The Footie Thread

[Fade and Die]

VAR proved its worth tonight, B’Mouth’s defenders arm went in an upward motion Ref gave a penalty agreed by VAR.

Foul around the box, Ref thought it was inside and gave a penalty, VAR proved initial contact was outside the box and overturned the decision.

I don’t care who you support or who gets favouritism, VAR was brought in for exactly these decisions.

If a foul starts outside the box but continues into the box it is a penalty… Law 12- Fouls and Misconduct

 

[PaulMdj]

If a foul starts outside the box but continues into the box it is a penalty… Law 12- Fouls and Misconduct

Except it was 2 fouls if you watch closely and the first one is definitely outside.

 

[samthom99]

VAR proved its worth tonight, B’Mouth’s defenders arm went in an upward motion Ref gave a penalty agreed by VAR.

Foul around the box, Ref thought it was inside and gave a penalty, VAR proved initial contact was outside the box and overturned the decision.

I don’t care who you support or who gets favouritism, VAR was brought in for exactly these decisions.

"If" you've ever played football you will know it is a natural reaction when the ball comes to you

 

[Swango1980]

Have you ever played any sort of football?

Absolutely.

And if a player reacts, and moves their hand/arm onto the ball, it is referred to as hand ball.

 

[Fade and Die]

Except it was 2 fouls if you watch closely and the first one is definitely outside.

I would need another look to see if it was 2 fouls… it looked like 1 to me, still it’s the sort of decision the big clubs get, which really is the heart of this debate.

 

[PaulMdj]

"If" you've ever played football you will know it is a natural reaction when the ball comes to you

Played for over 30yrs and Refereed for 5 so thanks for asking.

His elbow went up and away from the body, ie, making himself bigger! That’s why you see defenders keeping their arms down and into their sides.

 

[PaulMdj]

I would need another look to see if it was 2 fouls… it looked like 1 to me, still it’s the sort of decision the big clubs get, which really is the heart of this debate.

But it was outside, you could see that on TV.

Going back to Law 12, the only mention of a foul is given as a penalty is when the attacker is being held, which in this case he wasn’t.

“If a defender starts holding an attacker outside the penalty area and continues holding inside the penalty area, the referee must award a penalty kick.”

 

[Swango1980]

I would need another look to see if it was 2 fouls… it looked like 1 to me, still it’s the sort of decision the big clubs get, which really is the heart of this debate.

Personally, I'm not convinced at all that any referee would be concerned about giving a 50/50ish decision against Man Utd right now, especially away. We've certainly had plenty go against us over the season, but nobody mentions the "big club" debate then. People expect Utd to be rubbish, so them conceding a penalty or whatever is no major controversy. Maybe different when they were fighting for titles, but not now.

 

[Swango1980]

But it was outside, you could see that on TV.

Going back to Law 12, the only mention of a foul is given as a penalty is when the attacker is being held, which in this case he wasn’t.

“If a defender starts holding an attacker outside the penalty area and continues holding inside the penalty area, the referee must award a penalty kick.”

This is where co commentators and pundits are useless. They are paid enough to do a bit of research.

They are like a golfer who knows there is vaguely a rule related to an incident that happened, but they've no idea how to implement it or when it applies.

 

[Fade and Die]

But it was outside, you could see that on TV.

Going back to Law 12, the only mention of a foul is given as a penalty is when the attacker is being held, which in this case he wasn’t.

“If a defender starts holding an attacker outside the penalty area and continues holding inside the penalty area, the referee must award a penalty kick.”

Started outside yes but continued inside…

Although the rule states holding, any foul that initiates outside the box and continues till the box will be punished with a penalty.

A la….

 

[Singlefiguregokfer]

Except it was 2 fouls if you watch closely and the first one is definitely outside.

Play advantage on the first one and then give the second one

 

[PaulMdj]

Play advantage on the first one and then give the second one

You can’t if the Ref believed the first contact was inside the box, if he’d said to VAR, there were 2 fouls and I played advantage then yes, you’re correct.

 

[Hobbit]

Played for over 30yrs and Refereed for 5 so thanks for asking.

His elbow went up and away from the body, ie, making himself bigger! That’s why you see defenders keeping their arms down and into their sides.

It’s a tough one. Putting your arms out when someone is coming in behind you is legitimate in terms of making yourself bigger/harder for whoever is tackling you but if you catch someone with an elbow the ref has a decision to make. That decision can easily be a foul/card etc as the player also has a duty of care/not to be reckless.

 

[PaulMdj]

Started outside yes but continued inside…

Although the rule states holding, any foul that initiates outside the box and continues till the box will be punished with a penalty.

A la….

Mate, despite the fact you’ve gone back to 2014, ie Pre VAR days, it is possible the Officials thought the contact from Demechelis was inside the box, he definitely starts the slide outside.

Demchelis also got a Red Card, even that rule has been altered meaning he may not of got a Red Card these days if the Ref believed he was making an attempt to genuinely play the ball.

 

[PaulMdj]

It’s a tough one. Putting your arms out when someone is coming in behind you is legitimate in terms of making yourself bigger/harder for whoever is tackling you but if you catch someone with an elbow the ref has a decision to make. That decision can easily be a foul/card etc as the player also has a duty of care/not to be reckless.

Totally agree, The Ref gets an instant to make a decision, no issue with VAR agreeing.

If on the other hand he’d of said play on and VAR called it back, I’m not sure he’d of told VAR he’s sticking with his original decision.

 

[4LEX]

I could just copy and paste my comment on Man Utd from the other day and it can be applied here.

ETH clueless, conceding too many shots, Hojlund a donkey, outplayed, lucky etc. The penalty decisions were close but the first was just about right and the second wrong IMO.

Oh my word, we’re so easy to play against. The pundits identify the same issues every week, and yet still the same mistakes

And still Swango thinks ETH deserves another season to do more damage

 

[Swango1980]

I could just copy and paste my comment on Man Utd from the other day and it can be applied here.

ETH clueless, conceding too many shots, Hojlund a donkey, outplayed, lucky etc. The penalty decisions were close but the first was just about right and the second wrong IMO.



And still Swango thinks ETH deserves another season to do more damage

Na. Let's get in Southgate. Seems a much better idea.....

 

[4LEX]

Na. Let's get in Southgate. Seems a much better idea.....

I'm no Southgate fan but he would be an upgrade and that's not even a joke!

 

[Swango1980]

I'm no Southgate fan but he would be an upgrade and that's not even a joke!

Well, given I or no one expects United to suddenly become world beaters this season, you can continue to make this point. However, not really any need to send "I told you so" type comments every time. It is not like I've ever said ETH will lead Man Utd to greatness. I simply do not share your certainty he is worse than Southgate.

I simply want the new ownership to get their senior management is place (which they aren't yet) and come up with a plan. Talk to ETH, give him at least another season under their direction and see how that looks. And if it doesn't look good, then make that decision.

Rather than come in, sack the manager, get some other guy in, still have Utd play rubbish next season (good chance as we'll still have many poor players) and then realising they may have been too hasty.

Not that any of our opinions matter of course, they'll do what they want to do. I'll support Utd regardless, and if they sack ETH I will have huge hope it is the right decision, just not confidence it is.

 

[Slime]

It is not like I've ever said ETH will lead Man Utd to greatness. I simply do not share your certainty he is worse than Southgate.

I simply want the new ownership to get their senior management is place (which they aren't yet) and come up with a plan. Talk to ETH, give him at least another season under their direction and see how that looks. And if it doesn't look good, then make that decision.

Rather than come in, sack the manager, get some other guy in, still have Utd play rubbish next season (good chance as we'll still have many poor players) and then realising they may have been too hasty.

Not that any of our opinions matter of course, they'll do what they want to do. I'll support Utd regardless, and if they sack ETH I will have huge hope it is the right decision, just not confidence it is.

Exactly that.