Am I missing something... HCP question?

[Five&One]

Still with you? I'm afraid I'm not. If he were submitting a card for an initial handicap, then scores over 7 at a par 5 would be reduced to double bogey 7. Once the player has a handicap that gives him a stroke at that hole, gross scores over 8 would be reduced to a net double bogey 8. That's the bit that I think Davey is finding difficult. A net double bogey is the lowest score which would result in the player getting no stableford points. Had he scored a gross 7, with his stroke he would be gaining a point.

For the purposes of scoring from your handicap you are correct, obviously. If he takes an 8 and has a stroke, thats a net 7 and doesnt score. If he takes a 7 and has a stroke that a net bogy and he scores a point.

However his gross triple bogey and above is taken as a gross double bogey for the purposes of assessing his handicap or altering it.

For the purposes of initial handicap and alteration of existing handicap they take the gross score with anything above a double rounded down to a double and your h/cap is based on your gross adjusted score versus the SSS of the course.

Sorry maybe I am not getting what part the OP didnt understand. ?? I looked at it like he didnt quite get the fairness and the thinking behind being able to score the same double bogey ( for handicap purposes) for taking 7 shots as you would if you took 12 shots. Something to be said for that I suppose, although overall I think CONGU is brilliantly concepted and achieves what it sets out to achieve.

 

[chellie]

You certainly should. The handicapping system is intended to encourage not intimidate. It allows us all to play each other on a fairly even basis whatever our standard. Get a handicap and you can get the enjoyment of playing in competitions at your club which means getting to know more people and generally getting the best pleasure out of your golf. It matters not a bit if you start on 36. I don't expect you would be alone. Besides, you might be pleasantly surprised at what your initial handicap turns out to be.

I second that, you should definitely get your cards in. Whatever handicap you end up with, you won't be the first person who ever had it, so there's nothing to worry about. And as Colin says, you can then enter comps, meet people, and maximise the fun you get out of the game.

And the more you play, the more likely you'll be to experience the buzz of seeing your handicap come down

Weather permitting I should be playing 9 with an ex Lady Captain tomorrow afternoon so will see what she says about my game.

 

[duncan mackie]

.... I feel its not fair on myself to base my HCP on golf in those conditions. Although the final score was good it should have probably have been a PB.

Davey - one final point; your handicap will only be based on the best card you put in...so just get 3 in and don't worry about the conditions or anything else now. In one way the only thing not to do is be selective - you should just set out to put in 3 cards and do it 'whatever'!

 

[Colin L]

For the purposes of scoring from your handicap you are correct, obviously. If he takes an 8 and has a stroke, thats a net 7 and doesnt score. If he takes a 7 and has a stroke that a net bogy and he scores a point.

However his 8 is taken as a double bogey for the purposes of assessing his handicap or altering it.

For the purposes of initial handicap and alteration of existing handicap they take the gross score with anything above a double rounded down to a double and your h/cap is based on your gross adjusted score versus the SSS of the course.

Sorry, you are wrong and this is just going to confuse the OP even further. There is a difference, as has been said more than once in the thread, between the calculation of an initial handicap and the calculation of adjustments to an existing handicap.

For the allocation of a handicap, any score more than a double bogey is reduced to a double bogey. Thus
6 or more at a par 3 will count as 5
7 or more at a par 4 will count as 6
8 or more at a par 5 will count as 7

For the adjustment of an existing handicap, scores are reduced to a net double bogey which is the lowest score which, if any strokes you are due are taken off, would not earn any stableford points.

Thus
if you do not have any strokes at a hole, your gross score is reduced to a double bogey as above

if you do have a stroke at a hole, your gross score is reduced to one more than a gross double bogey
If you have 2 strokes at a hole, your gross score is reduced to two more than a gross double bogey
So with one stroke:
7 or more at a par 3 is reduced to 6
8 or more at a par 4 is reduced to 7
9 or more at a par 5 is reduced to 8

A net double bogey is a double bogey plus any strokes allocated to you at that hole.

 

[Five&One]

Sorry, you are wrong and this is just going to confuse the OP even further. There is a difference, as has been said more than once in the thread, between the calculation of an initial handicap and the calculation of adjustments to an existing handicap.

For the allocation of a handicap, any score more than a double bogey is reduced to a double bogey. Thus
6 or more at a par 3 will count as 5
7 or more at a par 4 will count as 6
8 or more at a par 5 will count as 7

For the adjustment of an existing handicap, scores are reduced to a net double bogey which is the lowest score which, if any strokes you are due are taken off, would not earn any stableford points.

Thus
if you do not have any strokes at a hole, your gross score is reduced to a double bogey as above

if you do have a stroke at a hole, your gross score is reduced to one more than a gross double bogey
If you have 2 strokes at a hole, your gross score is reduced to two more than a gross double bogey
So with one stroke:
7 or more at a par 3 is reduced to 6
8 or more at a par 4 is reduced to 7
9 or more at a par 5 is reduced to 8

A net double bogey is a double bogey plus any strokes allocated to you at that hole.

This means I can play two identical rounds at the same course yet my handicap can go up because of the different way of calculating and allowing for high scores at individual holes ? Can't be right that but you sound sure of your ground so guess you must be bang on.

 

[duncan mackie]

This means I can play two identical rounds at the same course yet my handicap can go up because of the different way of calculating and allowing for high scores at individual holes ? Can't be right that but you sound sure of your ground so guess you must be bang on.

I think you are reading Colin's post incorrectly - once you have a handicap, for the purpose of adjusting that handicap the stableford adjustment will always be applied in the same way relative to the stroke index of holes; to a nett double bogey for your handicap.

When you are allocated a handicap the presumption is that you are a scratch golfer and any adjustments will be to a gross double bogey.

 

[upsidedown]

HiD did her first card for UK handicap today and had gross 109 with adjustments and a SSS of 73 she would have handicap of 32 ( not withstanding any lower ones to come ). Her handicap in NZ was 28 so pretty good for first outing

 

[Val]

Handicap will have to be based your round as a whole based on SSS or CSS if you played in a comp for HC purposes. Surely you cannot make the proper stableford adjustments if you don't have a handicap?

Don't worry about blobs for now, get your cards in and let the HC sec sort it.

Chances are shooting what you did you'll be off 18 max.

 

[Val]

This means I can play two identical rounds at the same course yet my handicap can go up because of the different way of calculating and allowing for high scores at individual holes ? Can't be right that but you sound sure of your ground so guess you must be bang on.

You misunderstand, the way of calculating doesn't change. If stroke index 1 is a par 4 a double bogey is a 6 (yes?) if you play off a 10 HC you get a stroke here so worst case is shooting 7 for net 6 which is still a blob anyway but technically you cannot shoot more than a 7, this means you cannot blow all of your HC at 1 hole (unless you play off 2 or less I suppose).

 

[rosecott]

This means I can play two identical rounds at the same course yet my handicap can go up because of the different way of calculating and allowing for high scores at individual holes ? Can't be right that but you sound sure of your ground so guess you must be bang on.

I assume that by “identical rounds” you mean 2 rounds with the same gross/nett medal scores with the scores on individual holes differing. If that was what you meant, for handicap adjustment purposes, the scores for the two rounds could have quite different end results.

Here’s an example based on an 18 handicapper on a Par 72/SSS 72 course, assuming CSS will be the same as SSS:

Round 1 – scores 14 bogeys and 4 double bogeys, result – nett 76, handicap increases by 0.1 as outside buffer zone.

Round 2 – scores 10 bogeys, a par, 4 birdies in a row, has a nightmare finish with 9s on the last three holes (par 3 and two par 4s), result – nett 76, handicap reduced by 0.9 as the stableford equivalent is 39 points as opposed to 32 points in round 1.

 

[Five&One]

Looks like I am in Davey's camp then. Everything I read and everyone I asked sold it to me as a much MUCH simpler process than it actually is.

 

[Colin L]

It can be a very simple process - put your scores in the club computer and let it work it out for you :thup:
I expect once you get the hang of it, it will seem a lot simpler than it is seems at the moment.

 

[Five&One]

It can be a very simple process - put your scores in the club computer and let it work it out for you :thup:
I expect once you get the hang of it, it will seem a lot simpler than it is seems at the moment.

I will make a point of familiarising myself with the maths the next time I get cut (dont hold your breath)