Advantages for the flag being left in / out ?

Swinglowandslow

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I think touching a flag stick is the least of my worries. Every day people touch door handles, rails, products in shops, endless touching of various inanimate objects. Do they instantly go and wash their hands now after each contact? Do you take a out a golf flag stick and then lick your fingers? It isn't really an issue in the grand scheme of things.
Oh, I agree it isn't likely enough to get overly worried about, but the possibility hasn't gone away. Some surfaces I do touch prompt me to gel my hands, though.😀
 

D-S

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There are definitely surfaces I think we all regret touching at times and definitely need a bit of gel afterwards :LOL:
Pin - no, rake - no but the toilet door in the clubhouse - yes, the clubhouse door - yes, the changing room door - yes etc.
I think we lost a little perspective in an albeit tragic time.
 

Lord Tyrion

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Pin - no, rake - no but the toilet door in the clubhouse - yes, the clubhouse door - yes, the changing room door - yes etc.
I think we lost a little perspective in an albeit tragic time.
Exactly the types of surfaces I was meaning. Throw in a service station door or two :sick:.............. Agreed
 

Backsticks

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No. I would just pick the ball up, bit less distance to bend down which at my age is important.:LOL:
All of the ball must be below the surface even if stuck against the flagstick. If it isnt, it isnt holed. And if it doesnt drop when you move the flag, you have to hole it out for another stroke. I prefer to hear it rattle to the bottom to be sure.....
 

D-S

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All of the ball must be below the surface even if stuck against the flagstick. If it isnt, it isnt holed. And if it doesnt drop when you move the flag, you have to hole it out for another stroke. I prefer to hear it rattle to the bottom to be sure.....
Errr…….no.
13.3c
If any part of the ball is in the hole below the surface of the putting green, the ball is treated as holed even if the entire ball is not below the surface.”
 

Lord Tyrion

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All of the ball must be below the surface even if stuck against the flagstick. If it isnt, it isnt holed. And if it doesnt drop when you move the flag, you have to hole it out for another stroke. I prefer to hear it rattle to the bottom to be sure.....
It only has to be 1mm below the level, as per the post above. 1mm is a nominal number but that was the number given to me at the rules night I attended when the recent batch of amendments came in.
 

Backsticks

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Thanks. Is that since the 2019 rules ? And does it only apply if resting against the flagstick ? (ie it doesnt apply to a ball stuck overhanging the hole even if the 1mm can be seen below the surface ?

Out of the game for a couole of years - must start playing the same rules as the rest of you...
 

Backache

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Thanks. Is that since the 2019 rules ? And does it only apply if resting against the flagstick ? (ie it doesnt apply to a ball stuck overhanging the hole even if the 1mm can be seen below the surface ?

Out of the game for a couole of years - must start playing the same rules as the rest of you...
It is only if it is against the flagstick.
 

jim8flog

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All of the ball must be below the surface even if stuck against the flagstick. If it isnt, it isnt holed. And if it doesnt drop when you move the flag, you have to hole it out for another stroke. I prefer to hear it rattle to the bottom to be sure.....
As others have already said you clearly have not noted the change in the Rules in 2019

to Quote
Rule 13.2c

c. Ball Resting against Flagstick in Hole
If a player’s ball comes to rest against the flagstick left in the hole:
• If any part of the ball is in the hole below the surface of the putting green, the ball is treated as holed even if the entire ball is not below the surface.
 

Foxholer

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Errr…….no.
13.3c
If any part of the ball is in the hole below the surface of the putting green, the ball is treated as holed even if the entire ball is not below the surface.”
Minor correction... 13.2c
 
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Thanks. Is that since the 2019 rules ? And does it only apply if resting against the flagstick ? (ie it doesnt apply to a ball stuck overhanging the hole even if the 1mm can be seen below the surface ?

Out of the game for a couole of years - must start playing the same rules as the rest of you...
Think about it - if a stationary ball is merely overhanging the hole, then none of it can be below the level of the lip of the hole. The only time any of a stationary ball can be below the level of the of the hole, is when the centre line of the ball has passed beyond the hole edge. In those circumstances, the only thing preventing the ball dropping further is the flagstick. (If you're not convinced, try placing a ball on the edge of a table)
 

Jason.H

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Personally I find I get a better distance perspective on longer puts if the flag is in. I could put with the flag in most of the time except for when the flag casts a shadow on my line which is moving by the wind or the flag is leaning toward me.
 

Backache

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Think about it - if a stationary ball is merely overhanging the hole, then none of it can be below the level of the lip of the hole. The only time any of a stationary ball can be below the level of the of the hole, is when the centre line of the ball has passed beyond the hole edge. In those circumstances, the only thing preventing the ball dropping further is the flagstick. (If you're not convinced, try placing a ball on the edge of a table)
Snail sitting just inside the cup would do it, but the scenarios where this type of thing might happen are rare. Though I seem to remember one of the decisions on rules being about whether a ball had come to rest in a cup when a frog jumped out with it on its back.
 

Orikoru

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MyGolfSpy have either updated or re-done their testing, documented on a video I just watched:

I was playing with a +1.5 handicapper on the weekend and he was adamant the flag keeps the ball out, and he always putted with the flag out, so this piqued my interest in the whole subject again. But that video again seems to prove that keeping it in produces the best results. One thing they don't account for is wind and flags leaning one way or the other, but otherwise their testing is quite conclusive. Even ones not in the centre of the cup seem to be aided by the flag, which I found surprising.
 
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