm no fun at parties.