LIV Golf

[Barking_Mad]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1383913691410698242

?? oops

Ouch. Self inflicted burns are the worst. ?. Also...

Sergio Garcia (+1), Graeme McDowell (+4), Lee Westwood (+5), Ian Poulter (+5)

Poulter delivering junk mail these days?

 

[Ethan]

Funny how Chamblee and co always waffling on about how innovative he was, now they will treat him like dirt, guess I know who butters their bread, ha ha

If there was a playing benefit to one length clubs, more players would be doing it. But there really isn't, and there are disadvantages with short clubs. Testing and technical analysis of swings and shot outcomes are incredibly good these days. BdC also generated all sorts of nonsensical coverage about how he took all sorts of insignificant factors into account, and he reportedly tested his golf balls for balance, and rejected many. That may have been OK in Ben Hogan's days (who died the same) when balls had wound centres, but was laughable with modern sold manufacturing and tolerances.

He liked this image of him as a scientist, so played to it. A basic degree in a science subject does not a scientist make. And his muscle building campaign - he gained muscle rather quickly, and I think some science, likely pharmacological, was involved. That would also explain the injuries that have resulted. Maybe LIV is more relaxed about testing players.

 

[Backsticks]

If there was a playing benefit to one length clubs, more players would be doing it.

Indeed. Its just an idea that one latches on to, but really is just cosmetic, or a mental crutch, like aimpoint, caddies eyeing putts flat on the ground, or lines on balls, and not really of any true physical benefit.
He is novelty though, and I think he has contributed to highlighting the distance problem, increasing pressure on the authorities to shorten the ball.
He is a loss to the main tour I think.

 

[evemccc]

Won't really miss any of them. Bryson is a freak show, Fowler is a busted flush, Wolff is heading that way too, Perez was never a major figure and Reed is ..... Reed.

Pretty sure Fowler and Bryson are two of the biggest names to advertisers, and both appeal to advertisers favourite demographic, the ‘yoof’

 

[Swango1980]

If there was a playing benefit to one length clubs, more players would be doing it. But there really isn't, and there are disadvantages with short clubs. Testing and technical analysis of swings and shot outcomes are incredibly good these days. BdC also generated all sorts of nonsensical coverage about how he took all sorts of insignificant factors into account, and he reportedly tested his golf balls for balance, and rejected many. That may have been OK in Ben Hogan's days (who died the same) when balls had wound centres, but was laughable with modern sold manufacturing and tolerances.

He liked this image of him as a scientist, so played to it. A basic degree in a science subject does not a scientist make. And his muscle building campaign - he gained muscle rather quickly, and I think some science, likely pharmacological, was involved. That would also explain the injuries that have resulted. Maybe LIV is more relaxed about testing players.

Sounds like you don't like him due to false claims of him being a scientist. Hate to break it to you if you were a fan of Arnold Palmer, but I'm told he wasn't actually a King

 

[PJ87]

If there was a playing benefit to one length clubs, more players would be doing it. But there really isn't, and there are disadvantages with short clubs. Testing and technical analysis of swings and shot outcomes are incredibly good these days. BdC also generated all sorts of nonsensical coverage about how he took all sorts of insignificant factors into account, and he reportedly tested his golf balls for balance, and rejected many. That may have been OK in Ben Hogan's days (who died the same) when balls had wound centres, but was laughable with modern sold manufacturing and tolerances.

He liked this image of him as a scientist, so played to it. A basic degree in a science subject does not a scientist make. And his muscle building campaign - he gained muscle rather quickly, and I think some science, likely pharmacological, was involved. That would also explain the injuries that have resulted. Maybe LIV is more relaxed about testing players.

Pros start playing very very young. When did one lengths become a proper alternative this time round what 2016? So you won't see many more pros coming through using them for a few more years yet ..

I doubt a very good pro would change unless they are a "freak" like you say about Bryson

 

[PJ87]

Sounds like you don't like him due to false claims of him being a scientist. Hate to break it to you if you were a fan of Arnold Palmer, but I'm told he wasn't actually a King

Hold on does this mean tiger isn't a cat?????

 

[Mel Smooth]

Indeed. Its just an idea that one latches on to, but really is just cosmetic, or a mental crutch, like aimpoint, caddies eyeing putts flat on the ground, or lines on balls, and not really of any true physical benefit.
He is novelty though, and I think he has contributed to highlighting the distance problem, increasing pressure on the authorities to shorten the ball.
He is a loss to the main tour I think.

All of them are a loss to the tour, take away Bryson and you take away the rivalry with "Brooksy", and that's just one element. All these players, Phil, DJ, Sergio and his tantrums, Poulter and his trousers, Kevin Na and his slow play - it all generates talking points which add to the appeal.

The PGA tour has lost out big time, and it's their own doing.

Unless the R&A, USGA, Masters and PGA of America come out and stand alongside the PGA Tour, these guys will in the main still get in to the some or all of the majors, so the PGA have left themselves with a bunch of events that make up the numbers, with a lot of the big names in golf banned by them, from participating in.

 

[PJ87]

All of them are a loss to the tour, take away Bryson and you take away the rivalry with "Brooksy", and that's just one element. All these players, Phil, DJ, Sergio and his tantrums, Poulter and his trousers, Kevin Na and his slow play - it all generates talking points which add to the appeal.

The PGA tour has lost out big time, and it's their own doing.

Unless the R&A, USGA, Masters and PGA of America come out and stand alongside the PGA Tour, these guys will in the main still get in to the some or all of the majors, so the PGA have left themselves with a bunch of events that make up the numbers, with a lot of the big names in golf banned by them, from participating in.

I see no point the masters banning people

If they can't get points players won't get invites and the only ones that will get in will be past winners like DJ , Louis , Phil and Garcia

Now what would banning achieve? Only DJ would be likely to even win

 

[Mel Smooth]

I see no point the masters banning people

If they can't get points players won't get invites and the only ones that will get in will be past winners like DJ , Louis , Phil and Garcia

Now what would banning achieve? Only DJ would be likely to even win

Yeah, personally I feel the PGA Tour have shown nothing but petulance all the way through this. They've actually fuelled the interest in LIV with their actions.

There'll be pressure from the sponsors of the major to have the most interesting field possible available as well of course. And just like with the LIV series, money talks.

 

[Backsticks]

All of them are a loss to the tour, take away Bryson and you take away the rivalry with "Brooksy", and that's just one element. All these players, Phil, DJ, Sergio and his tantrums, Poulter and his trousers, Kevin Na and his slow play - it all generates talking points which add to the appeal.

The PGA tour has lost out big time, and it's their own doing.

Unless the R&A, USGA, Masters and PGA of America come out and stand alongside the PGA Tour, these guys will in the main still get in to the some or all of the majors, so the PGA have left themselves with a bunch of events that make up the numbers, with a lot of the big names in golf banned by them, from participating in.

I dont think they all are. Most of us havent heard of most of the golfers at Centurion. Even if the quality will uograde as they discard some of the temps.
But prume career majors challengers and holders are the key to both. Phil is no loss. Poults and the likes little loss too. But Reed would be. BdC would be. DJ is. They are the ones that define the quality of a field in any tournament, and why this weeks LIV at least, is a non tournament in a world golf sense. The quality of the field is abysmal.

 

[AussieKB]

If Phil has life membership of the PGA are they going to rescind that now, very petty if they do, but I would not be surprised.

 

[AddisonRoad]

Not sure how much of a fan/supporter I'll be yet but certainly not anti-liv, enjoyed what I saw so far. The leader board will take a bit of adjusting but was same on motorsport when they started using it, but its still professional golf so I'm gonna watch
On the TV broadcast I had to really listen hard to even hear the 'tone' that played when a players name was highlighted, so that wasn't an issue for me (thankfully)
Very pleased with how many shots we saw, like watching the 1 hour highlights from a 'regular' tour event except it wasn't just putts (which is the kind of sub-standard nonsense we've been fed so far if you don't watch live)

Will be watching to see how their application for awarding world ranking points goes, not sure on what grounds it might be declined given strength of field compared to some of the minor tours where points are already available

Saw a few comments on size of crowds etc but for info... and maybe others saw the report on BBC that said, the attendance was capped at 8k per day
That's obviously gonna look a little sparse on tv given the 16 hole shotgun start but I've no idea why there was a cap for this event, maybe course or local infrastructure

In regards to them capping the event

1) I don't think there was anywhere near 8k there yesterday

2) That seems like a convenient press release when they were literally giving away tickets for free. I assume this was because they had barely sold any, as most of the people I spoke to at the event were in the same boat as me - they got free tickets with a code online

 

[Depreston]

I see no point the masters banning people

If they can't get points players won't get invites and the only ones that will get in will be past winners like DJ , Louis , Phil and Garcia

Now what would banning achieve? Only DJ would be likely to even win

NLU podcast claimed willet reached out to Augusta to gauge if they would let him play if he signed up

You wouldn’t even be welcome on the property was the response

Phil wearing a Masters gilet with the logo blacked out by marker pen on the 1st tee was odd yesterday also

I think they’re the only major currently that would ban players but it’s a long time till the next masters

 

[AussieKB]

NLU podcast claimed willet reached out to Augusta to gauge if they would let him play if he signed up

You wouldn’t even be welcome on the property was the response

Phil wearing a Masters gilet with the logo blacked out by marker pen on the 1st tee was odd yesterday also

I think they’re the only major currently that would ban players but it’s a long time till the next masters

Augusta is a law onto themselves, so I would not listen to scuttlebutt at this stage, a lot of lawyers will be involved before the end of this year at least.

 

[Backsticks]

I cant see how the Master would care one way or another how players earn their money or what other tournaments they play. It is their closed shop. LIV is zero threat to them. They have no competitive conflict with each other. The Master will invite the worlds best golfers, full stop.

 

[evemccc]

Aside from anything else, if Augusta did that, it would rightfully give those who say the US Masters isn’t a Major, more ammunition


As an aside, as a big tennis fan, I think the Wimbledon ban on Russian and Belarusian players this summer is equally absurd

 

[Slab]

In regards to them capping the event

1) I don't think there was anywhere near 8k there yesterday

2) That seems like a convenient press release when they were literally giving away tickets for free. I assume this was because they had barely sold any, as most of the people I spoke to at the event were in the same boat as me - they got free tickets with a code online

I think you said you were there so will certainly have a better feel for number of boots on the ground. I'm just suggesting that anyone that expected to see 20k-30k of punters on telly, then it was never gonna happen anyway
I think most ticket events have freebies, seems like there was plenty available for this judging by what folks are saying

I wonder if the limited spectator cap might also offer a bit of an insight why ticket prices were initially set (too) high If the rocky build up had been smoother and the few marque names had committed earlier then interest/demand would've also been higher I guess

 

[Mel Smooth]

Interestingly, the prices are the same at Portland, around the 70 dollar mark. Wages of course are hgher in the USA, so the price is cheaper realtively.

I'd imagine there'll be bigger and more vocal crowds at the next one.

 

[Swango1980]

I think you said you were there so will certainly have a better feel for number of boots on the ground. I'm just suggesting that anyone that expected to see 20k-30k of punters on telly, then it was never gonna happen anyway
I think most ticket events have freebies, seems like there was plenty available for this judging by what folks are saying

I wonder if the limited spectator cap might also offer a bit of an insight why ticket prices were initially set (too) high If the rocky build up had been smoother and the few marque names had committed earlier then interest/demand would've also been higher I guess

Mentioned yesterday, the course itself looked a lot tighter that your typical PGA event. Often it appeared one side of the fairway was just dense trees and out of bounds.

Would this be a reason for limited spectators? It is a lot easier for tens of thousands of spectators at huge courses and lots of areas for spectators to stand, coupled with many grandstands.

Furthermore, how many regular golf fans truly know much about it yet? We've talked about it to death in this forum, but outside of here it is not a regular big event fans know about for months, and plan their schedule in advance to attend. The guys in my golf whatsapp chat didn't know much about it, but sort of started asking questions a few days ago when it hit the main news headlines. When DJ entered it probably became big news, but not early enough for many to plan a visit.