The Footie Thread

[clubchamp98]

It’s amusing the level of excuses across social media today but it’s time the media should say it how it is

England who are supposed to be one of the favourites and ranked 4th in the World played against the 3rd lowest in the competition and it was on home soil and they were set up to not lose - pathetic really

Once again all hype and no substance

The squad they have should be playing so much better with so many bright attacking flair players - the sort of players that have helped the likes of France , Holland etc do well over the years , the sort of players England havent ever had but now they arrive they employ a manager who hasnt the first clue what to do with them

He plays a flat back four with 2 defensive midfielders sat in front - fine but then the fullbacks who should have a license to go forward because of the two sitting players very rarely venture past the halfway line, the “attacking mid” drops into the centre more because the centre forward spends all game dropping deep - that ends up leaving two “wider” players isolate and they then start to drop deeper as well. It’s shocking tactics and set up - as well as playing players who have struggled a lot recently whilst the form players sit and bench warm , glad TAA isn’t there , he would be so frustrated to have the ball and then look and see no England player in the box to deliver the ball too.

And then during the actual game the players just play on the defensive , allow Scotland to dictate the game and a young CM who still doesn’t play regualry is allowed to dominate the middle of the park. There was a stat that a player for Slovakia has more shots on target than England - he has also only played as a substitute ?. Also when looking to make a change early he brings off one of the brighter players and then puts on someone who should be allowed to roam is then put out wide - only an excellent performance from Pickford saved England being embarrassed . Look at the way Adams played - why was Kane not showing the same level of passion and desire , he should also give up the armband - awful currently

England have done enough to qualify but they are going to get a battering from a top team when they face them

Against Czech Rep it should be time to unleash the players

Pickford

James
Mings
Stones
Chilwell

Rice/Henderson
Mount
Grealish

Foden
DCL
Sancho

Stop playing to ensure they don’t concede and take the game to the opposition. The recent World Cup masked how poor Southgate is as a top level manager. Seen Howe mentioned- at least he plays attacking football and has done well at the top level - Southgate was poor as a Prem manager as well and got very lucky to get the England job. Behind all the hype of “coming home” and waistcoat - it’s the same old overhyped England when they should really be dangerous in this competition because of the players they have.

TAA is used to seeing nobody in the box every week as Firmino is so deep that he’s never there.
You argue that’s fine every time I say we need a striker.
But your not happy with Kane doing what Firmino does because it’s Klopps way of playing.
That’s a bit strange .

 

[Deleted member 15344]

TAA is used to seeing nobody in the box every week as Firmino is so deep that he’s never there.
You argue that’s fine every time I say we need a striker.
But your not happy with Kane doing what Firmino does because it’s Klopps way of playing.
That’s a bit strange .

Kane and Firmino are two different type of players playing two different roles in the team - TAA has people like Mo and Mane in the box regularly filling the space that Bobby has created dragging the CB out.

After 4/5 years I would expect you to at least understand the way the front three work and why Klopp doesn’t play with an “number 9” which essentially what Kane is supposed to be and should be for England because the rest of the team isn’t flooded with other goalscorers

 

[nickjdavis]

I don’t disagree with anything you say, but some of it is more down to attitude than passion.

Pulling on that England shirt should provide all the passion anyone would need.

Well...we think the same way but perhaps the difference between us and those that pull on the shirt is that we're not earning tens if not hundreds of thousands of pounds a week. I can imagine that it might be difficult to show such desire and passion, attitude, when, lets face it....your pretty much set for life in your mid 20's.

 

[clubchamp98]

Kane and Firmino are two different type of players playing two different roles in the team - TAA has people like Mo and Mane in the box regularly filling the space that Bobby has created dragging the CB out.

After 4/5 years I would expect you to at least understand the way the front three work and why Klopp doesn’t play with an “number 9” which essentially what Kane is supposed to be and should be for England because the rest of the team isn’t flooded with other goalscorers

Phil I have seen over the years TAA and Robbo with their hands on their heads because they have space and time to cross but there is nobody in the box.
If you havnt seen it then I am suprized.
Firmino is hardly ever in the box , he’s always trying to make ground up that’s why his goal scoring record is ok for a midfielder but bad for a striker.
Kane is doing the same thing and looks very poor atm.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Phil I have seen over the years TAA and Robbo with their hands on their heads because they have space and time to cross but there is nobody in the box.
If you havnt seen it then I am suprized.
Firmino is hardly ever in the box , he’s always trying to make ground up that’s why his goal scoring record is ok for a midfielder but bad for a striker.
Kane is doing the same thing and looks very poor atm.

Because Firmino is essentially playing as a deep lying forward/false 9/attacking mid as opposed to a striker/number9 in the box type players.

Surely by now you understand how Klopp sets up the team and how Firmino plays and his role in it ?‍

He is not there as primarily a goalscoring striker - you must know that

 

[Slime]

I have said me piece re England to both Paul and Slime, but this current style of play is depressing me. As a City fan Ave an NVQ degree in rammel football. Maybe I have been spoilt watching “ the beautiful game under Mancini, Pelligriin and Pep. And as much as I point a finger at Southgate. It’s his employers the Fa who really twist my Tash.

That's fair enough and I accept that entirely.
Having gone from Fergie to Moyes, Van Gaal and Mourinho, watching Southgate's England just isn't as depressing for me as it is for you ........................ and many others, it would seem.
I'm already looking forward to the game on Tuesday.

 

[clubchamp98]

Because Firmino is essentially playing as a deep lying forward/false 9/attacking mid as opposed to a striker/number9 in the box type players.

Surely by now you understand how Klopp sets up the team and how Firmino plays and his role in it ?‍

He is not there as primarily a goalscoring striker - you must know that

Yes I do but I would prefer a striker it’s just my opinion.
But you have basically criticised Kane fo doing what Firmino does every week.
Saying TAA would have nobody in the box to cross to is just like every week in a Liverpool shirt imo of course.
The difference in the England team is we are so defensive minded the midfield players don’t get ahead of Kane so the box really is empty when he drops in.
But if he has been told to be a no9 striker what’s he doing in his own half looking forward to empty space where HE should be.
He should be dropped as your only as good as your last game and he was crap.

 

[Val]

Can I just check in case I missed anything, how many did Scotland win by? Cold light of day, still didn't score, only have 1 point, have to beat Croatia or will be going home. For all the euphoria is getting a point in a nil nil against England really the height of ambitions?

Fully agree with all of the comments re England already posted. Gareth, dust your waistcoat off, unshackle the players.

Anyone still suggesting Pickford doesn't deserve his place? Another solid performance in an England shirt.

Scotland didn't score or win, however England are one of the tournament favourites, playing at home and were outplayed by a team who haven't played at a major tournament for 23 years so maybe you'll forgive our euphoria for a minute. Alternatively you could go back to showing videos of a goal from 1996 at Wembley.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

Scotland didn't score or win, however England are one of the tournament favourites, playing at home and were outplayed by a team who haven't played at a major tournament for 23 years so maybe you'll forgive our euphoria for a minute. Alternatively you could go back to showing videos of a goal from 1996 at Wembley.

We are only one of the favourites via bookies as England fans lump on every tournament and they have to protect themselves. No one really gives us a chance. I'm fine with euphoria but the reaction was as though Scotland had won the tournament. Be like that if you beat Croatia and qualify. That would be success, not a 0-0. I hope you get through

I'm equally bored with replays of the gazza goal but that has only been shown as it was the last time we'd met in a tournament. Thankfully it has disappeared from our screens now ?

 

[clubchamp98]

We are only one of the favourites via bookies as England fans lump on every tournament and they have to protect themselves. No one really gives us a chance. I'm fine with euphoria but the reaction was as though Scotland had won the tournament. Be like that if you beat Croatia and qualify. That would be success, not a 0-0. I hope you get through

I'm equally bored with replays of the gazza goal but that has only been shown as it was the last time we'd met in a tournament. Thankfully it has disappeared from our screens now ?

I am sick of seeing that goal.
The media hype is the problem.
They hyped the game up so much but in the end it was a poor game.
I was in East Renfrewshire GC when we beat the Dutch 4-1 and a Scot was blaming us for letting them score.
It was pointed out that Scotland were out because they only scored one goal.
They still seem to have that problem!

 

[Slime]

I am sick of seeing that goal.
The media hype is the problem.
They hyped the game up so much but in the end it was a poor game.
I was in East Renfrewshire GC when we beat the Dutch 4-1 and a Scot was blaming us for letting them score.
It was pointed out that Scotland were out because they never scored even one goal.
They still seem to have that problem!

Chips and shoulders?

 

[davidy233]

I am sick of seeing that goal.
I was in East Renfrewshire GC when we beat the Dutch 4-1 and a Scot was blaming us for letting them score.
It was pointed out that Scotland were out because they never scored even one goal.
They still seem to have that problem!

I think you'll find that Scotland beat Switzerland that night - without scoring? That's impressive

 

[clubchamp98]

I think you'll find that Scotland beat Switzerland that night - without scoring? That's impressive

I was celebrating coming fourth at east REN.
Have edited to give the Scots the credit they deserved in scoring one goal in three games.
But it was still England’s fault for letting the Dutch score.

 

[rudebhoy]

I was celebrating coming fourth at east REN.
Have edited to give the Scots the credit they deserved in scoring one goal in three games.
But it was still England’s fault for letting the Dutch score.

to be fair, I was watching that game in pub in Leeds with some English mates, and they were delighted when the Dutch scored to knock Scotland out!

 

[Orikoru]

Croatia were bang average in Russia and have got worse since to be honest. They reached the final with two pen shoot outs and beating us in extra time after we let them off the hook in the first half. I think as bad as England were last night, Croatia were even worse in both their games so far. I fully expect Scotland to do them on Tuesday and hope they do.

Taking a reflective mood on England after passions ran high, finishing second is a better run to the final and more games away from Wembley untill the semi finals, thus less pressure. No doubt we'll win Tuesday and finish top now

Results wise Southgate has done a good job, however with the players at his disposal it's the bare minimum. We really have no style and no clear game plan. You've got 5 subs and the highest quality bench in the tournament and you don't use it? He's too scared to make a big call and get it wrong. The same will happen in the knock outs when it really counts. Hope I'm wrong and he switchs it up or gets it spot on tactically.

I agree with your comments on Southgate. He's insipid and passive, and totally wasting our fantastic attacking options by stifling the whole team with his fear of losing. I've felt this about him from day one, he was well overrated after we scraped into a world cup semi thanks to an unprecedentedly easy knock-out draw. I personally don't think it's much of a benefit to finish 2nd as we'll still face France or Germany just one round later anyway I believe. And I think winning the groups actually builds you a bit of momentum if anything. Confidence is not exactly going to be high it we can't beat Czech Republic either.

 

[Orikoru]

We are only one of the favourites via bookies as England fans lump on every tournament and they have to protect themselves. No one really gives us a chance. I'm fine with euphoria but the reaction was as though Scotland had won the tournament. Be like that if you beat Croatia and qualify. That would be success, not a 0-0. I hope you get through

I'm equally bored with replays of the gazza goal but that has only been shown as it was the last time we'd met in a tournament. Thankfully it has disappeared from our screens now ?

Agreed on England's "favourites" tags. It's only due to idiots lumping on at the bookies. In reality France, Portugal, Germany and Belgium all have better squads, arguably Italy as well.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

Agreed on England's "favourites" tags. It's only due to idiots lumping on at the bookies. In reality France, Portugal, Germany and Belgium all have better squads, arguably Italy as well.

It isn't just about better squads is it? It's about having a plan of style, a team dna. That definitely puts the Italians ahead of us, I'd argue the Dutch as well, in addition to those you have mentioned. Now Gareth could put his waistcoat on next game, discover his mojo and unleash the attackers and all will be different. If not then it will be a very short tournament for us, irrespective of any odds on paddy power etc.

 

[Beezerk]

It isn't just about better squads is it? It's about having a plan of style, a team dna. That definitely puts the Italians ahead of us, I'd argue the Dutch as well, in addition to those you have mentioned. Now Gareth could put his waistcoat on next game, discover his mojo and unleash the attackers and all will be different. If not then it will be a very short tournament for us, irrespective of any odds on paddy power etc.

The tactics in the last game were terrible, it felt like I was watching a training session. Foden getting the ball and passing it back straight away despite being in a good position to have a go at the fb. It was all over the pitch, barely anyone with a positive movement. That must have come from the manager, stifling players rather than trusting them to play their own game.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

The tactics in the last game were terrible, it felt like I was watching a training session. Foden getting the ball and passing it back straight away despite being in a good position to have a go at the fb. It was all over the pitch, barely anyone with a positive movement. That must have come from the manager, stifling players rather than trusting them to play their own game.

Totally agree. The fullbacks were another great example of this. Shaw and James are both excellent at overlapping and whipping crosses in yet both turned back over and over. They must have been told possession was everything and that just took over, smothering all creativity.

 

[IanM]

Italy not bothered about the Wales game by the look of it