LIV Golf

[Mel Smooth]

If you back yourself into a corner, you have nowhere to turn.

Jay Monahan had nowhere to turn.

Sponsors leaving, tv ratings falling, and some pretty big skeletons in his closet.

So now we are, where we could and should have been 12 months ago,….

https://twitter.com/x/status/1666391007343128576

 

[Deleted member 21445]

The BIG question remains why now ?

It would seem that it simply came down to deeper pockets from the PIF.

JM once said if this is an arms race and the weapons of choice are dollar bills then we cant compete.

The legal fees of years of drawn out legal battles and the sponsors already maxed out meant that the tour was ultimately going to struggle to maintain purses to keep their top players engaged .

We all need to wait and see in the next 3 weeks what they are going to announce as a schedule for 2024 under this new tour banner.

Golf But Louder events are going to be part of that schedule as the team franchises have already been confirmed as being part of the new tour set up.
I dont see the range goats playing in PGAT events so Liv style events have to be part of it going forward with probably a rebrand.

The question is how many and when/where are they played ?
We can all speculate on that but until its announced nobody has any idea.

Liv have got everything they wanted, a place at the top table of golf, Players got their huge payouts, looks like they will be able to play other tours as free agents, their product shown on major PGAT TV networks, Team franchises some players have equity in are now far more attractive to potential investors due to extra exposure.

Imagine for a second if Brooks convinced Rory to join Smash GC (Give him equity in the team), that would be Nike's 2 major players and perfect for Swoosh GC.

Unbelievable unprecedented times for golf, the next month is going to be rough for the PGAT players because right now other than securing a PGAT future its less obvious of the real upside for their players.
You can see this in the player interviews, the PGAT players all look pissed and the Liv golfers look like the cat that got the cream.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

The BIG question remains why now ?

It would seem that it simply came down to deeper pockets from the PIF.

JM once said if this is an arms race and the weapons of choice are dollar bills then we cant compete.

The legal fees of years of drawn out legal battles and the sponsors already maxed out meant that the tour was ultimately going to struggle to maintain purses to keep their top players engaged .

We all need to wait and see in the next 3 weeks what they are going to announce as a schedule for 2024 under this new tour banner.

Golf But Louder events are going to be part of that schedule as the team franchises have already been confirmed as being part of the new tour set up.
I dont see the range goats playing in PGAT events so Liv style events have to be part of it going forward with probably a rebrand.

The question is how many and when/where are they played ?
We can all speculate on that but until its announced nobody has any idea.

Liv have got everything they wanted, a place at the top table of golf, Players got their huge payouts, looks like they will be able to play other tours as free agents, their product shown on major PGAT TV networks, Team franchises some players have equity in are now far more attractive to potential investors due to extra exposure.

Imagine for a second if Brooks convinced Rory to join Smash GC (Give him equity in the team), that would be Nike's 2 major players and perfect for Swoosh GC.

Unbelievable unprecedented times for golf, the next month is going to be rough for the PGAT players because right now other than securing a PGAT future its less obvious of the real upside for their players.
You can see this in the player interviews, the PGAT players all look pissed and the Liv golfers look like the cat that got the cream.

A lot stuff that where as with anything is pretty unknown

The telling line was that they would evaluate LIV golf after this season

Yet you are going full blown franchises and LIV events being on the PGAT media deals etc


The LiV golfers may well be a bit jubilant at the moment but nothing has changed for them and before anything changes they need to process back into the main tours - that could cost them , many could end up in the lower level tours , it’s a long way from declaring any victory

It’s worth remembering that the deal being done is between PIF and PGAT - none of the LIV top table were involved.

There is every chance that the “evaluation” could be to just stop LIV after this season

It’s a prob more realistic idea that PIF have got into main level golf now they don’t need LIV and Greg Norman’s plans - they will only need to put money into the new “commercial entity” -there was no talk of a new “tour” just commercial joining of PIF and PGAT.

When the statement only guarantees LIV events for this season I would use that to open a few eyes

 

[Deleted member 29109]

I see people are confusing PIF with LiV.
LiV was nothing more than a vehicle for PIF to get a hook into the PGAT. As an entity, LiV is no longer required as PIF now have a seat at the big table.

The main reason the PGAT have got into bed with them appears to be the unsustainable ongoing costs of various court cases. PIF have an endless pot of money to spend. The PGAT doesn’t.

 

[pendodave]

I see people are confusing PIF with LiV.
LiV was nothing more than a vehicle for PIF to get a hook into the PGAT. As an entity, LiV is no longer required as PIF now have a seat at the big table.

The main reason the PGAT have got into bed with them appears to be the unsustainable ongoing costs of various court cases. PIF have an endless pot of money to spend. The PGAT doesn’t.

The court cases didn't appear from nowhere.
The PGA tour took (alleged) anti-competitive actions against another golf tour. They didn't have to do this. The PGA leadership has been asleep at the wheel for years, while happily living in an assumed perpetual monopoly.

 

[Bdill93]

A lot stuff that where as with anything is pretty unknown

The telling line was that they would evaluate LIV golf after this season

Yet you are going full blown franchises and LIV events being on the PGAT media deals etc


The LiV golfers may well be a bit jubilant at the moment but nothing has changed for them and before anything changes they need to process back into the main tours - that could cost them , many could end up in the lower level tours , it’s a long way from declaring any victory

It’s worth remembering that the deal being done is between PIF and PGAT - none of the LIV top table were involved.

There is every chance that the “evaluation” could be to just stop LIV after this season

It’s a prob more realistic idea that PIF have got into main level golf now they don’t need LIV and Greg Norman’s plans - they will only need to put money into the new “commercial entity” -there was no talk of a new “tour” just commercial joining of PIF and PGAT.

When the statement only guarantees LIV events for this season I would use that to open a few eyes

They clearly put value on certain areas of what LIV was doing though - mainly playing in different areas around the world. I think that's smart too! Growing the global game and not just America.

I think there's no doubt LIV in itself is done but its pretty clear the team element is going to transfer to some new events or something. Quite intrigued about how they achieve it!

 

[Deleted member 1147]

I think the main thing to remember is that no one knows anything, other than Monaghan, Pelley and the chief Saudi.

Anything posted on here with details, predictions etc from twitter instagram, people's imaginations is assumed and/or made up.

 

[sweaty sock]

In the real world if you’re in charge of paint at homebase and B&Q offer you triple wages to run their paint section but you turn it down (for whatever reason)
Then B&Q buys homebase but doesn’t change the sign on the door… should ‘paint guy’ expect compensation for the ‘lost’ triple wages?

But the guys affected don’t live in the real world so my analogy means naff all really

Unless the paint guy was so well known and talented that his being there accounted for a significant portion of b and q's profit. And if he were to leave and say to amateur painting many customers would never set foot in b and q again...

Didnt tiger and rory have a stadium gig....

 

[Backsticks]

The BIG question remains why now ?

It would seem that it simply came down to deeper pockets from the PIF.

JM once said if this is an arms race and the weapons of choice are dollar bills then we cant compete.

The legal fees of years of drawn out legal battles and the sponsors already maxed out meant that the tour was ultimately going to struggle to maintain purses to keep their top players engaged .

We all need to wait and see in the next 3 weeks what they are going to announce as a schedule for 2024 under this new tour banner.

Golf But Louder events are going to be part of that schedule as the team franchises have already been confirmed as being part of the new tour set up.
I dont see the range goats playing in PGAT events so Liv style events have to be part of it going forward with probably a rebrand.

The question is how many and when/where are they played ?
We can all speculate on that but until its announced nobody has any idea.

Liv have got everything they wanted, a place at the top table of golf, Players got their huge payouts, looks like they will be able to play other tours as free agents, their product shown on major PGAT TV networks, Team franchises some players have equity in are now far more attractive to potential investors due to extra exposure.

Imagine for a second if Brooks convinced Rory to join Smash GC (Give him equity in the team), that would be Nike's 2 major players and perfect for Swoosh GC.

Unbelievable unprecedented times for golf, the next month is going to be rough for the PGAT players because right now other than securing a PGAT future its less obvious of the real upside for their players.
You can see this in the player interviews, the PGAT players all look pissed and the Liv golfers look like the cat that got the cream.

Of course they look like cats : they have gotten back to the PGAT !

 

[Deleted member 29109]

I wonder how much of the funding that was going into getting various YouTubers and Twiter channels do do LiV PR will now stop? Surely there is no need for it now

 

[Backsticks]

They clearly put value on certain areas of what LIV was doing though - mainly playing in different areas around the world. I think that's smart too! Growing the global game and not just America.

I think there's no doubt LIV in itself is done but its pretty clear the team element is going to transfer to some new events or something. Quite intrigued about how they achieve it!

It will die a death even on the PGAT. Its an illconceived nonsense that has to place in golf.
Once all the big players are back playing individual golf against each other nobody will care about manufactured Scratchems beating the Blankers or whatever.

 

[r0wly86]

I just don't get the team aspect

it doesn't work for me. Team either have to have a geographical context so people support their local team, or have to have a historical aspect, like people supporting Ferrari in F1

It just doesn't seem to work with contrived teams in golf

 

[Deleted member 29109]

I think the main thing to remember is that no one knows anything, other than Monaghan, Pelley and the chief Saudi.

Anything posted on here with details, predictions etc from twitter instagram, people's imaginations is assumed and/or made up.

This is the amusing thing. People seem to take some of it as gospel and lap it up.

There was a lot of Twitter accounts set up in 2021/22 pretending to provide a balanced view, but we’re clearly pushing the LiV agenda and speculating/making stuff up as though they were getting information from official sources.

 

[Beezerk]

I’m still trying to work out what the new tour will be called, best I’ve come up with so far is PLIVFAGT

 

[Hobbit]

I’m still trying to work out what the new tour will be called, best I’ve come up with so far is PLIVFAGT

You can get cream from the chemists for that!

 

[Bdill93]

I’m still trying to work out what the new tour will be called, best I’ve come up with so far is PLIVFAGT

World Golf Tour or something that boring I would bet

 

[Deleted member 21445]

A lot stuff that where as with anything is pretty unknown

The telling line was that they would evaluate LIV golf after this season

Yet you are going full blown franchises and LIV events being on the PGAT media deals etc


The LiV golfers may well be a bit jubilant at the moment but nothing has changed for them and before anything changes they need to process back into the main tours - that could cost them , many could end up in the lower level tours , it’s a long way from declaring any victory

It’s worth remembering that the deal being done is between PIF and PGAT - none of the LIV top table were involved.

There is every chance that the “evaluation” could be to just stop LIV after this season

It’s a prob more realistic idea that PIF have got into main level golf now they don’t need LIV and Greg Norman’s plans - they will only need to put money into the new “commercial entity” -there was no talk of a new “tour” just commercial joining of PIF and PGAT.

When the statement only guarantees LIV events for this season I would use that to open a few eyes

Have to go with whats in the official statement Phil.
So best to deal with facts that have been announced officially so far

"There will be separate event oversight to create cohesive schedules"
Separate meaning 72 hole PGAT events and 54 Hole Liv style events ?

"We are pleased to move forward in step with Liv"
"There is no question that the LIV model has been positively transformational for golf"
In step is not a phrase meaning stop

"This new model combines the DP World tour and Liv Tour including the team golf concept"
Team golf in regular PGAT events , i cant believe that for a second so has to be liv style events for this team concept to continue.


We can only base things on the official facts we have as of now and that suggests and as reported by all the media so far that Liv style events are going to continue within the new tour structure in some way.

I fully understand given your previous stance that this is not what you want and the way this has played out has been disappointing but lets wait and see what comes out in the official tour schedule announcement.
Long way to go yet as the PGAT has to find a way to appease its members who are quite clearly very unhappy with this current situation.

 

[Slab]

I’m still trying to work out what the new tour will be called, best I’ve come up with so far is PLIVFAGT

I reckon it'll be the YCHYCAEIT Tour

Spoiler: spoiler

You Can Have Your Cake And Eat It Too

 

[Deleted member 1147]

I’m still trying to work out what the new tour will be called, best I’ve come up with so far is PLIVFAGT

I imagine something exciting like "PGA tour (but louder)"

 

[Barking_Mad]

As long as there’s decent golf on the TV, does it really matter? I quite often put the golf on and don’t know just which tour I’m watching at first. Isn’t that what we’re all interested in, watching decent golf?

Quite who is wringing their hands or beating their chest is irrelevant to me. DP, PGAT, Korn Ferry or National Express coach tours, I just want to see good golf.

Entirely depends where you draw the line between what you're watching and what's financially behind it. It's clear some funding is not acceptable publicly (ie Russian), whereas Saudi funding just about passes the test. (unfortunately in my view)