The Footie Thread

[Aztecs27]

Getting back to the football….gifted United two goals with piss poor defence. Gave ball away cheaply and need to find some finishing in the final 3rd.

Some observations;

- Emmanuel Dennis is terrible. Passed more balls to united players in 20 minutes than Casemiro did all game ?

- speaking of which Casemiro is the signing of the season. Class act all round

- Rashford also a baller who is underrated

- we desperately missed Gibbs-White and could have done with Scarpa being allowed to play to help with the final balls.

- hopefully we sign a centre back in Jan.

- Serge Aurier continues to be an absolute lad. Pleasantly surprised with him since coming in.

- still seeing encouraging signs vs the team two months ago. Just lack belief in themselves more than anything.

Saints look horrible, and there are 4 other teams who also look like they could go down, so we just need to be better than them, and not worry too much about games like tonight where we’re not expected to win. Only 11 points between us and 7th, so the compact nature of the league this season helps our chances of staying up.

Either way, I’m enjoying the ride. Looking forward to a day out on New Years Day.

 

[backwoodsman]

Getting back to the football….gifted United two goals with piss poor defence. Gave ball away cheaply and need to find some finishing in the final 3rd.

Some observations;

- Emmanuel Dennis is terrible. Passed more balls to united players in 20 minutes than Casemiro did all game ?

- speaking of which Casemiro is the signing of the season. Class act all round

- Rashford also a baller who is underrated

- we desperately missed Gibbs-White and could have done with Scarpa being allowed to play to help with the final balls.

- hopefully we sign a centre back in Jan.

- Serge Aurier continues to be an absolute lad. Pleasantly surprised with him since coming in.

- still seeing encouraging signs vs the team two months ago. Just lack belief in themselves more than anything.

Saints look horrible, and there are 4 other teams who also look like they could go down, so we just need to be better than them, and not worry too much about games like tonight where we’re not expected to win. Only 11 points between us and 7th, so the compact nature of the league this season helps our chances of staying up.

Either way, I’m enjoying the ride. Looking forward to a day out on New Years Day.

Glad you see more positives than I do.

Fair enough, didn't expect anything other than a loss tonight, but the level of just giving the ball away was dire. (Agree about Dennis). Perhaps Cooper needs to teach them that some other teams wear red & its not always a good idea to pass to someone in a red shirt.

 

[Aztecs27]

Glad you see more positives than I do.

Fair enough, didn't expect anything other than a loss tonight, but the level of just giving the ball away was dire. (Agree about Dennis). Perhaps Cooper needs to teach them that some other teams wear red & its not always a good idea to pass to someone in a red shirt.

Compared to where we were vs Leicester, Bournemouth, Fulham etc, we are much more organised and generally much improved.
There’s still a long way to go, but we’ve put in encouraging performances against Blackburn in the cup as well as Spurs in the cup and Liverpool at home. Based on what I’ve seen, I genuinely believe Scarpa can come in and change the dynamic and give us that quality in attack that we’re missing.

 

[backwoodsman]

Compared to where we were vs Leicester, Bournemouth, Fulham etc, we are much more organised and generally much improved.
There’s still a long way to go, but we’ve put in encouraging performances against Blackburn in the cup as well as Spurs in the cup and Liverpool at home. Based on what I’ve seen, I genuinely believe Scarpa can come in and change the dynamic and give us that quality in attack that we’re missing.

Not giving up on my bet yet - but we do do stuff that dents one's confidence. Feel (hope?) a better performance is coming at home v Chelsea. (Hope so, as my main golfing mate is a Chelsea season ticket holder and I need the bragging rights).

 

[Aztecs27]

Not giving up on my bet yet - but we do do stuff that dents one's confidence. Feel (hope?) a better performance is coming at home v Chelsea. (Hope so, as my main golfing mate is a Chelsea season ticket holder and I need the bragging rights).

As do I. I’ve not seen them lose at the city ground yet this season, so hopefully that trend continues.
A win against the saints is a must.

As an aside to tonight’s loss, the injuries to no less than 6 starting players is really hindering us, as no matter how you look at it and how many players we bought in the summer, we just don’t have the depth to be able to deal with that in the same way the established PL teams do.

Defensively we’ve not looked the same since
Niakhaté went out on opening day. Richards, who was pegged as our starting LB, has yet to train with the 1st team
Kouyaté crocked at the World Cup and really came into his own just before the break.
Gibbs White is easily our best player and is greatly missed
Lingard, it seems, hasn’t been playing at 100% for much of the season, which might explain the below par performances.

Can’t afford many more injuries and need as many of the above back as soon as possible.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1607792228713529344

?? brilliant

https://www.odditycentral.com/news/...-the-greatest-conman-in-football-history.html

 

[Lord Tyrion]

Saints look horrible, and there are 4 other teams who also look like they could go down, so we just need to be better than them, and not worry too much about games like tonight where we’re not expected to win. Only 11 points between us and 7th, so the compact nature of the league this season helps our chances of staying up.

This is the key thing. I'm in the same boat at this stage, Everton. Season is looking poor and scary but we only have to be better than 3 other teams. Bournemouth, Southampton, Forest and Everton I think are in most trouble, wolves, Leeds, West ham I think should have too much.

Getting to 10th isn't a discussion, either of us just need to better than 3 others. Nothing more this year, sadly.

 

[AmandaJR]

Another thread bites the dust for a while. As soon as I saw there were 4 pages I hadn't read since about 9pm last night I knew who would be prolific in the "discussion"...

Note to self - skip to the last page in future

 

[Billysboots]

Compared to where we were vs Leicester, Bournemouth, Fulham etc, we are much more organised and generally much improved.
There’s still a long way to go, but we’ve put in encouraging performances against Blackburn in the cup as well as Spurs in the cup and Liverpool at home. Based on what I’ve seen, I genuinely believe Scarpa can come in and change the dynamic and give us that quality in attack that we’re missing.

But you really need to sort that defence out. In 30+ years of the Premier League, never have I seen a striker afforded the sort of space from a corner that Rashford was for United’s opener. It was breathtaking just how much room he had.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Getting back to the football….gifted United two goals with piss poor defence. Gave ball away cheaply and need to find some finishing in the final 3rd.

Some observations;

- Emmanuel Dennis is terrible. Passed more balls to united players in 20 minutes than Casemiro did all game ?

- speaking of which Casemiro is the signing of the season. Class act all round

- Rashford also a baller who is underrated

- we desperately missed Gibbs-White and could have done with Scarpa being allowed to play to help with the final balls.

- hopefully we sign a centre back in Jan.

- Serge Aurier continues to be an absolute lad. Pleasantly surprised with him since coming in.

- still seeing encouraging signs vs the team two months ago. Just lack belief in themselves more than anything.

Saints look horrible, and there are 4 other teams who also look like they could go down, so we just need to be better than them, and not worry too much about games like tonight where we’re not expected to win. Only 11 points between us and 7th, so the compact nature of the league this season helps our chances of staying up.

Either way, I’m enjoying the ride. Looking forward to a day out on New Years Day.

There are going to be a number of fans hoping there are three teams worse than theirs to help them stay up

There are ten points between 9th and the bottom club

For teams to stay up they need to have something in their squad giving them that extra bit of a quality

Looking at the teams

Leeds , West Ham , Leicester , Palace ,Wolves , Brentford , Villa and Leeds have proven Prem players within their squad that can get them to safety

Fulham have Mitrovic - if he can keep scoring then they stay up

That leaves -Bournemouth, Everton, Forest and Southampton

They all lack any real quality within their squads , Forest have brought in a lot but none of the players stand out as being good enough

Those last three spots I think Forest and Bournemouth will be two and then the last will be a fight between Everton and Southampton but if Fulham lose Mitrovic they will be dragged into it

 

[Fade and Die]

It’s not especially nice. But it’s part of the game, one traditionally followed by the working classes, and as such it’s so ingrained that it will never be eradicated. Never.

Bingo, it’s a working class game and what excites the working class may scare people not used to such stuff.

Football is all about passion, rivalry and tribalism. If you take that away from the game what are you left with? Probably Rugby.

It’s the stuff the people like Phil are (faux) offended by that adds the passion on match day. Reminds me a bit of Pulps Common People…

“Sing along with the common people
Sing along and it might just get you through
Laugh along with the common people
Laugh along even though they're really laughing at you
And the stupid things that you do
Because you think that football is cool”

 

[Swango1980]

Bingo, it’s a working class game and what excites the working class may scare people not used to such stuff.

Football is all about passion, rivalry and tribalism. If you take that away from the game what are you left with? Probably Rugby.

It’s the stuff the people like Phil are (faux) offended by that adds the passion on match day. Reminds me a bit of Pulps Common People…

“Sing along with the common people
Sing along and it might just get you through
Laugh along with the common people
Laugh along even though they're really laughing at you
And the stupid things that you do
Because you think that football is cool”

Indeed. There are plenty of songs aimed at rival fans that are amusing and pretty light hearted. Man Utd fans are not going to chant "ohhh, we don't like Liverpool, lalalalala, but nonetheless, Scousers are a great set of people and Liverpool is a fabulous city, lalalalala, but we always like to see them lose a game"

They will pick up on stereotypes. If Utd fans sing against Liverpool, and mention the job market, burglary, moustaches and shell suits, I doubt most Liverpool fans are actually truly offended? Many probably see the funny side, expect it, and give as good as they get when singing about Manchester. Been going on for decades and decades. Clearly, there are certain chants that cross the line of what most would consider appropriate, and so songs about Hillsborough or Munich are not going to be appreciated by most fans.

Just remembering one particular song at my local Northern Ireland club that was sung against our rivals at every single game. I won't repeat it, but it involved guns and murder. Pretty nasty stuff, yet in the 80's, early 90's most thought it was good natured humour. So, it must happen at most clubs.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Football is no longer a working man’s game , stopped being that a long time ago , the days of Alf Garnett no longer valid in a modern society , the days of working Mon to Friday and then letting the frustrations out on the terraces and saying whatever they want no longer exist

Fans can’t just chant whatever they want because they thinks it’s funny or banter - that’s not how it works anymore, we aren’t in the 70’s or 80’s or 90’s or even 00’s - what some think was acceptable back then isn’t acceptable now and it can’t be brushed off with comments like “faux outrage” or snowflake etc

Football fans can go to a game and enjoy the sport without the need to chant offensive chants - that doesn’t mean it’s sanitised or no swearing or no rivalry etc they just don’t cross the line

Chants about Racism , bigotry, poverty , deaths , serious illness , homophobic etc are not acceptable in the modern day and many many fans and clubs can watch their team without the need to chant about them. It’s not “passion” to chant these sort of things

There is a reason why not one single player has come out as gay whilst still playing top flight football - because they know those low IQ fans won’t be able to not chant derogatory comments

Football is not different to any other sport - it doesn’t have this protected status where fans can act how they like

A lot of good work has been done over the years by the sport to rid itself of the cancerous element that put a stain on the sport.

Instead of looking to find ways to justify it because it happened in the olden days how about condone it and that also includes using phrases like “victims”. Or maybe some just find it hard to call out their own fans when they cross the line

 

[Fade and Die]

Football is no longer a working man’s game , stopped being that a long time ago , the days of Alf Garnett no longer valid in a modern society , the days of working Mon to Friday and then letting the frustrations out on the terraces and saying whatever they want no longer exist

Fans can’t just chant whatever they want because they thinks it’s funny or banter - that’s not how it works anymore, we aren’t in the 70’s or 80’s or 90’s or even 00’s - what some think was acceptable back then isn’t acceptable now and it can’t be brushed off with comments like “faux outrage” or snowflake etc

Football fans can go to a game and enjoy the sport without the need to chant offensive chants - that doesn’t mean it’s sanitised or no swearing or no rivalry etc they just don’t cross the line

Chants about Racism , bigotry, poverty , deaths , serious illness , homophobic etc are not acceptable in the modern day and many many fans and clubs can watch their team without the need to chant about them. It’s not “passion” to chant these sort of things

There is a reason why not one single player has come out as gay whilst still playing top flight football - because they know those low IQ fans won’t be able to not chant derogatory comments

Football is not different to any other sport - it doesn’t have this protected status where fans can act how they like

A lot of good work has been done over the years by the sport to rid itself of the cancerous element that put a stain on the sport.

Instead of looking to find ways to justify it because it happened in the olden days how about condone it and that also includes using phrases like “victims”. Or maybe some just find it hard to call out their own fans when they cross the line

Thank you for proving my point. Almost 100% bollocks. ?

 

[fundy]

This is the key thing. I'm in the same boat at this stage, Everton. Season is looking poor and scary but we only have to be better than 3 other teams. Bournemouth, Southampton, Forest and Everton I think are in most trouble, wolves, Leeds, West ham I think should have too much.

Getting to 10th isn't a discussion, either of us just need to better than 3 others. Nothing more this year, sadly.

The one thing that stood out for me is how little seemed to have changed for most of the aforementioned clubs despite having a lot of their players at home for all or some of the WC. Yes they had some players away and have some injuries. For some clubs you'd have hoped they would have a mini pre-season and come out with some new plans/structure/options but very little change was discernible in the games I saw. It does feel like a lot of clubs main hopes is that there are so many bad sides down there we should be able to stay up.

Will any clubs spend in January to try and survive? Wolves are likely to bring a few in for Lopetagui (sp?) but doesnt seem to be much news from many others down there.

Gun to head it would be Southampton Forest and Bournemouth on current evidence but everyone as far up as Leicester are definitely still in a dog fight and theres a chance a side above that could get dragged down too. No doubt in a couple of weeks my "3" will have changed again (Everton be back in there )

Saints, Bournemouth and Wolves have changed managers recently, be a couple more at least before spring is upon us you'd think (Moyes, Lampard, Rogers?)

 

[Swango1980]

I'm currently quite content Utd bought that "Steady Eddie" Casemiro. You know, the one that wouldn't improve Utd, and really only achieved success due to his the players he played with at Real Madrid.

As it stands, he doesn't just improve Utd's midfield, but he is light years ahead of what they had in those positions before. Utd could have probably won last night with Ant and Dec as the centre back pairing, as Casemiro wouldn't let the ball get near them

With a lot more security and composure in central midfield (with Eriksen as well), I think it gives huge confidence and freedom to the likes of Rashford. They can just concentrate on their job much more, while guys behind them make things tick.

 

[Billysboots]

I have been an Old Trafford regular for years. I can say hand on heart, that I have never heard an orchestrated chant relating to death, serious illness, racism, bigotry or homophobia. Not once. Sure, there’s the “Feed a scouser” which is trotted out every winter, but that genuinely is as bad as it gets.

What I hear far more of are lone individuals, invariably the worse for drink, who shout obscenities and occasionally overstep the mark. I can’t speak for other clubs but, at United, those individuals tend to be pretty swiftly dealt with by stewards.

I’m pretty sure none of us condone chants relating to incidents such as Hillsborough and Munich. Those chants, along with those who insist on using them, are as unwelcome as they are offensive. But there’s a reason the football authorities and law enforcers haven’t done more to combat them. Quite simply, it’s because they are nowhere near as common place as many seem to suggest. In addition, the reaction within the ground from the supporters of the same clubs as those perpetuating the unpleasantness is invariably such that the chanting is self policed by supporters.

It’s all about being proportionate, and rarely, if ever, do I hear commentators, pundits or sports reporters comment about offensive chanting. As unpleasant as some find it, it simply isn’t anywhere near bad enough to try and eradicate something which, ultimately, is part of the fabric of football match attendance in every country in the world.

So. There you have it. I’m not dismissing some of the more unpleasant chanting as banter. I don’t condone that sort of chanting. But it’s never going to stop me attending matches. It didn’t stop me taking my kids when they were youngsters. And I don’t sit there feeling disgusted. All, quite simply, because the vast majority of singing, chanting and so on is good natured and, perish the thought, actually quite funny.

I really have nothing to add. But please, Phil, if you’re going to address my comments, keep them in context.

 

[theoneandonly]

How does such a massive troll get away with so much for so long ??

 

[Pin-seeker]

Are we putting Arsenal as serious title contenders now?
I keep expecting them to drop off,but they’re playing some cracking football.
Saka just keeps getting better.

 

[Billysboots]

Are we putting Arsenal as serious title contenders now?
I keep expecting them to drop off,but they’re playing some cracking football.
Saka just keeps getting better.

Whether they last the course remains to be seen but, regardless of where they finish, even the most fierce critic would have to agree Arteta has done a fabulous job.