WHS & ISV Issues (Please post only if you are a handicap secretary or involved in admin at your club)

[rulefan]

We held a ladies competition yesterday, with 2 holes excluded due to maintenance. The scores went through to the database, and all totals were replaced by an asterisk. However, the score differentials are showing as 0.0, and handicap indices have not been updated a day later. Hopefully this can be sorted asap.

What was entered (into the ISV software) by the players for the unplayed holes?

 

[YandaB]

We held a ladies competition yesterday, with 2 holes excluded due to maintenance. The scores went through to the database, and all totals were replaced by an asterisk. However, the score differentials are showing as 0.0, and handicap indices have not been updated a day later. Hopefully this can be sorted asap.

I like the Asterisks, clearly shows on the Score Listing by Day which numpties have forgotten to use NS and used NR insted. or worse, guessed at a number.

 

[fenwayrich]

What was entered (into the ISV software) by the players for the unplayed holes?

The software (Club Systems) allows holes to be designated out of play, so the players only had to enter scores for the 16 holes that they played. The two unplayed holes were left blank and show as * on WHS. The total also shows as * and the score differential is 0.0.

 

[rosecott]

I did a simple test submitting one pair of scores through IG and the players appeared to be reversed on WHS, resulting in the counting hole flags being incorrect and the exceptional score counting against the wrong player.

I have now had the scorecard for the 4BBB. If you haven’t had the need to go through the process shown in Rule 5.10 – I hadn’t and shouldn’t have to since that is the job of WHS – this what you have to do if you feel the need to check if the WHS calculation is or isn’t correct.

Rewrite a scorecard using the gross scores shown. Using the full Course Handicap for both players rather than the 85% for the comp, calculate the stableford points for each player and the pair. If the resultant score for the pair is 42 points or better, you then look at any player with 9 or more scores counting. For that player, on each hole she had no score recorded, you add 1.5 points if the partner scored or 1 point if neither player scored.

Having done that, I reckoned that the 9+ partner ended up with 35.5 points rounded down to 35 and, since 1st April, that is playing 1 stroke worse than playing to handicap. However, the score showing on the player’s WHS record is an adjusted gross 93 against CR 71.3 giving SD of 19.2 against the player’s HI of 25.6. I have no idea how 93 was derived but this makes no sense when the calculation of stableford points above shows the player scoring worse than handicap.

I have asked WHS via County Union for an explanation and Handicapmaster is also submitting it as an issue quoting the player’s scorecard.

 

[Oldbutwise]

I have now had the scorecard for the 4BBB. If you haven’t had the need to go through the process shown in Rule 5.10 – I hadn’t and shouldn’t have to since that is the job of WHS – this what you have to do if you feel the need to check if the WHS calculation is or isn’t correct.

Rewrite a scorecard using the gross scores shown. Using the full Course Handicap for both players rather than the 85% for the comp, calculate the stableford points for each player and the pair. If the resultant score for the pair is 42 points or better, you then look at any player with 9 or more scores counting. For that player, on each hole she had no score recorded, you add 1.5 points if the partner scored or 1 point if neither player scored.

Having done that, I reckoned that the 9+ partner ended up with 35.5 points rounded down to 35 and, since 1st April, that is playing 1 stroke worse than playing to handicap. However, the score showing on the player’s WHS record is an adjusted gross 93 against CR 71.3 giving SD of 19.2 against the player’s HI of 25.6. I have no idea how 93 was derived but this makes no sense when the calculation of stableford points above shows the player scoring worse than handicap.

I have asked WHS via County Union for an explanation and Handicapmaster is also submitting it as an issue quoting the player’s scorecard.

I think your points allocation in para 2 is wrong - see 2024 Rules of handicapping page 68.
Should be add 1.5 points if partner scores 2 or better, add 1 point if partner scores 1 point and add zero if neither score.

 

[rosecott]

I think your points allocation in para 2 is wrong - see 2024 Rules of handicapping page 68.
Should be add 1.5 points if partner scores 2 or better, add 1 point if partner scores 1 point and add zero if neither score.

You are, of course correct. I did my calculations correctly according to the Rules as you mentioned. I did, however, write my post off the top of my head without checking the wording on the document. It has been a hard day and I have more to post about my further exchanges with the County Union WHS man and Handicapmaster. I won't be posting until my head is clear.

Just one thing I learned though. If you have an entry on the player's record such as I had with the 4BBB lady, if you click on "edit", then click on "save", a pop-up box appears with an explanation. More on this later.

 

[wjemather]

Apparently, dotgolf should have the problem with Expected Scores, that is affecting score differentials when 10-17 holes are played, fixed by the weekend.
9-hole scores are unaffected by the problem.

 

[D-S]

The advice for clubs with erroneous 10-17 hole scores is to mark them as matchplay for the time being and when EG announce that the problem has been fixed to convert them back.

 

[wjemather]

I'm hearing that Expected Scores are now fixed, although any existing scores may need re-saving.

 

[D-S]

I'm hearing that Expected Scores are now fixed, although any existing scores may need re-saving.

There seem to be quite a few clubs who still have problems.

 

[wjemather]

Another question for those using IG...

General Play score intents generated via IG are not showing on the WHS Platform, either in the report or the individual handicap record - I know they exist because EG's automated process is sending emails and applying Penalty Scores when they go unfulfilled. Is anyone else aware/seeing this, or is it just me?

We recently moved from ClubV1, for which the intents were visible and manageable on the WHS Platform. MyEG generated intents are still showing up fine so it's clearly not a general issue.

 

[D-S]

Another question for those using IG...

General Play score intents generated via IG are not showing on the WHS Platform, either in the report or the individual handicap record - I know they exist because EG's automated process is sending emails and applying Penalty Scores when they go unfulfilled. Is anyone else aware/seeing this, or is it just me?

We recently moved from ClubV1, for which the intents were visible and manageable on the WHS Platform. MyEG generated intents are still showing up fine so it's clearly not a general issue.

Sorry to go off on a slight tangent on your request - does EG's automated process, emails and auto penalty score, happen based on unsatisfied score intents created by ISV apps etc. or just when the EG APP is used to create the intent?

 

[wjemather]

Sorry to go off on a slight tangent on your request - does EG's automated process, emails and auto penalty score, happen based on unsatisfied score intents created by ISV apps etc. or just when the EG APP is used to create the intent?

The automated process doesn't discriminate and deals with any unfulfilled GP intents, irrespective of their origin.

 

[Tractor Wheal]

Another question for those using IG...

General Play score intents generated via IG are not showing on the WHS Platform, either in the report or the individual handicap record - I know they exist because EG's automated process is sending emails and applying Penalty Scores when they go unfulfilled. Is anyone else aware/seeing this, or is it just me?

We recently moved from ClubV1, for which the intents were visible and manageable on the WHS Platform. MyEG generated intents are still showing up fine so it's clearly not a general issue.

I can't comment on IG but imagine it will be similar ....
The same is true for V1 since April 1st. The unsatisfied intents are only shown at the bottom of General Play Rounds.

Two places to manage it = no extra work.

 

[wjemather]

I can't comment on IG but imagine it will be similar ....
The same is true for V1 since April 1st. The unsatisfied intents are only shown at the bottom of General Play Rounds.

Are you saying that intents generated by ClubV1 stopped being visible (and manageable) on the WHS Platform on April 1st?

I'm also curious to know how other ISVs (HandicapMaster, Golf Genius, etc.) function in this regard pre/post April 1st?

 

[Tractor Wheal]

Are you saying that intents generated by ClubV1 stopped being visible (and manageable) on the WHS Platform on April 1st?

I'm also curious to know how other ISVs (HandicapMaster, Golf Genius, etc.) function in this regard pre/post April 1st?

Yes.

 

[wjemather]

Yes.

Ok. I can't imagine that functionality was consciously/deliberately removed, so assume it is (another) software problem.

 

[Tractor Wheal]

Let us hope you are correct. If not, as a fellow hcap sec said elsewhere, then EG are driving Clubs to push Members to MyEG to get their clicks up.

 

[D-S]

I have now seen a few 4BB scores come through the portal. They have been correct and once you understand how they are displayed they are clear. Also a good information message is displayed explaining why one player’s score is acceptable and one isn’t, as well as the upscaling.

 

[D-S]

On the flip side many clubs are now reporting incorrectly calculated handicaps, on further examination these are all down to the clubs displaying rounded CH on boards and players not realising/knowing that their PH is calculated from an unrounded one.