Putting with pin in - sick of it!

[Mandofred]

Leaving the pin in is just rubbish. Anything that reduces the area of the hole is just naff. Half the time the pin isn't straight, so less than half the hole is available.
.

Have a playing partner hold the flag straight(ish) with their putter head. Legal I believe.

 

[rulefan]

On a similar subject I'm keen to hear what other courses are doing in reltion to bells?
On our course we currently have 4 bells which are still expected to be rung due to blind corners or driveable greens and if you have a member doing this then why can't you have a member dedicated to removing the pins?

Just hit the bell with a putter head. No need to touch the bell.

 

[USER1999]

Just hit the bell with a putter head. No need to touch the bell.

You obviously have a very inexpensive putter.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

On a similar subject I'm keen to hear what other courses are doing in reltion to bells?
On our course we currently have 4 bells which are still expected to be rung due to blind corners or driveable greens and if you have a member doing this then why can't you have a member dedicated to removing the pins?

Our bells are still in use. Originally the metal stick to hit them with was removed and we had to hit them with a club, I used the end of a wedge. I've noticed the sticks are back but I'm still using my wedge.

It doesn't damage the club. A gentle tap makes a good noise still.

 

[rulefan]

I'm sure the stats suggest that with pin in from distance you have a higher chance of holing a putt. But, from where most of us are likely to hole putts, a bounce out is a likely result.

Have you seen the stats?
I know of at least 6 studies. None are conclusive. Some lean one way, some the other.

 

[huds1475]

There is a maximum diameter for flagsticks

"What's your flagstick diameter" has the potential for another scintillating thread

 

[Orikoru]

I was putting with the flag in most of the time after they changed the rule. Then I had one bounce out from 2.5 feet which I was sure would have gone in, and I started taking it out for shortish ones just to avoid any doubt.

Since Covid our club put foam inserts in the cup at first, which I was fine with. Then they changed to the lifting devices, but they seem to have got the worst, cheapest ones available. Properly home made looking bits of tin, flat on one side and crudely bent over at the top. The other week I had a 20 foot birdie putt very clearly kept out by the metal lifting arm being on that side, so now every time I putt I go and turn the device so it's on the opposite side of the pin. Yeah it's annoying, but I'm still going to take it over not be able to play. I don't think you can rely on people to use a glove or a bit of paper or sanitise regularly, so it's still the safest option I'm afraid.

 

[Deleted member 25172]

I’ve seen plenty of people had the bad luck of a “weird” bounce of the pin with the new thing attached to retrieve the ball from the hole. Today it was my turn. I had pretty much already got my scorecard up to write down a birdie when out of the blue, the ball just “popped” off the pin, leaving the ball a few inches from the hole. Both playing partners looked as stunned as I felt, and we were all in agreement that it would’ve been a birdie if it had been a regular pin in the hole.
But it’s the same for everyone. Just had to tap it in for a par and look happy.

 

[Canary_Yellow]

I’m yet to see a ball stay out due to the pin being in, but this is playing at courses with a very thin flagstick.

That’s the thing that really makes the difference, as others have said. I wouldn’t like it (and didn’t until this became mandatory) if I had to keep the pin in with a relatively chunky stick

 

[Fabia999]

I was happy when they brought the rule that you can leave flags in last year. I prefer it that way.

How hard are you hitting them for it to bounce out twice a round?

 

[USER1999]

I was happy when they brought the rule that you can leave flags in last year. I prefer it that way.

How hard are you hitting them for it to bounce out twice a round?

For me, and it is clearly different depending on pin diameter, quite often, the ball has to come to rest leaning between the edge of the hole, and the pin. It doesn't drop, there isn't room. Probably due to the pin not being squarely held up. This means putts have to die into the hole. A putt going a couple of inches past will be spat out.

 

[KenL]

I was happy when they brought the rule that you can leave flags in last year. I prefer it that way.

How hard are you hitting them for it to bounce out twice a round?

At my club, not hard. I've seen loads of putts that would definitely dropped bouncing out.

 

[Fabia999]

For me, and it is clearly different depending on pin diameter, quite often, the ball has to come to rest leaning between the edge of the hole, and the pin. It doesn't drop, there isn't room. Probably due to the pin not being squarely held up. This means putts have to die into the hole. A putt going a couple of inches past will be spat out.

I find that surprising, I've only played 3 different courses since lockdown but I haven't noticed any. maybe I've just picked courses with smaller flagsticks or perhaps it's just the way I putt.

 

[Shooter McPowick]

We’ve just had our club champs and although it was full I had a round last night after the last group. My PP hit the pin twice where without a doubt it would have dropped with no pin. Very unfair in my opinion and especially if it occurred to anyone playing in the club champs.
I agree, I’m fed up with having to leave the pin in but if it means we can play then hey ho.

 

[Slab]

With thin flagsticks and simple cut plastic piping to raise hole depth it’s not an issue where I play and I prefer putting with the flag in since the rule change anyway, but after googling these ‘touchless’ lifting thingies it’s easy to see why they might prevent a ball going in with the various bit of materials wrapped around (and attached to) the flagstick (seems a very over engineered solution when a simple one is available)

 

[PJ87]

We’ve just had our club champs and although it was full I had a round last night after the last group. My PP hit the pin twice where without a doubt it would have dropped with no pin. Very unfair in my opinion and especially if it occurred to anyone playing in the club champs.
I agree, I’m fed up with having to leave the pin in but if it means we can play then hey ho.

https://golf.com/news/tournaments/d...d-leave-the-flagstick-in-when-you-putt-2/amp/

Well science says it's better with pin in but who's to argue with science

 

[Orikoru]

https://golf.com/news/tournaments/d...d-leave-the-flagstick-in-when-you-putt-2/amp/

Well science says it's better with pin in but who's to argue with science

"

1. Assuming the pin is securely in place, standing vertical and not swaying in the wind, the hole is 4.25” wide.
2. The diameter of a standard flagstick is 0.5” (some pins taper to ¾” and even 1” above the hole)."

It's these things that make the difference though. Often as murph said, the pin will be leaning slightly so the ball cannot actually drop between it and the edge of the hole. That is why they introduced the rule saying any part of the ball below the surface = holed. And if you hit a firm putt to that side it could definitely bounce out when it would have dropped without the pin.

A lot of the testing they did as well was hitting the pin straight on on a straight putt, which is lot different to striking it at an angle from a left to right or right to left putt.

 

[Grant85]

Anyone hating being forced to put with the pin in?

I am finding it really annoying to putt, especially on short putts.

My course has really thick pins and a ball retriever device that you need to spin round to get it out of the way to avoid that adding to the thickness of the pin.

Had numerous bounce outs that would have gone in if pin had been out, plus it just makes the hole tiny.

In medal today a pal of mine had a great round (2 over) but had 2 putts hit the pins at reasonable speed that bounced out.

I can go to a pub, go for a meal, shop In close proximity to others, go on a bus or train and next week I'll be in close contact with about 1100 people at my work (30 plus people without masks in a room about 6m x 7m) but I can't remove a pin even though we all have hand sanitiser in our bags.
Absolutely ridiculous.

I have sent Scottish Golf Union 3 messages on twitter - no reply.

So, what do you think?

Not a problem at all for me, quite happy with leaving the pin in anyway.

Just focus on the middle of the flag and bang it in. Genuinely don't feel it costs any shots. Personal view is the actual pin makes next to no difference, but the mindset and the kind of putt you make will have a far bigger impact. I turn it into a positive and use the middle of the pin to aim at over shorter putts.

At the moment, you can't remove the pin, so why let yourself get annoyed about it. That's probably costing you more shots than just adjusting your mindset and playing a normal game.

In terms of the pandemic, not a risk worth taking and zero chance of it changing until we go to a zero risk of community transmission.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

At my club, not hard. I've seen loads of putts that would definitely dropped bouncing out.

Definitely including my PP in the comp at the weekend that had several bounce out. To be fair we had been turning the device around so the edges were face on and giving the ball the largest point of entry and he hadn't bothered both times so hit the device side on although in his defence neither but were running at pace and in my opinion and under normal circumstances would definitely have dropped without a flag, and 8/10 times dropped if it had hit the pin alone. It is annoying especially in a competitive round but far better that than no comps or even no golf

 

[PJ87]

"

1. Assuming the pin is securely in place, standing vertical and not swaying in the wind, the hole is 4.25” wide.
2. The diameter of a standard flagstick is 0.5” (some pins taper to ¾” and even 1” above the hole)."

It's these things that make the difference though. Often as murph said, the pin will be leaning slightly so the ball cannot actually drop between it and the edge of the hole. That is why they introduced the rule saying any part of the ball below the surface = holed. And if you hit a firm putt to that side it could definitely bounce out when it would have dropped without the pin.

A lot of the testing they did as well was hitting the pin straight on on a straight putt, which is lot different to striking it at an angle from a left to right or right to left putt.

Bolt the pin down and make from a strong metal so doesn't sway

Problem solved

Never remove them again