The all things EV chat thread

[BiMGuy]

Comparing a Tesla with a performance car, and I mean a proper performance car, like the ones you list, but also down to things like a BMW M3, is daft as there is simply no contest as to which is the fastest. The Tesla wouldn't get close.

The more relevant comparison is those that just like the fast in a straight line away from the traffic lights experience. The kind of experience delivered by numerous family cars these days that churn out 250bhp plus, a good number of them diesels too. Like my BMW 330d, as an example, which is not a performance car even though it's fast 0-60 and gets round corners tidily compared to most other family cars. The Tesla would of course be much faster 0-60, although I'd wager that the 330d would still smash it in a race around a track.

My point is, anyone that seeks to compare a tesla and a performance car (which I appreciate you are not and making the same point as me) is barking up the wrong tree. Compare it against 3 litre diesels from Audi and BMW and whoever else makes fast family cars. There is nothing that any electric car delivers that is relevant to the question of whether it's a better buy than a Ferrari 308.

As an aside, I saw a F355 on the road for the first time in ages last week, what a beauty. Love that car!

I’m sorry, but as quick as a 330D might feel, it’s really not. And they don’t handle particularly well either. You wouldn’t see which way the Tesla went.

Top gear ran an M3 v a Tesla. The M3 didn’t fare well.

Having had two M3s. I’d have one over any Tesla in a heartbeat.

https://www.topgear.com/car-news/electric/tesla-model-3-vs-bmw-m3-elon-musk

 

[Canary_Yellow]

I’m sorry, but as quick as a 330D might feel, it’s really not. And they don’t handle particularly well either. You wouldn’t see which way the Tesla went.

Top gear ran an M3 v a Tesla. The M3 didn’t fare well.

Having had two M3s. I’d have one over any Tesla in a heartbeat.

https://www.topgear.com/car-news/electric/tesla-model-3-vs-bmw-m3-elon-musk

You've misunderstood my point. As I said, a 330d is not a performance car albeit it is no slouch. The Tesla would of course take the lead on the first couple of laps of a race on a track, but how many laps before it overheats and performance is reduced? 2? 3? Maybe up to 5? Then how many more until it's completely drained its battery going at full power? Another 10?

The Top Gear test you've referred to there is only comparing a tesla and an M3 in a way that the tesla has any hope of competing. A 50 lap race round a proper circuit, the Tesla wouldn't even finish. It's daft to compare a Tesla and an M3 if you want the M3 for its true driving credentials as a track car rather than as a status symbol. I appreciate though that it is not altogether irrelevant as for everyday road use, the top gear test is more comparable and how many really buy an M3 for its track credentials?

But my point is really that the Tesla should not be compared with cars that are designed to cope with the rigours of a race around a track. It should be compared with other cars that are not, such as mine, or a 340i, maybe even an M3 or whatever else. Which would win on a 50 lap race round Spa out of a 330d and a Tesla is a ridiculous question to even be pondering because that's not what either is for. But it would be the 330d.... ;-)

 

[Ye Olde Boomer]

My guess is that only electric cars will bve available within a decade.
No idea if I'll see be around to buy one, but I wouldn't bet on it.

 

[Deleted member 23270]

Don't buy an EV if you need to tow regularly

 

[Lord Tyrion]

My guess is that only electric cars will bve available within a decade.
No idea if I'll see be around to buy one, but I wouldn't bet on it.

How are sales of electric cars going in the US? I can see that being a tough sell.

 

[PNWokingham]

So they look good on posters on your bedroom wall and they make a great noise, but they are relatively slow, no sat nav, no usb sockets, no air bags, no power steering, rubbish handling, no back seats, £250+ road tax and you can't get out of them. 10mpg

Or you could buy a Tesla and put a V8 in it

and car nuts will still love them. I would put a lot of money ion their being no 40 year old teslas still on the rod in 2062! But if you want to compare a near 100k Tesla - choose a modern similarly priced car - plenty of options. Indeed i would take the 50k petrol option anytime over the much dearer Tesla

 

[Ye Olde Boomer]

How are sales of electric cars going in the US? I can see that being a tough sell.

Electric cars will be accepted in urban Coastal Aamerica and resisted in rural Middle America.
They are essentially different nations attempting (with very poor results) to share the same national government.

America will do what it always does...follow the rest of the world, only at least a decade and usually more than that late.
Adopting electric cars will be no different than abolishing slavery in that regard.
There's a resaon for this.

Remember that the term "American" refers ONLY to a nationality, NOT to an ethnicity.
We have a heterogeneous population comprised of factions that despise one another.
We can't do anything collectively until we're given no choice.

The key to undrstanding Americans is this:

Middle Americans refuse to be governed, while Coastal Americans refuse to be inconvenienced.
Eventually, we're all forced to do the right thing, but it will always happen long after it should have happened.
And someday soon, it may not happen at all and the Goths will be at the gate.
No republic endures forever.

 

[pool888]

Not sure why we're even comparing an old Ferrari to a Tesla, has anyone ever thought about buying a car and whittled it down to two, a 30 year old 2 seater sports car or a new family EV. The Ferrari was a rare special car in it's day and is now a well sought after classic, it would have cost several times the price or a common run around saloon, which the Tesla is the modern equivalent of now. Think most people would take the Ferrari until the reality of what it would cost to run it as a daily vehicle hits. The Ferrari is to buy, admire and store, used for the odd very special occasion, the Tesla is a good family daily, fast, practical and cheap to run.

 

[bobmac]

The Ferrari is to buy, admire and store, used for the odd very special occasion, the Tesla is a good family daily, fast, practical and cheap to run.

The point I was trying to make is you can take an old favourite, fit an electric motor and have the best of both worlds, classic styling with modern handling and performance. Hence my comment about fitting central heating in a Georgian manor house. Think of an Alfa Romeo that doesn't break down.

 

[Jimaroid]

No, the best of both worlds is to own both cars.

I do not understand the obsession with needing one car that does everything. It's never been true in the past and it will never be true in the future.

 

[Fade and Die]

Electric cars will be accepted in urban Coastal Aamerica and resisted in rural Middle America.
They are essentially different nations attempting (with very poor results) to share the same national government.

America will do what it always does...follow the rest of the world, only at least a decade and usually more than that late.
Adopting electric cars will be no different than abolishing slavery in that regard.
There's a resaon for this.

Remember that the term "American" refers ONLY to a nationality, NOT to an ethnicity.
We have a heterogeneous population comprised of factions that despise one another.
We can't do anything collectively until we're given no choice.

The key to undrstanding Americans is this:

Middle Americans refuse to be governed, while Coastal Americans refuse to be inconvenienced.
Eventually, we're all forced to do the right thing, but it will always happen long after it should have happened.
And someday soon, it may not happen at all and the Goths will be at the gate.
No republic endures forever.

In my head I always read Ye Old Boomers post in a Bob Bubka voice. Don't know why it just amuses me.

 

[pool888]

The point I was trying to make is you can take an old favourite, fit an electric motor and have the best of both worlds, classic styling with modern handling and performance. Hence my comment about fitting central heating in a Georgian manor house. Think of an Alfa Romeo that doesn't break down.

Sorry, haven't read the whole thread, maybe missed some important info. Yes you could do that, but why would you? You lose the whole point of the Ferrari, you need to buy it, do an expensive conversion, it would be hard to insure I would imagine, and you still have the problems of getting parts for a classic car, and in addition you likely also kill the resale value of it. Maybe look for something like a Alfa Giulia GT.

 

[PNWokingham]

The point I was trying to make is you can take an old favourite, fit an electric motor and have the best of both worlds, classic styling with modern handling and performance. Hence my comment about fitting central heating in a Georgian manor house. Think of an Alfa Romeo that doesn't break down.

no, no, no. Take the engine out and you basically lobotomise it

 

[bobmac]

no, no, no. Take the engine out and you basically lobotomise it

It doesn't have to be a Ferrari 308, it could be a mini, a VW campervan, an old jeep, anything, even an Alfa Giulia GT.

 

[Foxholer]

...Maybe look for something like a Alfa Giulia GT.

Like this one? https://www.topgear.com/car-news/electric/electrified-518bhp-restomodded-alfa-giulia-gt

 

[BiMGuy]

There is quite a market for the electrification of classic cars. And they are usually very expensive.

 

[pool888]

Like this one? https://www.topgear.com/car-news/electric/electrified-518bhp-restomodded-alfa-giulia-gt

Yes that's the one I meant, I remember seeing it a while ago, but didn't realise it was THAT expensive, for some reason I thought it was just over £100K. Ooops

 

[GreiginFife]

Personally, I'd go for it's newer brethren with more power for about a third of the cost...

 

[GreiginFife]

If BMW don't get their fingers out with my 8er then I am of a mind to cancel and I have been drawn to the new Lotus Emira as my last hurrah to the ICE world. Similar pricing as the 8er but at least 150% less practical

 

[Foxholer]

Personally, I'd go for it's newer brethren with more power for about a third of the cost...

As long as they put the number plate in the middle!!