World Handicap System

[Jamesbrown]

How will this work at clubs that don't have a PSI system?
There could dozens of cards coming in every day and someone needs to process them...
If you have a computer system that players use, it will be fairly easy. Sign in to confirm the round will count, input the scores after the round, just like a comp, and let the computer do its thing. But what if the computer is down? Ours was for 3 days last month...
But with no PSI system - who does it?
It will need someone present virtually every day to get the cards processed. Leave it a couple of days and you might have a days work.
The impact on smaller clubs could be huge...
The new system also means that people don't have to play competitions. They can get their handicap from more relaxed, albeit still mildly competitive games.
It will also bring in the possibility of playing to an incorrect handicap as it could change after every round
At the moment you can calculate your own cut against SSS if you've put in a good score - allowing you to play off, potentially, your new handicap before the card is processed. With the new system, if your card isn't processed on the same day, with this "massaging" calculation, you'll have no idea what you'll be playing off next game..
A lot of questions but not many real answers.....
Interesting times ahead

App on your phone in the states or computer. So maybe that way? But clubs (and players) have two years to implement and modernise and get a basic terminal for daily score inputs, and to receive their handicap for the day.

Assuming we get more with the times and the USGA way.

 

[jim8flog]

Why? Net double bogey is the highest counting score.

Because virtually every single swindle I play in allows 'gimmes' and if the players want the cards to count for handicap purposes they will have to putt out

 

[r0wly86]

App on your phone in the states or computer. So maybe that way? But clubs (and players) have two years to implement and modernise and get a basic terminal for daily score inputs, and to receive their handicap for the day.

Assuming we get more with the times and the USGA way.

I was always pretty sceptical about changing, but the more I look into and read about the USPGA handicap system the more it makes sense.

As a junior my course wouldn't be described as hard, but it was very difficult to score around. Meaning our handicaps were always a couple shots higher than our peers on different courses. Whilst of course this benefited us in club matches and the leagues it highlights where the US system is better.

By having a handicap index and slope rating, every course you play your handicap will for that course will be about right. Whereas those who play off 6 on a flat, open course with no hazards get a shock when they play a tough links or a course with lots of water.

As for putting in for every round, it will be strange to start with. But I think it won't take long for it to become the norm, by 2022 will be wondering what all the fuss was about. As for manipulating your handicap, there was a good thread on wrx that explained the differences and it seems that the US system generally create lower handicaps than the UK system so take that however you like.

 

[r0wly86]

Because virtually every single swindle I play in allows 'gimmes' and if the players want the cards to count for handicap purposes they will have to putt out

According to the USPGA rules, for a card to count you have to play at least 7 holes within the laws for a 9 hole submission and 13 holes for an 18 hole submission. So if on some holes you don't hole out according to the USPGA you should record a net par.

But if they are genuine gimmes, say within 3 feet, they should be simple putts anyway. Just get in the habit of holing out

 

[jim8flog]

Can't say i'm over the moon by this move. Guys i've seen play who already use this system had vastly inaccurate handicaps compared with ability. Plus what happens at the clubs where you could in effect be on winter greens for 5 months with a vastly shorter course.

At the moment we have a comp handicap, so are going to move to a social handicap ?

Also this system looks like its easier to manipulate. at the moment 8 bad scores could mean your handicap only really goes up a shot in that time, whats going to happen here, going from 10 to 20 in the same time?

If there are more than 2 temporary greens the card cannot be used for handicap purposes. At least that is the rule at present.

 

[jim8flog]

According to the USPGA rules, for a card to count you have to play at least 7 holes within the laws for a 9 hole submission and 13 holes for an 18 hole submission. So if on some holes you don't hole out according to the USPGA you should record a net par.

But if they are genuine gimmes, say within 3 feet, they should be simple putts anyway. Just get in the habit of holing out

But what if the 'gimme' putt was for a gross birdie.

 

[r0wly86]

But what if the 'gimme' putt was for a gross birdie.

Then hole it out. As I say if it is a genuine gimme, not a very generous one. Then people should be able to hole it anyway (otherwise it shouldn't be a gimme) it won't take long to hole a gimme length putt. Again it's just about getting into the habit

 

[patricks148]

sounds like it will prob slow play down a bit if all of a sudden scores that weren't counted before suddenly do, with more people putting social cards in as well

 

[Khamelion]

Can't say i'm over the moon by this move. Guys i've seen play who already use this system had vastly inaccurate handicaps compared with ability. Plus what happens at the clubs where you could in effect be on winter greens for 5 months with a vastly shorter course.

At the moment we have a comp handicap, so are going to move to a social handicap ?

Also this system looks like its easier to manipulate. at the moment 8 bad scores could mean your handicap only really goes up a shot in that time, whats going to happen here, going from 10 to 20 in the same time?

My old club had a Winter Comp HC, as none of the competitions played were qualifiers, and during the wetter winter months when the course was open, the course was shorter, off winter tees played to winter greens, sometimes off mats, other times teed up on the fairway, or the ball moved to play from the semi, that lot is hardly a reflection of competitive golf appropriate for HC calculation.

 

[Crazyface]

This has all been thought up by bean counters sitting behind desks with no idea about the real world. Just ignore it. Totally unenforceable.

 

[r0wly86]

This has all been thought up by bean counters sitting behind desks with no idea about the real world. Just ignore it. Totally unenforceable.

It's the system used by the majority of the world's golfers. It must work reasonably well if different to our system

 

[Deleted Member 1156]

This has all been thought up by bean counters sitting behind desks with no idea about the real world. Just ignore it. Totally unenforceable.

Not sure why you think that when this system has been in place in the USA for years.

 

[rosecott]

This has all been thought up by bean counters sitting behind desks with no idea about the real world. Just ignore it. Totally unenforceable.

That's just what this thread needs - a cutting edge insight.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

Presumably your clubs PSI will need to be loaded with every other club card in the country? For example if I play a round away at The Belfry I will need to input the round when I return to my home club. To do that I will need to bring up the Belfry on our computer. Is that correct? Alternatively, would I input it into the computer at The Belfry and start by giving my CDH number?

 

[Cols_Ears]

I know most people don't like change, and this will certainly change the way handicaps are calculated and viewed for everyone in the UK. I've always liked the CONGU system, but at the current time in my life (family and work getting in the way of golf, and I'm now a member of a club which has less comps) I'm struggling to play many medal rounds - last year I only managed 4! So for me I am starting to think this is a pretty good system, it will mean that we have handicaps that are more "current" and keep pace with seasonal variations in our games.

There seems to be a lot of people complaining they want to play social games without the "pressure" of having a card - As someone already mentioned after a while this attitude will change as we come to view it differently, and the pressure of a medal will decrease dramatically as it will be just another round. As for gimmies - surely by definition they are normally only for putts that you have a very good chance of holing anyway and in the games I play always inside 3', I hole about 95% of putts from that length and it doesn't normally involve more than a few seconds - so the pace of play argument doesn't work for me.

All courses in the world will now need to be rated and have a slope index - all the courses in Scotland already have this. Each set of tees has an individual course rating and slope index which is more detailed than our existing SSS. For instance on my course the Yellow Tees have a course rating of 71.8 and a slope of 138 (71/138) White is 73/141 and Blue is 74.8/144 - all to a par of 71. The slope index for a course of average difficulty is 113 - this is a key number.

As I understand it each counting score differential (of the 8 from 20) is based on the following calc; Score - Course rating *(113/ Slope Index).

eg Suppose I shot 79 from the whites My scorring differential would be 79 - 73 * (113/141) = 4.8
then I shot 80 from the blues 80-74.8 * (113/144) = 4.1

Do this for your best 8 rounds (on whatever course or tee you have played) take the average and you end up with your handicap. This does not take account of weather or CSS of course - not sure how they are going to include this yet and the fact they haven't told us I guess they haven't bottomed it out either.

The application of your handicap on courses other than your home course is another subject, but again involves using the slope index adjustment to account for easier or more difficult courses...

I think this combined with the proposed simplified rules is progression forwards. I'm sure there will be a lot of disagreement, but it's going to happen whether we like it or not.

 

[DCB]

Keep it on track gents, not pops at other forum users please.

 

[Deleted member 15717]

I just did a very rough calculation from my last 20 competition scores, and took the best 8. Averaged out, against par, I would be off 7 (if that is how it is worked out). I am currently off 6, so the differential isn't too great whatsoever. Funky!

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Mine would drop to 3.1

If added in social rounds then it would drop to 2

 

[rulefan]

You'd be better off bringing in a better course rating system prior to bringing in a uniform handicapping system.

The current system just doesn't work.

A new course rating system is in the process of being introduced. It is the one used everywhere else in the world except by England men.

 

[rulefan]

This does not take account of weather or CSS of course - not sure how they are going to include this yet and the fact they haven't told us I guess they haven't bottomed it out either.

CSS as such will go. It will be the differential between the (net double bogey) score, slope adjusted handicap and the course rating that produces the answer.
There will be a potential for an abnormal course/weather conditions adjustment (likely to be small) as in Australia but the math hasn't been finalised.