The Footie Thread

[GB72]

60/40 GS for me.
But the players should have spoken up by now if there not happy!

In a small way at least one did. Saka clear at his press conference that he was not the solution at LB and what does Southgate do Yes, it was politely worded but that is pretty much as close as a players gets these days to criticising a manager's plan/

 

[Orikoru]

Saka hasn’t been anything special here though. Imo.
Palmer has created more in his small cameos.

I think they're both great players and swapping one for the other won't necessarily make a massive difference if the tactical system hasn't changed and there's still nobody operating on the left hand side.

 

[clubchamp98]

In a small way at least one did. Saka clear at his press conference that he was not the solution at LB and what does Southgate do Yes, it was politely worded but that is pretty much as close as a players gets these days to criticising a manager's plan/

Yes but Gomez has played 15 times as LB for Liverpool last season while Robbo was injured.
Did anyone tell GS this , just dosnt make sense.
I was expecting Saka to give a penalty away with a “ forwards tackle”

He only did it not to take Saka off but get Palmer on.

 

[clubchamp98]

I think they're both great players and swapping one for the other won't necessarily make a massive difference if the tactical system hasn't changed and there's still nobody operating on the left hand side.

Yes we need Gordon to provide some width and a threat down the left.
Trippier hasn’t provided that threat ( not his fault btw)

 

[Orikoru]

Yes but Gomez has played 15 times as LB for Liverpool last season while Robbo was injured.
Did anyone tell GS this , just dosnt make sense.
I was expecting Saka to give a penalty away with a “ forwards tackle”

He only did it not to take Saka off but get Palmer on.

Funnily enough, I thought that was the only reason he made the squad, otherwise I couldn't see the point of him being in it. Surely a decent chance he plays there against Switzerland now.

Yes we need Gordon to provide some width and a threat down the left.
Trippier hasn’t provided that threat ( not his fault btw)

Southgate doesn't seem to rate Gordon, seeing as he's only given him about two minutes so far. Even though he's the only left winger in the squad. I figured maybe we could play Saka out there and he might play as a traditional winger, going outside the full back, while Palmer does the job on the right. But our squad is a lacking in left-sided options. Still baffles me that Grealish wasn't taken.

 

[harpo_72]

The Trippier substitution was required, Saka playing left back was an intermediate fix.. Had it gone wrong would we see Gomez ..Nah.
I do believe the team are responsible for what is going on, on the field.
They were static or hiding behind their markers. But also you can argue the balls were not played to them to turn on.
The defensive line lacked discipline- offside is a deterrent and a skill ( Franco Baressi - was a master of the line) .
Trippier is a play stopper in left back, he needs to come back on the right foot. But he should have whipped balls the right wing to create a run .. balls to space turn it in to a foot race and they also turn a team the other direction.

Is GS responsible for all of this .. well yes he picks the team and he lays out the tactics and he supports by bringing in the changes .. but he should have been screaming about the running , slapped stones for being a dozy plonk, and reminded them about the offside trap .. I think he did tell Walker John Terry was sitting next to his girlfriend

 

[GB72]

Yes but Gomez has played 15 times as LB for Liverpool last season while Robbo was injured.
Did anyone tell GS this , just dosnt make sense.
I was expecting Saka to give a penalty away with a “ forwards tackle”

He only did it not to take Saka off but get Palmer on.

I agree. That was just the nearest I have seen to a player criticising Southgate if only in a roundabout way. If we had lost last night, I am sure that the soundbites about that being a bad idea would have come out.

 

[Arthur Wedge]

Saka hasn’t been anything special here though. Imo.
Palmer has created more in his small cameos.

Saka has been poor but he also needs a target - the main target most of the time is sat deep in midfield

 

[Swango1980]

Saka has been poor but he also needs a target - the main target most of the time is sat deep in midfield

I thought Kane had stayed up higher for most of the game yesterday, compared to previous games. Yet he seemed even more anonymous, if that was possible. If Saka was running in behind defences, then Kane dropping deep may not be too bad (except Bellingham and Foden also want to be in those positions). Although, probably not much room for any winger to run in behind, against teams that are defending deep.

Kane dropping deep is possibly also a symptom of the defence dropping so deep. If they pushed up higher, everyone else can push up higher.

For me, it is difficult to blame any individual player, because they all seem to be playing a system that Southgate wants them to play. I was critical of TAA playing in the 1st 2 games, but not blaming HIM for the England performances. I was blaming Southgate, and I think it was unfair on TAA to play him in midfield. Had Southgate found a way to get TAA as an attacking right wing back, then we all know he can be dangerous there. I think Palmer would be better than Saka at this stage, simply because I think Palmer is more dangerous, especially to deep defending teams. And I'd like to see Gordon out on the left, try a different dynamic out there. I know he hasn't tested it previously, but it must be worth a try now. At end of day, he is always welcome to make in game changes if that doesn't work out, unless he is wedded to making subs very late on in the game.

 

[Orikoru]

I thought Kane had stayed up higher for most of the game yesterday, compared to previous games. Yet he seemed even more anonymous, if that was possible. If Saka was running in behind defences, then Kane dropping deep may not be too bad (except Bellingham and Foden also want to be in those positions). Although, probably not much room for any winger to run in behind, against teams that are defending deep.

Kane dropping deep is possibly also a symptom of the defence dropping so deep. If they pushed up higher, everyone else can push up higher.

For me, it is difficult to blame any individual player, because they all seem to be playing a system that Southgate wants them to play. I was critical of TAA playing in the 1st 2 games, but not blaming HIM for the England performances. I was blaming Southgate, and I think it was unfair on TAA to play him in midfield. Had Southgate found a way to get TAA as an attacking right wing back, then we all know he can be dangerous there. I think Palmer would be better than Saka at this stage, simply because I think Palmer is more dangerous, especially to deep defending teams. And I'd like to see Gordon out on the left, try a different dynamic out there. I know he hasn't tested it previously, but it must be worth a try now. At end of day, he is always welcome to make in game changes if that doesn't work out, unless he is wedded to making subs very late on in the game.

Exactly. You can't blame the players and say other players would do better, really - the system itself clashes and doesn't function properly. The system is supposed to allow players to perform their best and I don't think it does. Foden next to Bellingham is a clash, because Foden drifts inside and they get in each other's way. Then when Kane doesn't receive the ball from anyone he drops deep looking for it and he's in that area as well. As you say, Trent and Trippier didn't impress, but because they were just doing their best in a position that is wrong for them. But we've said all this after all four games and it hasn't changed yet so it's getting boring now.

 

[Neilds]

Exactly. You can't blame the players and say other players would do better, really - the system itself clashes and doesn't function properly. The system is supposed to allow players to perform their best and I don't think it does. Foden next to Bellingham is a clash, because Foden drifts inside and they get in each other's way. Then when Kane doesn't receive the ball from anyone he drops deep looking for it and he's in that area as well. As you say, Trent and Trippier didn't impress, but because they were just doing their best in a position that is wrong for them. But we've said all this after all four games and it hasn't changed yet so it's getting boring now.

So it is Southgate’s fault that Foden and Bellingham can’t see each other and end up in the same position? They are both player of the year in their respective leagues and should be able to do the basics

 

[PJ87]

Exactly. You can't blame the players and say other players would do better, really - the system itself clashes and doesn't function properly. The system is supposed to allow players to perform their best and I don't think it does. Foden next to Bellingham is a clash, because Foden drifts inside and they get in each other's way. Then when Kane doesn't receive the ball from anyone he drops deep looking for it and he's in that area as well. As you say, Trent and Trippier didn't impress, but because they were just doing their best in a position that is wrong for them. But we've said all this after all four games and it hasn't changed yet so it's getting boring now.

A simple change that would work wonders if he insists on keeping the same line up (bar suspension) is to tell Kane to stop dropping back into midfield. Without Saka and someone else (Gordon) he is useless coming back to release runners as they release and have nobody to hit.

It worked better when toney came on and he was that target when kane dropped back.

Telling kane to stop trying to be the play maker will work wonders. This isn't like when he had son to feed at spurs. He is the focal point he needs to just cause trouble in the box.

We don't have the width to play with him dropping back ATM.

 

[PJ87]

So it is Southgate’s fault that Foden and Bellingham can’t see each other and end up in the same position? They are both player of the year in their respective leagues and should be able to do the basics

It is his fault that it's happening and he doesn't do something to fix it sooner

Dropping Bellingham back to next to rice and allowing foden to be the 10 or taking foden off and putting on eze / Gordon or palmer .. all solutions to this problem

 

[Rlburnside]

Anyone who knows which way the opposition goal is and passes it in that direction!

 

[Rlburnside]

So Bellingham could be banned for grabbing his crotch

 

[Tashyboy]

Am struggling to understand how we appreciate how smaller teams are well organised and well drilled, yet when it comes to England, it’s the players faults coz they are players of the year. Just a thought, but maybe they are players of the year in different positions to what Southgate expects them to play for England.
I still don’t understand why Foden is not in the middle of the park alongside Bellingham and Rice. If Rice needs another defensive player alongside him in Gallagher, TAA, Or Mainoo there is something seriously wrong. That frees up the wing for an other.
Point is GS has come no where near to trying it.

 

[Tashyboy]

So Bellingham could be banned for grabbing his crotch

Sat on the couch doing exactly the same, could be on for an infraction.

 

[PaulMdj]

So, you didn't comment on them when they played in this Euro's?

Took the p!55 during the Germany game, praised them in other matches, discussed VAR decision in last game.

Didn’t preach to them or go on the Scottish fitba thread to tell them were they are going wrong.

 

[Swango1980]

Took the p!55 during the Germany game, praised them in other matches, discussed VAR decision in last game.

Didn’t preach to them or go on the Scottish fitba thread to tell them were they are going wrong.

I feel sorry for you if you think people expressing an opinion is them preaching to you

 

[nickjdavis]

in other news about uninspiring moderate quality football...

An uninspired French team is crawling to victory against a lacklustre Belgian team courtesy of a deflected own goal.